When do you start using layers (line weight) in autocad? In the preliminary design phase or do you keep everything in one layer (one color) until you start making CD's.
Usually, i sort things out into layers from the get go. saves time from having to go back and rename layers or matchprop the drawing all to hell...but this is assuming the drawing will be relatively complex and be worked on by several people, either via drafting or plotting.
yep, right from the start. we have a prototype drawing set up with all of our layers, dimstyles, drawing symbol blocks, sheets, fonts, units, etc. that we use to begin all drawings.
Do you assign a color to a layer to represent a line weight from the beginning or do you assign the line weight in the layer properties manager when plotting? So, if you want to make windows and doors in an elevation that suppose to appear further than the wall itself, you would probably apply a thin line weight. Let’s say you apply the color red and in the style table manager, red would be a thin line weight, which means every layer that is assigned red will be that particular line weight. Isn’t it a bit difficult and complex to know in advance (in the design phase) what lines should have a certain line weight? Is there an easier method?
i commend you for asking these questions, but to be honest, they're a little bit on the "fundamental" side of drawing representation as a whole. drafting on the computer is no different "fundamentally" than hand drafting. elements interpreted to be in front of others typically have a heavier line. it is much easier to assign colors (which means line weight) to layers than to force a color or line weight to an entity (a big no-no, everything should be bylayer). your standards should have already been developed to determine which colors have which thicknesses (ctb files for AutoCAD).
if you're in an office, this should already be set up for you, if not, then you have much larger problems than colors to layers or layer organization. if you're still in school, do whatever you want as long as it reads the way you want it to.
you should have an office standard plot style that defines lineweights for all of the colors you use. each layer is assigned a color from the get go, in the prototype drawing for example.
i coordinated our layer colors to coincide with lineweight. on a black background (autocad default), the brightest lines carry the heaviest lineweight, and the darker ones are assigned a lighter lineweight. that way, the stronger the line appears against the black background, the stronger it appears on paper.
each set of layers (elevation, section, plan, detail) has a separate line color range to it. elevation lines are all earthtones (tans, grays, browns), sections are blues, plans are yellows, details are greens, notes are reds, and roof plans are purples. this helps to discern drawing from drawing relative to xrefs.
for elevation drawings (sections and details are similar), we use the following layers:
Use layers from the beginning, on every drawing. Templates can be created specifically with your pre set layers.
We prefer the CI/SfB index (Construction Index / Samarbetskommitten for Byggnadsfragor). A system set up by some bored Scandinavians in the late 1950’s, globally acknowledge in the mid 1970’s. Products are also coded accordingly in the UK construction industry trade literature as here.
jaja--I taught CAD fundmentals for a few semesters, and I always encouraged (okay, forced) my students to associate colors and lineweights w/layers in the layer manager. Everyone had to use the same color and weight for A-WALL layer, for instance. Obviously, when they get out into the real world, they will have to adjust to the fact that A-FLOR-HATCH isn't cyan in their office or whatever.
When I came to this office, my boss was assigning lineweights in the way you mention above: all red lines were heavy, all green lines were light, all yellow lines were medium light, etc. He was setting it all up in the .ctb file. Horrible idea, even he wasn't happy with it. I made him a template, set up layers according to AIA standards, and he's good to go now. His life is much easier.
i know its concidered wrong but i just cant help it- does any one else edit the color of a line assigned a different color in order to make it read better thus changing it from "by layer" Someone threatened my life over this but since we never deviated from our office standard ctb and layer set up i didnt see the problem if it looke better and it seems better than having a layer per color for ie a-elev-glaz-1, 2, 3 etc.
even in layer states, i only use those for seting up various drawings, ie floor, clg, elec, etc - color doesnt usually come into play. You ever get that pervert that loves to use oddball colors like mauve that nobody recognizes? Like every layer has to have its own unique color?
evil--we sometimes edit lines individually, but still w/in a system. For instance, our standard glazing layer is magenta, but sometimes we'll change individual lines to red for clarity. We don't stray outside those two colors, though. Standardization = efficient communication.
my office uses the first seven colors and two greys for halftoning. at times there are reasons to manipulate the color of linework at different layer states...
From thin to heavy lineweights
A-1 (Red)
A-2 (Yellow)
A-3 (Green)
A-4 (Cyan)
A-5 (Blue)
A-6 (Magneta)
A-7 (White)
And these two for hatching
A-8 (Gray)
A-9 (Light Gray)
This is all the layer and colors you need. Why, because when you drafted by hand you were limited my the number of pens you had. Also, when you look at the colors offer by AutoCAD, the first 9 colors are the colors listed above. It is a very easy system. You can replace the A (which stands for Architecture) with S (Structure), E (Electircal), M (Mechanical), P (Plumbing), L (Landscape), SEC (Sections), Elev (Elevations), or DET (Details, etc....
Why spent the time with all the rest of the AutoCAD colors. You should stick with the nine different pens / colors. It makes life so easy to jump from project to project and you don't have to reinvent the wheel each time.
So what is the “best†or most used method? Each entity gets a color and the line weight is controlled in the layer properties manager? You’ll have, let say, 10 red color entities, each having their own line weight. Or do you let each color represent a specific line weight so you adjust the layer or entity to that specific line weight, and simply adjust the line weight in the pen assignment table when plotting. In this case, red (for example) gets one line weight so each entity that you want to give that line weight you assign the color red.
I have seen both method used by students at my school, so I guess there is no such thing as the best method.
jaja - how does one look at a drawing with 10 red entities, each having a different lineweight, and know at a glance how it will look plotted. do you have to click on each object and look at the lineweight or somehow memorize it???crazy....
our office uses bylayer as a standard and our layering system is pretty close to 3ifs above.
we use arch desktop - but that's a whole other can of worms to deal with. damn display configurations and representation sets...we're supposed to migrate to ADT 2005 in the next few weeks.
looks like i picked the wrong month to give up sniffing glue.
LA ARCHITEKT has it right, but we also used Tricky's method in another office I worked in. The key is that everyone uses the same method, or working in a team will be torture. Occasionally clients make the job more difficult, demanding exact colors for laptop presentations etc. One thing to be very careful about is Gov't, Federal and Military projects, most require that you use the CADD GIS Standards...which are based on the AIA Layer Guidelines, with a few twists. Since we are an AE firm that uses LA ARCHITEKT's method as a standard, but I introduced Architectural Desktop (and 5 more architects to the firm, now being the only architects), I am in the process of making a hybrid system based on ADT, the number-ending 0, 1, 2, 3, 4 method and GIS / AIA layer-naming. This should be an interesting adventure for me, as I have yet to go back to my Layer Keying manual, but hopefully in the end I'll have a good office standard. I try to get everyone to use the layer standards from the start of each project. Sometimes one has to be strict or the drawings end up a total mess. And for the most part, try to keep things BYLAYER.
thanks tricky - screw desktop. screw archicad. For drafting the 7 color system is the closest to rapiographs and actual "drafting", where someone has to think about making a picture to comunicate. Not that theres not other ways but I have found the "old" way of cad the most effective.
Feb 24, 05 4:13 pm ·
·
Block this user
Are you sure you want to block this user and hide all related comments throughout the site?
Archinect
This is your first comment on Archinect. Your comment will be visible once approved.
When to use layers in autocad?
When do you start using layers (line weight) in autocad? In the preliminary design phase or do you keep everything in one layer (one color) until you start making CD's.
Usually, i sort things out into layers from the get go. saves time from having to go back and rename layers or matchprop the drawing all to hell...but this is assuming the drawing will be relatively complex and be worked on by several people, either via drafting or plotting.
From the very beginning. I'd hate to have to clean up a project at the CD phase--one more crisis waiting to happen.
yep, right from the start. we have a prototype drawing set up with all of our layers, dimstyles, drawing symbol blocks, sheets, fonts, units, etc. that we use to begin all drawings.
Do you assign a color to a layer to represent a line weight from the beginning or do you assign the line weight in the layer properties manager when plotting? So, if you want to make windows and doors in an elevation that suppose to appear further than the wall itself, you would probably apply a thin line weight. Let’s say you apply the color red and in the style table manager, red would be a thin line weight, which means every layer that is assigned red will be that particular line weight. Isn’t it a bit difficult and complex to know in advance (in the design phase) what lines should have a certain line weight? Is there an easier method?
jaja,
i commend you for asking these questions, but to be honest, they're a little bit on the "fundamental" side of drawing representation as a whole. drafting on the computer is no different "fundamentally" than hand drafting. elements interpreted to be in front of others typically have a heavier line. it is much easier to assign colors (which means line weight) to layers than to force a color or line weight to an entity (a big no-no, everything should be bylayer). your standards should have already been developed to determine which colors have which thicknesses (ctb files for AutoCAD).
if you're in an office, this should already be set up for you, if not, then you have much larger problems than colors to layers or layer organization. if you're still in school, do whatever you want as long as it reads the way you want it to.
sorry to be harsh.
you should have an office standard plot style that defines lineweights for all of the colors you use. each layer is assigned a color from the get go, in the prototype drawing for example.
i coordinated our layer colors to coincide with lineweight. on a black background (autocad default), the brightest lines carry the heaviest lineweight, and the darker ones are assigned a lighter lineweight. that way, the stronger the line appears against the black background, the stronger it appears on paper.
each set of layers (elevation, section, plan, detail) has a separate line color range to it. elevation lines are all earthtones (tans, grays, browns), sections are blues, plans are yellows, details are greens, notes are reds, and roof plans are purples. this helps to discern drawing from drawing relative to xrefs.
for elevation drawings (sections and details are similar), we use the following layers:
A-ELEV-HATCH (lightest lines)
A-ELEV-LWT1
A-ELEV-LWT2
A-ELEV-LWT3
A-ELEV-LWT4
A-ELEV-LWT5
A-ELEV-LWT6 (heavy lines)
A-ELEV-HIDD-LWT1 (hidden lines - dashed)
A-ELEV-HIDD-LWT2
A-ELEV-HIDD-LWT3
A-ELEV-PEOPLE
A-ELEV-TREE-LWT1
A-ELEV-TREE-LWT2
A-ELEV-GRADE (heaviest lines)
for plans:
A-WALL-FULL-EXTR
A-WALL-FULL-INTR
A-FLOR-HATCH
A-FLOR-LEVL
A-WDW-FRAME
A-WDW-GLAZ
A-WDW-SILL
A-DOOR
etc...
you should be thinking of lineweight everytime you draw anything in cad, IMO. you need to set up standards from the get-go and follow them.
Use layers from the beginning, on every drawing. Templates can be created specifically with your pre set layers.
We prefer the CI/SfB index (Construction Index / Samarbetskommitten for Byggnadsfragor). A system set up by some bored Scandinavians in the late 1950’s, globally acknowledge in the mid 1970’s. Products are also coded accordingly in the UK construction industry trade literature as here.
Uniclass is the alternative.
Both are good and can cope with all building construction types.
The layer they dont have is '_sketch'. Obivously for sketching, the underscore keeps it to the top of the layer manager.
jaja--I taught CAD fundmentals for a few semesters, and I always encouraged (okay, forced) my students to associate colors and lineweights w/layers in the layer manager. Everyone had to use the same color and weight for A-WALL layer, for instance. Obviously, when they get out into the real world, they will have to adjust to the fact that A-FLOR-HATCH isn't cyan in their office or whatever.
When I came to this office, my boss was assigning lineweights in the way you mention above: all red lines were heavy, all green lines were light, all yellow lines were medium light, etc. He was setting it all up in the .ctb file. Horrible idea, even he wasn't happy with it. I made him a template, set up layers according to AIA standards, and he's good to go now. His life is much easier.
i know its concidered wrong but i just cant help it- does any one else edit the color of a line assigned a different color in order to make it read better thus changing it from "by layer" Someone threatened my life over this but since we never deviated from our office standard ctb and layer set up i didnt see the problem if it looke better and it seems better than having a layer per color for ie a-elev-glaz-1, 2, 3 etc.
i hate bylayer, use it in very specific circumstances, like when creating lman states.
even in layer states, i only use those for seting up various drawings, ie floor, clg, elec, etc - color doesnt usually come into play. You ever get that pervert that loves to use oddball colors like mauve that nobody recognizes? Like every layer has to have its own unique color?
evil--we sometimes edit lines individually, but still w/in a system. For instance, our standard glazing layer is magenta, but sometimes we'll change individual lines to red for clarity. We don't stray outside those two colors, though. Standardization = efficient communication.
my office uses the first seven colors and two greys for halftoning. at times there are reasons to manipulate the color of linework at different layer states...
I use this system:
From thin to heavy lineweights
A-1 (Red)
A-2 (Yellow)
A-3 (Green)
A-4 (Cyan)
A-5 (Blue)
A-6 (Magneta)
A-7 (White)
And these two for hatching
A-8 (Gray)
A-9 (Light Gray)
This is all the layer and colors you need. Why, because when you drafted by hand you were limited my the number of pens you had. Also, when you look at the colors offer by AutoCAD, the first 9 colors are the colors listed above. It is a very easy system. You can replace the A (which stands for Architecture) with S (Structure), E (Electircal), M (Mechanical), P (Plumbing), L (Landscape), SEC (Sections), Elev (Elevations), or DET (Details, etc....
Why spent the time with all the rest of the AutoCAD colors. You should stick with the nine different pens / colors. It makes life so easy to jump from project to project and you don't have to reinvent the wheel each time.
not so complicated
all colors ending with 1 (1, 11, 21, 31.....) same thinkness (heavy)
all colors ending with 2 (2, 12,...... a little bit lighter.
and so on
all colors ending with 0 (10, 20) for some basic color in your drawing
251 - 255 grayshades
So what is the “best†or most used method? Each entity gets a color and the line weight is controlled in the layer properties manager? You’ll have, let say, 10 red color entities, each having their own line weight. Or do you let each color represent a specific line weight so you adjust the layer or entity to that specific line weight, and simply adjust the line weight in the pen assignment table when plotting. In this case, red (for example) gets one line weight so each entity that you want to give that line weight you assign the color red.
I have seen both method used by students at my school, so I guess there is no such thing as the best method.
jaja - how does one look at a drawing with 10 red entities, each having a different lineweight, and know at a glance how it will look plotted. do you have to click on each object and look at the lineweight or somehow memorize it???crazy....
our office uses bylayer as a standard and our layering system is pretty close to 3ifs above.
we use arch desktop - but that's a whole other can of worms to deal with. damn display configurations and representation sets...we're supposed to migrate to ADT 2005 in the next few weeks.
looks like i picked the wrong month to give up sniffing glue.
LA ARCHITEKT has it right, but we also used Tricky's method in another office I worked in. The key is that everyone uses the same method, or working in a team will be torture. Occasionally clients make the job more difficult, demanding exact colors for laptop presentations etc. One thing to be very careful about is Gov't, Federal and Military projects, most require that you use the CADD GIS Standards...which are based on the AIA Layer Guidelines, with a few twists. Since we are an AE firm that uses LA ARCHITEKT's method as a standard, but I introduced Architectural Desktop (and 5 more architects to the firm, now being the only architects), I am in the process of making a hybrid system based on ADT, the number-ending 0, 1, 2, 3, 4 method and GIS / AIA layer-naming. This should be an interesting adventure for me, as I have yet to go back to my Layer Keying manual, but hopefully in the end I'll have a good office standard. I try to get everyone to use the layer standards from the start of each project. Sometimes one has to be strict or the drawings end up a total mess. And for the most part, try to keep things BYLAYER.
thanks tricky - screw desktop. screw archicad. For drafting the 7 color system is the closest to rapiographs and actual "drafting", where someone has to think about making a picture to comunicate. Not that theres not other ways but I have found the "old" way of cad the most effective.
Block this user
Are you sure you want to block this user and hide all related comments throughout the site?
Archinect
This is your first comment on Archinect. Your comment will be visible once approved.