We are puting together a presentation for our client, and they really, really like what H&deM did at the Ricola storage and manufacturing facility in Mullhouse-Brunstatt, France.
The images on the front of this building are silk screen prints on copolymer. Our client would like to do something similar with glass, which makes this more difficult.
To further complicate matters, the client has a 'green' image - their words, not mine! This means the enamels and ceramic inks are something i would like to avoid.
If y'all know any process, manufacturer or shop resources, I would be very much in your debt!
Sounds like frit coating, usually ceramic, is out. Have you considered simply etching the glass? Or sandblasting it?
Also there are plastic laminates that can be adhered to the glass. Offers an opportunity for color, etc., but also can be bad if exposed to too much direct sun.
One other possibility is to check on the plastic 'skin' that is applied to the backs of spandrel panels to make them translucent or opaque. This might also be too full of non-green chemicals for your client, but I don't know.
Wish I could remember brands and trade names, but my brain must be tired.
You could etch the glass. I don't have any resources, and I imagine it would be kind of expensive.
H&deM did another building with a similar process, Library of the Eberswalde Technical School. I think there was an article in Record, or architecture a few years ago. It may have been glass, I'm not sure.
I think you could probably silkscreen on the inside of glass, so that it's not exposed to the elements, but it might be hard to read.
Thanks for the responses! Frit coating is out for now. I am looking at a plastic interlayer at a place called Industrial Printer (imaginative name, no?) They print an image from a big-ass HP printer. It sounds like it will work, but the silk screening would definitely give the consumer a better texture to look at. Thanks for the ideas, Steven!
pencrush: The Eberswalde School, like the Ricola center uses copolymer not glass, I believe. I found out today that printing on glass offers some unique and nasty problems versus printing on plastic.
yeah, you could always put vinyl on the glass too, depending on how long you want it to last, and how much interaction it might have with the public. Most store windows, office doors, etc. use vinyl. You can have it cut to the shape you need, can get it in an translucent finish, or print right on it if you wanted a color image.
Dupont isn't usually known as a five-star environmental steward. Check the specs on that stuff. Find out what PVB is and how it's made. If the client is really serious (and knowledgeable) about this, you don't want to stub your toe, jumping from one problematic material to another.
The material itself may not offgas or have any toxicity but the process of making it may have some nasty 'negative externalities', to use the sustainability lingo.
As I think aobut this more, it seems that if you can stick to local processes for achieving the desired effect rather than use of chemically-based products you might be safer.
do any of you happen to know someone who does this new UVitro process? it is much more eco-friendly and stands up to wear as well as ceramic inks. isimat in germany developed the process, but they only sell the machines!
Steven, thanbks for theheads up on PVB. you're right. i have to do some reading yet...
Does a product called Polyvinyl Butacite sound like something you want to pitch to a so-called "green corporation?" The MSDS sheet on it is pretty tame (no known carcinogens by US standards, etc), but it gets pretty ugly when it burns (serious chemicals being released).
Keep in mind, however, that this Dupont product is largely the same basic compound as PVC, which takes an incredible ammount of embodied energy to manufacture and is facing lawsuits for giving its longtime employees a very rare form of brain cancer. Also, it releases hazardous chloride compounds when it burns, and presumably while it's being manufactured, as well (much like PVC). Is this a product that a eco-friendly company wants to be associated with? Steer clear of anything with "Poly-vinyl" in its name. It's not friendly. No matter how much greenwashing takes place.
Look into options like sandblasting the glass. These represent much less embodied energy and retain much of the material's potential for recycling, a much better option than slapping a coating of plastic between layers of glazing.
Nice tread I just want to add that etching tradisionaly are two types ,as gloss and a matt , it is simple process where phospor acid and a few other chemicals in two different blends do the etching, Guess you can gel it somhow. ---- it wouldn\t be a bad concept today.
The pattern was made with asphalt tradisionaly but I guess any glued on plastic could work from any venyl plotter, also rubber sheats cut in shape could perform the pattrern with a simple sandblast pistol.
Just need some skilled craftmen.
PRINTING ON GLASS
We are puting together a presentation for our client, and they really, really like what H&deM did at the Ricola storage and manufacturing facility in Mullhouse-Brunstatt, France.
The images on the front of this building are silk screen prints on copolymer. Our client would like to do something similar with glass, which makes this more difficult.
To further complicate matters, the client has a 'green' image - their words, not mine! This means the enamels and ceramic inks are something i would like to avoid.
If y'all know any process, manufacturer or shop resources, I would be very much in your debt!
Thanks.
Sounds like frit coating, usually ceramic, is out. Have you considered simply etching the glass? Or sandblasting it?
Also there are plastic laminates that can be adhered to the glass. Offers an opportunity for color, etc., but also can be bad if exposed to too much direct sun.
One other possibility is to check on the plastic 'skin' that is applied to the backs of spandrel panels to make them translucent or opaque. This might also be too full of non-green chemicals for your client, but I don't know.
Wish I could remember brands and trade names, but my brain must be tired.
You could etch the glass. I don't have any resources, and I imagine it would be kind of expensive.
H&deM did another building with a similar process, Library of the Eberswalde Technical School. I think there was an article in Record, or architecture a few years ago. It may have been glass, I'm not sure.
I think you could probably silkscreen on the inside of glass, so that it's not exposed to the elements, but it might be hard to read.
Thanks for the responses! Frit coating is out for now. I am looking at a plastic interlayer at a place called Industrial Printer (imaginative name, no?) They print an image from a big-ass HP printer. It sounds like it will work, but the silk screening would definitely give the consumer a better texture to look at. Thanks for the ideas, Steven!
pencrush: The Eberswalde School, like the Ricola center uses copolymer not glass, I believe. I found out today that printing on glass offers some unique and nasty problems versus printing on plastic.
Thanks, peeps!
yeah, you could always put vinyl on the glass too, depending on how long you want it to last, and how much interaction it might have with the public. Most store windows, office doors, etc. use vinyl. You can have it cut to the shape you need, can get it in an translucent finish, or print right on it if you wanted a color image.
dupont has something.
i've never used it but a friend has , said it looks 'good' whatever that
means.. check it out.
http://www.dupont.com/safetyglass/expressions.html
thanks guys! the sentryglass at dupont might just be the thing, O+. i see what i can dig up about vinyl, too, pencrush.
any sign shop can do vinyl.
Dupont isn't usually known as a five-star environmental steward. Check the specs on that stuff. Find out what PVB is and how it's made. If the client is really serious (and knowledgeable) about this, you don't want to stub your toe, jumping from one problematic material to another.
The material itself may not offgas or have any toxicity but the process of making it may have some nasty 'negative externalities', to use the sustainability lingo.
As I think aobut this more, it seems that if you can stick to local processes for achieving the desired effect rather than use of chemically-based products you might be safer.
do any of you happen to know someone who does this new UVitro process? it is much more eco-friendly and stands up to wear as well as ceramic inks. isimat in germany developed the process, but they only sell the machines!
Steven, thanbks for theheads up on PVB. you're right. i have to do some reading yet...
Does a product called Polyvinyl Butacite sound like something you want to pitch to a so-called "green corporation?" The MSDS sheet on it is pretty tame (no known carcinogens by US standards, etc), but it gets pretty ugly when it burns (serious chemicals being released).
Keep in mind, however, that this Dupont product is largely the same basic compound as PVC, which takes an incredible ammount of embodied energy to manufacture and is facing lawsuits for giving its longtime employees a very rare form of brain cancer. Also, it releases hazardous chloride compounds when it burns, and presumably while it's being manufactured, as well (much like PVC). Is this a product that a eco-friendly company wants to be associated with? Steer clear of anything with "Poly-vinyl" in its name. It's not friendly. No matter how much greenwashing takes place.
Look into options like sandblasting the glass. These represent much less embodied energy and retain much of the material's potential for recycling, a much better option than slapping a coating of plastic between layers of glazing.
.mm
Hi
Nice tread I just want to add that etching tradisionaly are two types ,as gloss and a matt , it is simple process where phospor acid and a few other chemicals in two different blends do the etching, Guess you can gel it somhow. ---- it wouldn\t be a bad concept today.
The pattern was made with asphalt tradisionaly but I guess any glued on plastic could work from any venyl plotter, also rubber sheats cut in shape could perform the pattrern with a simple sandblast pistol.
Just need some skilled craftmen.
printing any graphic?
sure, it just comes off of what is a glorified inkjet on vinyl and then laminated into glass
vanceva and dupont both compete for printing on a vinyl inner layer.
the link above works for dupont
for vanceva: www.vanceva.com
dupont can go up to 60" wide. i think vanceva only goes to 48".
any sign shop can do vinyl as a surface lamination
you need someone like dupont or vanceva for the inner layer type of printing/lamination
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