i personally beleive that architecture is more than what we get paid to do(draw details, cad, etc). those things are a side note(or they should be) to the reason we all took up this VERY unique profession. architects and those in this field have the drive, creativity and problem solving skills that make architects a totally different breed of people in comparison. we are a profession that has what Edwin Chan called "duende"(spanish for soul/spirit and also evil mayan midget gods - look it up, it's true). If you can't stand the heat get your ass out the kitchen.....

i think we bitch about it BECAUSE we love it. you only complain about the things you REALLY care about, and discussing a problematic situation can bring about change. About the ivy leagues..... WHO F**KING CARES, i do agree with you on that one.

ok, i'm done with my romaniticized full of shat speech..... sorry.

your very screen name is architorture,
most of the time when people complain to a large group about something they are trying to find comfort....that they are not alone with their problems....it is the idea of all help groups.....I am just saying people need to focus on the possitive aspects of this profession, like the ones you mentioned, I find that the architects I know are more dedicated than any other group. We are dedicated because we love it and must do it. It fills a void, so be HAPPY......i agree discussion helps bring change but those are not the posts i'm talking about.

Thanks Architorture, your insight makes me feel better about bitching.

I think there is another side to the complaints. I for one feel that as compared to my friends I have a more important job and there is no secret that I work harder, longer and have more passion than any of them do.

Then again, I'm paid the least of all them. In the western world money = success and I seem to be losing. Also I've found that most people have such little respect for architects it's amazing. I hate how everyone thinks they can be a designer and will easily criticize our work.

We are a strange people, that's for sure.

drink a beer, do a line and stop bitching

speak for yourself...do you know how easy it is for my to pick op women in their mid 20's (outside of the profession) for falsely claiming to be a real architect?! you have much to learn, grasshopper

I hope you speak better than you type...good idea though...I'm not a CAD monkey I'm a Real Architect

Me happy ----------------------> :-)


:-) in the 'interweb' means happy & joy.


u cannot lie when use :-)-


so :-).



happy.

Here's why I'm depressed today.....

I work in a cubicle. A bad cubicle. Today, the bosses have declared they'll close the office early to take us out for cocktails (first time in years, I'm told) However, I can't join in, because I have an appointment at the chiropractor because my bad cubicle is so unhealthy for me.

On top of that, something stinks in the office today. And the air is not working. My discomfort level is rising. Bids on our biggest project in 3 years came in yesterday close to 40% over budget. Our next biggest project is starting to spin Value Engineering alternates during the bid phase. Value Engineering sucks, and means I have to spend more time in my hot, stinky cubicle with a back ache.

I know that typing obscenities is not cool, but I really feel like I need a release. Many of the words I'd like to type begin with 'F' and sound like 'uck' or some variation thereof.

Then, I will go home to do some fishing. Everything will be fine again until Tuesday morning.

Hey "architorture" - thanks for the screen name.

Architects are miserable because in most architects career,who they believe themselves to be is never fully realized, like a dancer who never performs a show.

1. beacuse we are in a profession that 99% of the rest of the world couln't give a damn about.

2. because all of those frat boy / business majors that we used to bitch about how they spent all day and night drinking while we were all in studio slaving away have all become the buildiers and developers who have pulled our livelihood out from underneath us

3. we all want to be using mac's but auto-cad doesnt run well on virtual PC

Journalists, doctors, architects
they are all depressed. Every proffession whose focus isnt money is having a "crisis". Believe me they whine as much as architects. "no one listens to us anymore", "society does not value our work", "were forced by the owners/market to do a crap job"

I guess society does not value anyones work.

Yes, they do complain, too, but the big difference is that they start off making 4-8 times what an architect makes. Basically, a doctor/lawyer will start off at least 50% higher than an architect will EVER make.

They should give us a discount for school, or make it a 4 year professional degree. It's more than enough time.

....Because we feel this life time will not be enough to see our dreams built and we are running out of time....

....because this rendering is raking to much da.n time.....

I agree with mdler, especially point 2....my most recent client is a young guy who was a high school football player, married one of the cheerleaders, drank and partied his way through college, now is VP of a holding company that sells cheap furniture, mattresses, misc cheap junk, and lives in a very expensive subdivision, has 2 mercedes and a suburban in the garage, joined the local very expensive country club....and is hiring me to design the addition to his house. Not a lot of justice out there....I don't make enough to afford health care insurance, my vehicles have 180,000 and 250,000 miles on them, and I don't belong to any country clubs. Basically, we bitch about this profession because after entering it with noble visions, we find a career characterized by firms that perpetuate (mostly) the poor patterns of their predecessors: treating employees poorly, paying squat or nothing to recent graduates and most others, except for a few chosen associates, building businesses that are not designed to do anything more than ensure the principal(s) can retire comfortably. This results in all too many people, after a few years of poor treatment, stealing a client, opening an office, and then spending long hours for poor pay, constantly worrying about being undercut in terms of fee by the next new office. When you couple this with the basic attitude of a lot of "home" builders: "you don't need to waste money on an architect, I will throw in the plans", and you have a recipe for cynicism.

soleproprietornow:

I agree with you. I think also the public is just not educated as to what constitues "good' design - regardless of style or aesthetic. Same thing has happened in all fields of design: why spend money on custom designed & built furniture when you can just ikea it? Interesting topic here.

Sadly, right on. Why buy the cow when you can get the milk for free, as Ann Launders was fond of saying, in a wildly different context, of course.

Once you realize who you are in the design cycle (salesguy? designer? detail maniac? specifications nazi? schmoozer? depressed Cad monkey? trust fund jerk?) you can make better decisions about where you want to go... Often the happiest are the folks who have found a niche and really worked it. as far as ownership and all that goes, be careful what you wish for... the glories of a design rarely compensate for the anguish of finding decent employees (and I don't mean experienced, just people with a work ethic) and working with clients whose only goal in life is to make sure you remember them, not the project. They paid for it, and they don't want you to forget that...

Even the goal of a comfortable retirement seems like a myth. Sigh.

geezer: I am not yet at the point of being able to afford an employee, but as a former manager of a branch office, I know what you mean about finding people with a work ethic. My first day on the job with that firm I was faced with an employee who had written a several page "manifesto" (his term) regarding all of the "rights" of the branch office, and all of the issues the home office needed to address/rectify. *chuckle* That was an interesting week.
Comfortable retirement? 5 years ago I might have still thought that was possible, but today, I really don't think so. Yep, call me jaded or cynical, but the sad reality of the economics of this profession basically sucks.

Short note, not going to get into it too deeply. But Brim, you're right. Herbert Read, in his book, "To Hell With Culture," goes into the topic of how the general public does not understand good design. He traces it to western education and so forth. Interesting. Might want to give it a read (no pun intended).

depressed? I don't think so...
I've been drinking beer since 4pm...while doing exterior details and a demo plan...can't really complain.
maybe it's the image some black wearing Architects like to give off...but not here. All this talk about the employers treating the employee like shit...if it happens to you...quit.
I don't make six figures, don't have a car, but I go to Europe twice a year, and fly down to Miami once or twice a month...not much to complain about. I'm sure many six figure earning Lawyers and Doctors with their BMW's and Mcmansions dream about not having any worries/cares in the world...

i was a lot more depressed as a student than i am now as an intern.
i'm not doing the kind of work that i ultimately want to be doing for the rest of my life, thinking about which was somthing that i was commonly frustrated/depressed about while in school. and it is still sort of new to me, but i wouldn't say i am depressed at all right now...
who knows what the future will show though i suppose.