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No Arch/Art degree, can I get a job at a firm?

rosetea

I am a recent graduate of chemistry and I really want to get a M.Arch degree. However, I don't have any experience, not even studio courses.

Seeing that my job search for chemistry jobs is futile anyway, I figured I will also seek out office jobs at design firms since I want my foot in the door in the business.

If that sounds reasonable, I'm looking up Architectural firms at Houzz and am thinking of shooting emails to a bunch of them, in a letter that expresses interest in the best way possible. Would that be a waste of time?

In their profiles, some firms even have recent Arch graduates in an administrative role, so I don't even know if I should try...

 
Jul 26, 14 8:18 pm

Get an associates degree in office assistant and then you might get a job in that regard. You could also seek an MBA or something in the business administration, financing, etc. It is a place to start but not directly in architecture but a firm isn't all architecture. 

Remember, some architecture graduates have multiple degrees and some may have minors in addition to their major or double major. You don't know. 

What education additional to chemistry do you have. It can be community college, a minor, etc.?

There is even computer tech jobs, too. There are other types of positions but if you are familiar with consultant type businesses like architecture and how it works and understand how architecture firms work overall... you can get a job. If you are good on the phone and good at taking notes and so forth... you could be a receptionist/office assistant. College financial aid work experience in jobs could lend to help you get a job and you can then complete a minor or something that the firm could use you at a better paying position.

Jul 26, 14 8:47 pm  · 
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I forgot to mention but every firm varies and it depends on the firm and their firm leadership. I seen firms hire non-architecture employees in administrative roles and other positions not pertaining directly to architecture. However, you are not going to be designing buildings without knowledge and skills in the subject of architecture/building design, engineering, construction. Life of occupants depends on the person designing buildings knowing what they are doing.

Jul 26, 14 8:51 pm  · 
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Snoopy316

This is unusual. Why would you go from a potential scienctist to a building designer? I understand if you wanted to just do office works until a opportunity arises in your field but to completely change field is a big step to take especially with no experience. 

Jul 26, 14 9:04 pm  · 
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accesskb

Good luck!  Its tough but there is no harm in trying.  If you're really interested, perhaps get out there, join local architectural organizations like Architecture for Humanity etc, volunteer, meet people in the industry, make connections, get recommendations/references and even get hired. :)

Jul 26, 14 9:07 pm  · 
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bugsmetoo

Seems like a waste of a degree frankly and squandering an education away out of the blue. Why study chemistry just to pursue architecture? Materials sciences or whatnot, sure, even industrial design, but your option seems so impulsive and limiting.

Consider landscape or environmental design. Leverage some of your education and then move on from there.

Jul 26, 14 9:16 pm  · 
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“””1991”

Lighting bolt!

Jul 27, 14 1:35 am  · 
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anarchaitect

Hi poobunnies,

I was on the same boat just about a year ago, so I'll throw my two cents. There are a few things that can boost your chance at finding work in architecture. They are: 1) proficiency in software programs (CAD, Adobe, Rhino, Revit, etc.). Which programs to pick up depends largely on the type of office you want to work at or the type of work you want to do. It doesn't matter whether you have a B.A. in architecture or comparative literature. If you know your software, chances are there are architects who could use your help. 2) Connection: reach out to alums, family members, friends, etc. Go to lectures if you happen to live nearby universities with architecture/design programs and get to know the faculties.  

It might take a while until you land a job. It took me nearly a year and taking on some odd jobs (construction, tutoring, real estate sales, etc.) before I finally landed a full-time position at a small architecture office.     

Don't pay attention to most comments above. Many here are plagued with cynicism (probably because their career took a good beating from the last recession). With enough effort and smarts you should be able to pull something off.    

Jul 27, 14 1:49 am  · 
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poobunnies,

Have you taken art courses. If you take them, I suggest courses in Art Basic Design. Especially if the instructor can point or help you make connection to architecture form. I suggest taking enough to cover 2d and 3d, fine art and applied art being covered.

I suggest courses in drawing and watercolor. Then some drafting courses and some multimedia courses. Work with man of the software mentioned but I really suggest a free Autocad clone such as Draftsight or Nanocad, SketchUp, Revit or Archicad (for BIM). This wil take 3-5 years to get competent with all of them if you spend 20-30 hours a week every week of the year gaining proficiency.

I suggest you become familiar with the I-codes from ICC. The unamended I-codes will be largely helpful for understanding the building codes as amended and adopted in almost any of the states. Learning to read blueprints will help you in knowing the drafting/CAD standards including hatch patterns, abbreviations and many more used to produce construction documents. However, being able to design and make rendering will help. There are many theories to architectural design so don't worry if you understand it all. Doubt anyone really knows it all.

At heart of all of architectural theory is art basic design principles.

Jul 27, 14 2:02 am  · 
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I advice you learn how to apply Sketchup together with Google Earth. This is a great way to visualize quickly a design in a general context with the site.

There is alot to learn but where you want to place yourself, the knowledge is still useful.

Jul 27, 14 2:05 am  · 
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rosetea

Wow guys thanks for the comments! Thought my thread wasn't approved yet.

Yes it seems like a random decision, and I'm applying furiously to chemistry jobs at the same time.

@Richard: I have taken fundamental courses in drawing, painting, and figure drawing throughout high school, including at Academy of Arts Uni. In college I never had time to fit studio courses into my schedule because of laboratory. But I've practiced drawing/painting on my own throughout college and doing projects on the side like illustration and comics. And I'm proficient at Adobe Creative Suite. I want to avoid going back to school for an associates--I'd rather get a job in my degree--but I have taken a summer in Accounting. I'll look into Sketchup, thanks!

@Snoopy: Potential scientist? Haha. I was going in for medicine at first but not anymore, and I'm not going to be a scientist either. I'm more clumsy and scatterbrained than the average person to work with liquids and cancerous stuff :P (two of my professors have cancer...). I'd be the worst scientist ever...If I were smart and more logical I would consider engineering. :(

@bugsmetoo: I've considered green design and I'm pretty sure my knowledge of materials chemistry will come in handy. Don't know how much science you need to know that but something I'd look into.

Why do I choose architecture? I guess it's because I think it's a nice blend of art and science. And if the economy for buildings turn out terrible I figure I could freelance some graphic design skills I'd learn along the way. I originally was considering graphic/industrial design but I like thepracticality of architecture and collaborating with engineers. And when I was young I liked houses and building houses and little furnitures out of cardboard...??

I went to a small liberal arts that didn't have a studio arts department and I didn't know what to do. We had a Cities department but I had no idea what the heck urban planning was and I didn't really think that it had any relation to some sort of art...

You guys are mean! There was a thread earlier by a chem major that wasn't taken badly. But ya, I did present my case pretty unclearly.

Jul 28, 14 2:57 am  · 
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rosetea

Okay so I guess this means I need to teach myself about the field before I can seriously find a job at a firm. Since my current situation requires me to get a job first I will probably study and become familiar with the software while working in a lab.

Jul 28, 14 3:08 am  · 
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anjalipatel
If it helps any I came from a psych background I know a colleague who came from biology, it ends up giving an interesting perspective on design I think. I only took an urban design studio before I went to get my MArch and also took art in high school. & a handful of schools wanted me so embrace your unique background! but I also looked for an internship before hand and it was pretty tough, if that doesn't work I'd say shadow an architect for a day see if you like the lifestyle.
Jul 28, 14 6:48 am  · 
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Wilma Buttfit

I don't have any advice, just some pictures, first of bismuth, then of architecture.

 

Jul 29, 14 7:54 am  · 
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poobunnies,

In every field, it is expected of employees to know something about the field t work efficiently because employers do not have time to "teach" employees. Tey aren't going to setup class sessions in room with a projector screen, dry erase board like a class room. They have their personal life after work. They have their work and its responsibilities.

In architecture, you should teach yourself about the architecture field. Fundamentals of the architectural language (ie. terminologies, jargon, and phrases and so on). You should understand art theories of color, texture, proportion, composition, form and so forth both in the general art and also the architectural perspective and so forth. 

You should have a fundamental understanding of buiding codes, the permit process, the architectural design process (in general because each office varies and part of it stems from the tools they use as CAD and BIM will have differences in processes. 

Why kind of role you want to have in the office will effect how much and how in-depth of the field you need to understand. In an administrative role, it would be less than if you want to be a design team member. You can self-directively (autodidactially) teach yourself everything to become a competent architect some day but may need to take an experience based path to licensure versus a degreed path. You could also pursue a 3+ year M.Arch program designed for people with non-architecture undergrad degrees. The experience based path requires considerable self-motivation and discipline and it still takes time to learn the subject. Start with the general understanding and then you can work your way towards the more detailed and advanced level understanding of the subject matter. It is possible but not an easy task. In this age with internet, you would want to be on forums like this one to gain insight on things to learn. Depending on the thread, of course and the discussions. Forums with architects and those who been through the architecture school or otherwise has been down the path.

Keep in mind that employers seek people who has a clue about architecture. They don't want "know it all" jerks because they don't tend to learn. They do want people who at leasts has some understanding of architecture, the way firms works and the processes to a level where they aren't totally clueless, 

Jul 29, 14 12:25 pm  · 
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Poobunny,

There are many options you can take. I haven't had time to totally read everything you wrote when I wrote the above.

There is many paths in this field. Some of them are:

1. Licensed or Registered Architect

2. Building designer

3. IDP Intern / Drafter

4. architectural illustrator/physical model maker and graphic designer

The last two (3 & 4) are entry points to become 1 or 2. This forum can tell you everything about the path to becoming a licensed/registered architect.

I'll tell you about the building designer path which it is possible to become a licensed architect. A building designer is a person who designs buildings but are not yet licensed as an Architect so they can't use the title architect. When a building designer practices as one independently, he or she can design on his or her own certain types of buildings exempted from requiring a licensed architect to design. This does not mean it is exempt from building codes or permit process. Therefore the role of a building designer is similar and some may say essentially the same as an architect except title and state license and the "architect stamp". However, a building designer maybe certified and when certified as a certified professional building designer by AIBD's NCBDC. This is a peer-based certification.

A CPBD can use a CPBD seal/stamp on the drawings they prepare but NEVER in lieu of an architect stamp when an architect stamp is required. Point is not to misrepresent oneself.

Although there is not an state license required to be a building designer, it is not something you should do without the knowledge ad skills to become a building designer. 

For someone like yourself, it maybe a easier path but keep in mind that there is an ugly truth that just because you are not licensed doesn't mean you don't have liability. That would be a rude awakening if you are negligent and think that just because you are not licensed that you are lawsuit proof. Not really. The architecture field is inherently litigous because of the shear expense and financial investment involved in designing and constructing buildings. As a building designer, I suggest you establish the necessary knowledge and skills to be competent. I recommend learning for a few years the subjects that NAAB accredited architecture teaches you, books on residential and light commercial design and drafting and study it using the current tools of the day like SketchUp for quick 3d visualization and NanoCAD or draftsight for construction documents. Then work for few (3-4) years with architects, building designers, and contractor. It would be important to understand the construction side of things. 

I can point you to many resources out there. I can not cover it all in full in just one message.

I would recommend you look into building design, drafting and architectural illustration. A building designer just like an architect would know how to draft and make illustrations but sometimes these roles in a firm or company is delegated off. You can use them as entry points.

After concurrently working and learning, for the 3-4 years, you may explore working on your own for a few years and then get certified when you have 6 years of experience. 3 of the education/experience requirement to become certified (there is an certification exam to pass, though) must be experience working for an architect, engineer, a building designer ( I think the designer has to be certified - CPBD, but have to double check), or work you do as a building designer. You have to have some references to support the background. 

3 of the years can be education so a 4-5 year degree in architecture and closely related education would be credited the 3 years but your non-architecture education maybe credited a few months to a year. You don't absolutely need to have 6 years of  architectural-related education/experience to be a building designer. You need to be competent , though.

You need 6 years to undergo the certification. Either way, it can work for you.

I do recommend that in the process to become a building designer to learn everything you can about the business of architecture (as it relates well with how building designer business works) and business administration/management.

If you need to take college courses, I recommend courses in business administration.

After all, when you do run your own building design practice, you need to charge fairly for yourself and your client and make end's meat and a profit margin so you can keep your financial house in order and pay your bills and not be buried in debt. What it means for you, is not working to be the cheapest person. You don't want to get caught up in a trap that some cheap "want everything for nothing" clients that will try to beat you down so you can't make a living and giving your services away because they can't afford you. If they can't afford to pay you respectively then frankly, they aren't financially ready for doing the project and they should not be served until they are. What that means, is you need to qualify your clients by making sure they aren't "window shoppers" or "want it all but can't pay". 

Enoch Sears and some others are good sources on business of architecture. I recommend him as a source as well as Mark LePage. They are only a couple of good sources but not the be all, end all. 

Any of the architects here can point you to good materials to read and study. You need to invest considerable time in addition to any employment work in studying but it doesn't necessarily have to be classes at a community college. Some of it can be done elsewhere.

I would not suggest diving into the business side until you have the knowledge and skills needed to perform the work. After all, if you start out on your own and can't deliver, the client is going to sue you and likely not pay you. Before you do get out on your own, I recommend you understand the business side of things so when you do, you would have better success.

Jul 29, 14 1:53 pm  · 
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Reading back on the first post, poobunnies, you mentioned seeking an M.Arch.

If you want to be a licensed architect then you will likely want to pursue an M.Arch. It would be a 3+ year degree. The degree may take you 4-6 or more years to complete depending on how many credits you take per term, per academic year, etc.

I will also suggest that you get your IDP record started with NCARB.

THe M.Arch degree MUST be NAAB accredited. If your area of interest in architecture design is designing public buildings, commercial buildings, institutional buildings then I will recommend you get an M.Arch if you want to get a license. I recommend a minor in business administration if possible or just some courses in it.

Get your IDP record started now. Go to NCARB.org and get your IDP record started. You already qualify with a high school diploma to get started. This way, you can start earning IDP training hours while completing the M.Arch. If you are starting then I would say that you should be able to get some small short duration work with architects. Some of whom are professors at a college. Getting accepted can be a challenge depending on portfolio and what you say in the essay they may require you to write on.

Even if you decide not to pursue taking the licensing exam to be a licensed architect, it is good preparation to be a building designer. My biggest concern about pursuing an M.Arch is its cost and long term ability to pay off the loans. 

It is all possible options. You need to keep in mind that internship pay isn't great and you'll be living on ramen noodles alot well after college until those student loans are paid off. You'll be needing to seek inexpensive apartment to live in ( < $750/month ). This is because starting wages in internship isn't much especially when you have to pay for a place to live and a good chunk of your income on loans and don't forget a third of your income is taken by IRS and your state (if they have an income tax or through other taxing). I recommend an appartment under $650/month if you are on your own and if it covers basic utilities (power, gas, etc.) while you must pay for internet/telephone and cable/satellite TV unless you live in a place with good over the air television.

Keep your expenses low because the loans are a burden ad you don't get much in world of lifestyle improvement just because you have a degree and a higher paying job because the loans makes that higher paying job feel like barely better than minimum wage.

Just the way it is. Watch the loan accumulation. 

Jul 29, 14 4:13 pm  · 
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I emphasized the matters of employers being hesitant on hiring people while in college because classes in most college programs are conducted during the same hours as most employment work schedule. Most architecture jobs are full-time jobs and most firms have only one shift from 8 am to 5pm M-F with after hour work in evening and weekends as needed to get the work done but mainly a one work shift business. Architecture firms isn't McDonald's.

Employers don't want to hire students because they are problematic to their work schedule. 

Online degrees where you can perform at your own schedule and pace makes you more 'employable' while taking classes because your classes schedule yields to the schedule of your employment. 

Just a word of thought which might help you decide how you want to go about this. Just some thoughts. As for applying your chemistry knowledge to architecture is not typical in that regard. It depends on how you want to position yourself. Someone working on architectural conservation and restoration may find knowledge in chemistry more useful. 

It depends on what you want to do but I think your chemistry knowledge would be most useful in architectural conservation like Lauren B. Allsopp. That is a career path option that you may want to think about and possibly leverage.

http://www.transpolisglobal.com/lauren_b_a.html

She teaches masonry conservation courses at the historic preservation program at University of Oregon.

She is a source that you can look at in deciding how you want to go about your future. 

If you want to become an architect or get some architecture behind you then maybe taking some courses from AAU. You don't necessarily have to complete the degree but it is good perhaps to do so. I suggest architectural conservation because you work with your chemistry knowledge in the application of restoration of architecture. You have many options in the allied professions that surrounds architecture itself. In some cases, you can be an architect and be also in any of these allied fields as well. This is how some architects keeps busy and have work to sustain a business by not being solely on architecture because the business is not just an architecture design business but maybe a product manufacturer or a conservation firm and others. It is finding a niche and positioning yourself so you have that niche in an area or region that will provide you work throughout your career or a good portion of it.

Jul 29, 14 5:02 pm  · 
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Volunteer

Have you considered landscape architecture firms that work on restoring environmentally damaged sites to a healthy condition? Your chemistry background would be very useful while you pick up landscape architecture creds.

Jul 29, 14 8:37 pm  · 
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