I'm too exhausted to go into the engineering science and calculations of it. After all, that was designed by the engineers.
Sponty:
You don't have an option to not meet all code requirements. If you're asked to do that you're supposed to document why you can't, and if necessary walk away from the project.
However, I do have options not meet all code requirements for NEW BUILDINGS when it comes to EXISTING BUILDINGS.
May 2, 16 7:04 pm ·
·
If you measure an existing building, the dimensions can change more than a 1/16" of an inch in dimensions all because of the wood trusses. The expansion and contraction of the trusses can cause just that much all because of temperature and relative humidity. What about the C.M.U? What about the cumulative measurement?
What about variations between measuring tapes and tools?
Rick that is not a standpipe. It's a sprinkler riser. There are photos where you can see there's no hose connection. You picked photos with things obscuring the middle of the pipe so that you could argue that it's something you know it's not.
I think that's a very good question about catering equipment. You've described how you came to your occupant counts, and how they leave just barely enough width in your egress routes. You didn't mention anything about caterers ho are there at the same time as the cast and audience - which they would have to be in order to serve and clear for dinner theater. Where are their carts or tables or racks or whatever, and their basins for dishes, and their waste containers, while they are serving? There's nowhere for them to be except in one or more of the egress routes. So now you not only have an overloaded, undersprinklered theater with a combustible roof and stage, you also have blocked exit routes.
More for the list of death: the electrical panel is in the backstage egress corridor (a no-no), and literally a few inches from the exit door (a bigger no-no). There's a dryer in the backstage area with a closet rod located above it such that costumes hang directly in contact with it (straight out of one of those elementary school fire safety assemblies where the friendly fireman tells you what to look out for in your home.)
Interesting how you mention expansion and contraction. In your other projects you measure to 1/16" of an inch. How do you account for environmental conditions? Do you have a hygrometer attached to your theodolite? Do you also scan the foundation for listing to make sure everything is square and plumb?
Remember tomorrow Balkins I'll be talking to David and Lisa. Please give me some more fuel for this fire.
The drawings by the architect for the addition have the floor to lowest edge of trusses at 11'-6" (that's measured at an exterior wall, so if the floor slopes down to the center of the room then that dimension would even be a little taller at center. They have the measurement from lowest edge of trusses to the peak of the trusses as 8'-8 1/2". That's 20'-2 1/2" and doesn't even quite get you all the way to the ceiling.
Rick's description above pretty much matches their section - it's just that everywhere that Rick uses the word "about" in his description they have an actual measurement that slightly exceeds his guesstimate. The cumulative result of all those "abouts" is that this building is not exempt. I assume Rick is going to postulate that the floor has settled 2-5/8" inches since he measured.
And this thread is the third google result for NCBDC.
Rogue Architect Sentenced in Death of L.A. Firefighter; AIA|LA Responds
AIA|LA responds to Gerhard Becker's one year involuntary manslaughter sentence in the death of an L.A. firefighter.
Balkins, you should be sitting on a toilet right now because you should be shitting your pants.
You're looking at being reprimanded by the state, fined by Astoria building dept and if people die manslaughter charges. All of this doesn't phase your narcissistic personality but you'll be crucified if this ever goes to court.
If this building is really 2-1/2 inches or more too tall for an unlicensed building designer to mess with, it seems like that should be actionable by the state board. Not letting the city off the hook for this either, they're unbelievably lax for not verifying what Mr. Balkins told them about the height. But isn't the architecture board likely to agree that a "building designer" should be capable of accurately measuring floor to ceiling height to within a half inch or so? If the building is 20'-2 1/2" now it wasn't 19 feet and change when he agreed to do the project. They should be able to get him on practicing architecture without a license.
How do I register for the CPBD exam? What is the CPBD exam? Who administers the CPBD exam? Where can I sign up for the CPBD exam? What does NCBDC CPBD stand for? Is the CPBD exam hard? What is the pass rate for the CPBD exam? Where in my state can I take the CPBD exam? Do Kangaroos take the CPBD exam? If a CPBD exam is failed, what then? Can I retake the CPBD exam? How is the CPBD exam like the ARE?
"the degree of care or competence that one is expected to exercise in a particular role of building design is of 1) prudence, 2) upholding and protect the HSW of the client and public with the duty of care when involved in work of substantial HSW and financial investment and 3) Must meet or exceed the minimum legally established standard of all the applicable local, state and federal laws, regulations, codes and policies in regards to the designing of such buildings."
"It is customarily illegal to offer services which you do not reasonably possess the knowledge and skill. Everyone has the duty of care to possess the knowledge and skill to perform any work before advertising and/or offering it. If you don't have the knowledge or skills, you do not have any legal right to offer to do it."
Just turn yourself in already Balkins. From day one you've been a complete fraud.
AIBD wants to be the AIA, but more like AIA lite, which implies by that building designers some type of architect subspecies.
not that balkans is helping their case
May 2, 16 11:16 pm ·
·
The drawings by the architect for the addition have the floor to lowest edge of trusses at 11'-6" (that's measured at an exterior wall, so if the floor slopes down to the center of the room then that dimension would even be a little taller at center. They have the measurement from lowest edge of trusses to the peak of the trusses as 8'-8 1/2". That's 20'-2 1/2" and doesn't even quite get you all the way to the ceiling.
Rick's description above pretty much matches their section - it's just that everywhere that Rick uses the word "about" in his description they have an actual measurement that slightly exceeds his guesstimate. The cumulative result of all those "abouts" is that this building is not exempt. I assume Rick is going to postulate that the floor has settled 2-5/8" inches since he measured.
And this thread is the third google result for NCBDC.
What's the width of the trusses he is using? I don't think he field measured. He probably used erroneous dimension. The roof is 5:12 pitch.
In order for the truss to be 8'-8.5", he's running the trusses as 42" wide.
Measure the building in google Eath, carefully (to not include a slight view of the east wall. There is no way I can be that the truss can be 8'-8.5" to the peak (not including the purlins that are maybe 2x6. I still have a 22.5-degree pitch to the truss. Remember, the interior finish is NOT to the absolute peak where the plywood sheathing joins above the V-style ridge (adjoining purlins at the ridge). That micro-concealed space up there is not part of the interior ceiling height.
Google earth is pretty accurate in dimensional scale. You will quickly realize that there isn't enough width of a building for the ceiling height to apply.
I can recall exact pitch of the floor. I think it was very very shallow. Only thin shims were required in the middle. Considering the batten on this building is 16" o.c. and the door on the north side is dead center. Even when calculating at half the front elevation, you reach a figure of 20'. Book matched and you got 40' right to the mark on width.
Just so you know, the center of the floor below is not a foot below it is at the sides. Maybe. Also near the front of the building, the floor is flat. The floor is uneven. The discrepancy between 10'-7" and 11'-6" is.
If you noticed, there is only 5 rows of CMUs above the east exit door to the heel of the truss. A door that's 6'-8" tall (10 CMU rows tall.)
That is putting us right at 10-0" to the heel at the exterior wall on the east side.
It's 9'-10" to the heel (top of pilasters on the wall where the truss rests at old garage bay (now enclosed) on the east side. The center is maybe 4-5" lower. With the front elevation being maybe 6" lower than the east door elevation with the South (high) to North (low) drain slope towards the front elevation. The front elevation middle is maybe an inch lower than the N.E. and N.W. corners. So even with a 10'-6" elevation to the bottom edge of the bottom chord of truss (or top of pilasters on the wall. So from top of truss to bottom of truss is maybe 8'-9.5 to 8'-10.5" Assuming 2x6 purlins in V-form. Top of the ridge is maybe 6". Elevation to floor is about ~19'-9 to 19'-10".
Physical dimensions of the CMU blocks already illustrates the height of the wall.
"Google earth is pretty accurate in dimensional scale."-balkins
this guy was just telling us about accounting for expansion and contraction of materials when field measuring...and uses a theodolite...and measures buildings to minimum of 1/16" accuracy.
May 3, 16 12:32 am ·
·
OBAE doesn't squabble over 1/16". Hell, you couldn't draw it on a set of plans when drawing at 1/4" = 1'-0" let alone 1/8" = 1'-0".
No_form, the licensing board doesn't worry about fractions of an inch. For example, if I drew a plans for a Commercial building (new construction for example), I can establish the ceiling height to exactly 20'-0" from top surface of lowest floor to highest overhead interior finish. Lets say the floor was wood constructed. When drawn on paper, we use straight lines. When loaded, the floor may deflect and so you can have more than a 1/16" in field measurements. Even the contractor may just cut the studs slightly long. Just to give you an idea.
Rick first, in skimming the above I can see a few different places where you've got wrong or sloppily rounded math in your assumptions. One example is where you converted a 5:12 pitch to a 22.5 degree angle. A 5:12 pitch is actually a 22.62 degree angle (remember your trigonometry? SOCATOA ring a bell?), so even if the building were exactly 40' wide the correct 22.62 degree angle results in a rise a whole inch higher than that of your rounded down 22.5 degree angle.
It does appear that the new structural engineer did do actual field measurements. They found the width of the building to be exactly 40'-5". That extra 5 inches in width amounts to another fraction of an inch in height - insignificant on its own, but you can see how these rounding errors are hurting you. They add up.
It's that sort of thing, through each of your eyeballing steps that result in you arriving at an answer that's off by several inches from theirs. You can't argue that they're the ones who are wrong there - it's you who is using the inaccurate/sloppy rounding.
The best thing to do would be to have a disinterested third party go measure this accurately. No drones, theodolites, or measurements derived form google earth. Acceptable methods are laser range meter or measuring tape operated by someone with experience in field measurements.
Also in the photos it's clear that the trusses are on top of the pilasters, and counting bricks & joints in the pilasters in the photos gets me exactly their measurement for floor to underside of trusses. So right there is a difference of several inches from your version, and your version isn't supported by the photos or the engineer's drawings.
Did you ever actually just go there and snake a tape up to the ridge?
I've about had it with this thread now. Good night and goodbye.
May 3, 16 1:17 am ·
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But when the angle is smack in the middle between 22 and 23 degrees on a simple 6" diameter compass, you know the roof is 5:12 pitch. When I calculated, roof angle for 5:12, I wasn't using degrees so much as rise/run. So my math numbers would still be correct. Remember, when I started this. I had anything from carpet to linoleum over floor area including the simple fact that there was a partition wall running through the middle. Think about that for a moment. I even has a suspended ceiling structure that was removed.
I have a laser range meter that can be used but if someone who is a third party wants to be present and check the numbers on the range finder.
Trusses as with roofs are built to rise:run ratios similar to the rafters. So yes, you are correct, 22.62 is accurate to the 100th of a degree. However, when a truss assembly is established, it would be at the designated degrees for the rise/run of the roof specified.
For 19'-9" to 19'-10" I used the rise/run not the degrees. It is a lot easier mathematically and pretty accurate.
May 3, 16 1:23 am ·
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Sponty, What about the CMU. There is 3 bricks to the CMU block.
The bricks are about 2-1/2" tall. I used the CMUs. The bricks line up with the CMU on a 3 bricks to every CMU unit.
Nominal height for CMUs is 8". Therefore, for calculations, I used the nominal height not of the CMUs.
I've got a 3999.9 SF building that during the dry season is 19'-11" tall. Jumps up to 20' in winter on account of frost heaves but any ways. It used to be an ice cream parlor with a detached outhouse. Was thinking of converting it into a kangaroo petting zoo with apartments on top. Seeing as it's existing I figure I can stack up another 20' and still be exempt from using an architect. Call it agricultural and residential use. Perfectly legal I suppose.
Was hoping I'd find a real life certified professional building designer to scratch up some plans to show the folks at the city. My property is located in Clatsop county Oregon. Anyone who can help I'd be much obliged.
What the fuck is wrong with you!!!!! Shut the FUCK up already!!!!! It's been established by all the people on here, with probably hundreds of years of combined experience, that you couldn't tell your ass from your elbows.
May 3, 16 2:42 am ·
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Sponty,
The engineer didn't measure the building. He took off of a set of DDs with incorrect measurements. I was going to correct the numbers between DD and CDs when the interior demotion occured so I can get some better and more accurate measurements of the interior height. I had at the time only an ultra-sonic measurement meter and measuring tape. When we were demoing out the interior and a chimney as part of phase approval. We had some builders up at the roof so I had them measure by reading out the measured end at the highest point adjacent to the ridge purlins and where the plywood meets and the other end ran down to the ground. I had already got the corrected exterior dimensions but it was after DD was made. In the concatenated time frame from initial contact through SD and DD but I was waiting opportunities to wait for the demo to clear enough of the area to get this done. However, the DDs were not meant to be submitted for permits. So it caused some problematic numbers because they didn't bother field checking.
I was waiting for the interior demo out to finalize before I see all was needed to be done before getting the CDs made up. When they went with the DDs, it screwed things up a bit. However, even after correct measurements were sent to the engineer, the sprinklers required no modifications so the engineer didn't make a revised copy of the sprinkler plans from what I can tell.
They never field measured the building themselves. They took information provided by the contractor who used the wrong set of measurements. Period.
May 3, 16 2:59 am ·
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jla-x,
You have a FUCKING door that's 6'-8" tall on the east side. (R.O.) I have photos from before remodel that I can count the rows. I already measured the CMUs. Nominal height including the mortar bed is 8". How hard is that to count them to the rows. The pilaster is FLUSH to the CMU wall line.
You do realize I have straight on views of the trusses. Ever angle you go on each vertex (regardless of the effects of perspective views), the angles of the truss doesn't change.
I actually measured the truss bottom chord as well. I calculated from true points on the truss for the angles of the truss.
Yes, I have measured the pilasters as well. You didn't think I did that, did you?
May 3, 16 3:10 am ·
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For all we know is Sponty or anyone else using a false identity could have never drafted a single building. Never went to architecture school and not even licensed in ANY state. All we have is words on a forum with anonymous identity.
It's against the law for architects to claim they are licensed as architects under a false identity. It's one thing to conduct business as such but to use the architect title professionally and claiming licensure, you need to use your proper identity and it doesn't matter if it is a forum or not or the internet.
I'm calling it at about 19'-10". The slab is not perfectly flat. There's like a 1-1/2" drop to the middle along the east-west axis from the door on the east side and the garage door on the west. The more I am discussing this, the more I'm thinking about the notes and what I had determine. Along the N/S axis it's like 1" or so through center line. When it was a laundromat, there was linoleum, carpet and the concrete floor and all. It is not even really a drainage slope.
Rick the engineers' field measurements that I was referring to are the ones completed for the proposed addition - they were not done from your drawings - how could you even think that's possible - your plan dimensions and theirs disagree by several inches.
You admitted above that you didn't do accurate field measurements (drop ceiling in the way, layers of carpet, blah blah blah). Their measurements exactly match all conditions visible in the current photos - there is no reason to doubt them
balkans cocks his way through a simple remodel, failing to control his own documents, which results in a questionably safe assembly space, then when called out for it, questions our professional standards
The difference Ricky is that everyone calling themselves architects on this forum could easily back it up ... they just don't because they don't have to. Whereas, you go around trying to play like you're an architect trying to stroke your own ego, but since you are not licensed and have run into your own ineptitude in trying to become one, you call yourself a building designer and then screw stuff up like this.
Everyone else is legally practicing architecture and succeeding, but posts online anonymously.
You don't post anonymously, but try to practice architecture and fail.
Take this moment of AIBD expiration to not renew and do something else with your life ... something you can succeed in, something you are qualified for, or can become qualified for.
I had a dream I visited this building and inspected it.
Time to quit the internet
May 3, 16 11:58 am ·
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god, the irony is rich.
balkans cocks his way through a simple remodel, failing to control his own documents, which results in a questionably safe assembly space, then when called out for it, questions our professional standards
Do you provide or submit to clients DD drawing? Do they ever possess them for review beyond just the time you are physically in front of the client?
CPBD exam specifications under review by NCBDC.
tduds,
I'm too exhausted to go into the engineering science and calculations of it. After all, that was designed by the engineers.
Sponty:
You don't have an option to not meet all code requirements. If you're asked to do that you're supposed to document why you can't, and if necessary walk away from the project.
However, I do have options not meet all code requirements for NEW BUILDINGS when it comes to EXISTING BUILDINGS.
If you measure an existing building, the dimensions can change more than a 1/16" of an inch in dimensions all because of the wood trusses. The expansion and contraction of the trusses can cause just that much all because of temperature and relative humidity. What about the C.M.U? What about the cumulative measurement?
What about variations between measuring tapes and tools?
Yeah! What about em?
Rick that is not a standpipe. It's a sprinkler riser. There are photos where you can see there's no hose connection. You picked photos with things obscuring the middle of the pipe so that you could argue that it's something you know it's not.
I think that's a very good question about catering equipment. You've described how you came to your occupant counts, and how they leave just barely enough width in your egress routes. You didn't mention anything about caterers ho are there at the same time as the cast and audience - which they would have to be in order to serve and clear for dinner theater. Where are their carts or tables or racks or whatever, and their basins for dishes, and their waste containers, while they are serving? There's nowhere for them to be except in one or more of the egress routes. So now you not only have an overloaded, undersprinklered theater with a combustible roof and stage, you also have blocked exit routes.
^ better hope the caterers don't use chaffing dishes and sterno to keep food at an appropriate temperature.
It's ok if they use the vintage Kangaroo Kitchen propane stove though
ricki pleae go on and explain hydraulic calculations! oh please with your ever amazing depth of stupidity, go on, explain! k4l
More for the list of death: the electrical panel is in the backstage egress corridor (a no-no), and literally a few inches from the exit door (a bigger no-no). There's a dryer in the backstage area with a closet rod located above it such that costumes hang directly in contact with it (straight out of one of those elementary school fire safety assemblies where the friendly fireman tells you what to look out for in your home.)
Remember tomorrow Balkins I'll be talking to David and Lisa. Please give me some more fuel for this fire.
k4L
so when you google CPBD exam this thread is Number 6. Making the community proud - Richard Balkins.
The drawings by the architect for the addition have the floor to lowest edge of trusses at 11'-6" (that's measured at an exterior wall, so if the floor slopes down to the center of the room then that dimension would even be a little taller at center. They have the measurement from lowest edge of trusses to the peak of the trusses as 8'-8 1/2". That's 20'-2 1/2" and doesn't even quite get you all the way to the ceiling.
Rick's description above pretty much matches their section - it's just that everywhere that Rick uses the word "about" in his description they have an actual measurement that slightly exceeds his guesstimate. The cumulative result of all those "abouts" is that this building is not exempt. I assume Rick is going to postulate that the floor has settled 2-5/8" inches since he measured.
And this thread is the third google result for NCBDC.
Rogue Architect Sentenced in Death of L.A. Firefighter; AIA|LA Responds AIA|LA responds to Gerhard Becker's one year involuntary manslaughter sentence in the death of an L.A. firefighter.
NCBDC CPBD
NCBDC CPBD
Just trying push the results up to #1
I'm sure he will have a well polished excuse about the heights. Like kangaroo jumping has forced the building to settle.
You're looking at being reprimanded by the state, fined by Astoria building dept and if people die manslaughter charges. All of this doesn't phase your narcissistic personality but you'll be crucified if this ever goes to court.
K4L
If this building is really 2-1/2 inches or more too tall for an unlicensed building designer to mess with, it seems like that should be actionable by the state board. Not letting the city off the hook for this either, they're unbelievably lax for not verifying what Mr. Balkins told them about the height. But isn't the architecture board likely to agree that a "building designer" should be capable of accurately measuring floor to ceiling height to within a half inch or so? If the building is 20'-2 1/2" now it wasn't 19 feet and change when he agreed to do the project. They should be able to get him on practicing architecture without a license.
How do I register for the CPBD exam? What is the CPBD exam? Who administers the CPBD exam? Where can I sign up for the CPBD exam? What does NCBDC CPBD stand for? Is the CPBD exam hard? What is the pass rate for the CPBD exam? Where in my state can I take the CPBD exam? Do Kangaroos take the CPBD exam? If a CPBD exam is failed, what then? Can I retake the CPBD exam? How is the CPBD exam like the ARE?
just doing my part
This kangaroo disussion on CPBD exam is second on my list when I google CPBD exam.
what is the point of the AIBD? I don't get it, you're certified to do limited work that in many state the homeowner can pull the permit on?
Jul 11, 11 12:48 am
Rick Balkins inaugural post:
"the degree of care or competence that one is expected to exercise in a particular role of building design is of 1) prudence, 2) upholding and protect the HSW of the client and public with the duty of care when involved in work of substantial HSW and financial investment and 3) Must meet or exceed the minimum legally established standard of all the applicable local, state and federal laws, regulations, codes and policies in regards to the designing of such buildings."
"It is customarily illegal to offer services which you do not reasonably possess the knowledge and skill. Everyone has the duty of care to possess the knowledge and skill to perform any work before advertising and/or offering it. If you don't have the knowledge or skills, you do not have any legal right to offer to do it."
Just turn yourself in already Balkins. From day one you've been a complete fraud.
.
AIBD wants to be the AIA, but more like AIA lite, which implies by that building designers some type of architect subspecies.
not that balkans is helping their case
The drawings by the architect for the addition have the floor to lowest edge of trusses at 11'-6" (that's measured at an exterior wall, so if the floor slopes down to the center of the room then that dimension would even be a little taller at center. They have the measurement from lowest edge of trusses to the peak of the trusses as 8'-8 1/2". That's 20'-2 1/2" and doesn't even quite get you all the way to the ceiling.
Rick's description above pretty much matches their section - it's just that everywhere that Rick uses the word "about" in his description they have an actual measurement that slightly exceeds his guesstimate. The cumulative result of all those "abouts" is that this building is not exempt. I assume Rick is going to postulate that the floor has settled 2-5/8" inches since he measured.
And this thread is the third google result for NCBDC.
What's the width of the trusses he is using? I don't think he field measured. He probably used erroneous dimension. The roof is 5:12 pitch.
In order for the truss to be 8'-8.5", he's running the trusses as 42" wide.
Measure the building in google Eath, carefully (to not include a slight view of the east wall. There is no way I can be that the truss can be 8'-8.5" to the peak (not including the purlins that are maybe 2x6. I still have a 22.5-degree pitch to the truss. Remember, the interior finish is NOT to the absolute peak where the plywood sheathing joins above the V-style ridge (adjoining purlins at the ridge). That micro-concealed space up there is not part of the interior ceiling height.
Google earth is pretty accurate in dimensional scale. You will quickly realize that there isn't enough width of a building for the ceiling height to apply.
I can recall exact pitch of the floor. I think it was very very shallow. Only thin shims were required in the middle. Considering the batten on this building is 16" o.c. and the door on the north side is dead center. Even when calculating at half the front elevation, you reach a figure of 20'. Book matched and you got 40' right to the mark on width.
Just so you know, the center of the floor below is not a foot below it is at the sides. Maybe. Also near the front of the building, the floor is flat. The floor is uneven. The discrepancy between 10'-7" and 11'-6" is.
If you noticed, there is only 5 rows of CMUs above the east exit door to the heel of the truss. A door that's 6'-8" tall (10 CMU rows tall.)
That is putting us right at 10-0" to the heel at the exterior wall on the east side.
It's 9'-10" to the heel (top of pilasters on the wall where the truss rests at old garage bay (now enclosed) on the east side. The center is maybe 4-5" lower. With the front elevation being maybe 6" lower than the east door elevation with the South (high) to North (low) drain slope towards the front elevation. The front elevation middle is maybe an inch lower than the N.E. and N.W. corners. So even with a 10'-6" elevation to the bottom edge of the bottom chord of truss (or top of pilasters on the wall. So from top of truss to bottom of truss is maybe 8'-9.5 to 8'-10.5" Assuming 2x6 purlins in V-form. Top of the ridge is maybe 6". Elevation to floor is about ~19'-9 to 19'-10".
Physical dimensions of the CMU blocks already illustrates the height of the wall.
"Google earth is pretty accurate in dimensional scale."-balkins
this guy was just telling us about accounting for expansion and contraction of materials when field measuring...and uses a theodolite...and measures buildings to minimum of 1/16" accuracy.
OBAE doesn't squabble over 1/16". Hell, you couldn't draw it on a set of plans when drawing at 1/4" = 1'-0" let alone 1/8" = 1'-0".
No_form, the licensing board doesn't worry about fractions of an inch. For example, if I drew a plans for a Commercial building (new construction for example), I can establish the ceiling height to exactly 20'-0" from top surface of lowest floor to highest overhead interior finish. Lets say the floor was wood constructed. When drawn on paper, we use straight lines. When loaded, the floor may deflect and so you can have more than a 1/16" in field measurements. Even the contractor may just cut the studs slightly long. Just to give you an idea.
Rick first, in skimming the above I can see a few different places where you've got wrong or sloppily rounded math in your assumptions. One example is where you converted a 5:12 pitch to a 22.5 degree angle. A 5:12 pitch is actually a 22.62 degree angle (remember your trigonometry? SOCATOA ring a bell?), so even if the building were exactly 40' wide the correct 22.62 degree angle results in a rise a whole inch higher than that of your rounded down 22.5 degree angle.
It does appear that the new structural engineer did do actual field measurements. They found the width of the building to be exactly 40'-5". That extra 5 inches in width amounts to another fraction of an inch in height - insignificant on its own, but you can see how these rounding errors are hurting you. They add up.
It's that sort of thing, through each of your eyeballing steps that result in you arriving at an answer that's off by several inches from theirs. You can't argue that they're the ones who are wrong there - it's you who is using the inaccurate/sloppy rounding.
The best thing to do would be to have a disinterested third party go measure this accurately. No drones, theodolites, or measurements derived form google earth. Acceptable methods are laser range meter or measuring tape operated by someone with experience in field measurements.
Also in the photos it's clear that the trusses are on top of the pilasters, and counting bricks & joints in the pilasters in the photos gets me exactly their measurement for floor to underside of trusses. So right there is a difference of several inches from your version, and your version isn't supported by the photos or the engineer's drawings.
Did you ever actually just go there and snake a tape up to the ridge?
I've about had it with this thread now. Good night and goodbye.
But when the angle is smack in the middle between 22 and 23 degrees on a simple 6" diameter compass, you know the roof is 5:12 pitch. When I calculated, roof angle for 5:12, I wasn't using degrees so much as rise/run. So my math numbers would still be correct. Remember, when I started this. I had anything from carpet to linoleum over floor area including the simple fact that there was a partition wall running through the middle. Think about that for a moment. I even has a suspended ceiling structure that was removed.
I have a laser range meter that can be used but if someone who is a third party wants to be present and check the numbers on the range finder.
Trusses as with roofs are built to rise:run ratios similar to the rafters. So yes, you are correct, 22.62 is accurate to the 100th of a degree. However, when a truss assembly is established, it would be at the designated degrees for the rise/run of the roof specified.
For 19'-9" to 19'-10" I used the rise/run not the degrees. It is a lot easier mathematically and pretty accurate.
Sponty, What about the CMU. There is 3 bricks to the CMU block.
The bricks are about 2-1/2" tall. I used the CMUs. The bricks line up with the CMU on a 3 bricks to every CMU unit.
Nominal height for CMUs is 8". Therefore, for calculations, I used the nominal height not of the CMUs.
Was hoping I'd find a real life certified professional building designer to scratch up some plans to show the folks at the city. My property is located in Clatsop county Oregon. Anyone who can help I'd be much obliged.
What the fuck is wrong with you!!!!! Shut the FUCK up already!!!!! It's been established by all the people on here, with probably hundreds of years of combined experience, that you couldn't tell your ass from your elbows.
Sponty,
The engineer didn't measure the building. He took off of a set of DDs with incorrect measurements. I was going to correct the numbers between DD and CDs when the interior demotion occured so I can get some better and more accurate measurements of the interior height. I had at the time only an ultra-sonic measurement meter and measuring tape. When we were demoing out the interior and a chimney as part of phase approval. We had some builders up at the roof so I had them measure by reading out the measured end at the highest point adjacent to the ridge purlins and where the plywood meets and the other end ran down to the ground. I had already got the corrected exterior dimensions but it was after DD was made. In the concatenated time frame from initial contact through SD and DD but I was waiting opportunities to wait for the demo to clear enough of the area to get this done. However, the DDs were not meant to be submitted for permits. So it caused some problematic numbers because they didn't bother field checking.
I was waiting for the interior demo out to finalize before I see all was needed to be done before getting the CDs made up. When they went with the DDs, it screwed things up a bit. However, even after correct measurements were sent to the engineer, the sprinklers required no modifications so the engineer didn't make a revised copy of the sprinkler plans from what I can tell.
They never field measured the building themselves. They took information provided by the contractor who used the wrong set of measurements. Period.
jla-x,
You have a FUCKING door that's 6'-8" tall on the east side. (R.O.) I have photos from before remodel that I can count the rows. I already measured the CMUs. Nominal height including the mortar bed is 8". How hard is that to count them to the rows. The pilaster is FLUSH to the CMU wall line.
You do realize I have straight on views of the trusses. Ever angle you go on each vertex (regardless of the effects of perspective views), the angles of the truss doesn't change.
I actually measured the truss bottom chord as well. I calculated from true points on the truss for the angles of the truss.
Yes, I have measured the pilasters as well. You didn't think I did that, did you?
For all we know is Sponty or anyone else using a false identity could have never drafted a single building. Never went to architecture school and not even licensed in ANY state. All we have is words on a forum with anonymous identity.
It's against the law for architects to claim they are licensed as architects under a false identity. It's one thing to conduct business as such but to use the architect title professionally and claiming licensure, you need to use your proper identity and it doesn't matter if it is a forum or not or the internet.
It's professional misconduct.
https://www.google.com/search?q=kangaroo+meme&client=safari&channel=iphone_bm&prmd=ivsn&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjemKKvsb3MAhVqkYMKHWYHAWAQ_AUIBygB&biw=375&bih=559#imgrc=Btbi6ER1RgvnQM%3A
Done.
I'm calling it at about 19'-10". The slab is not perfectly flat. There's like a 1-1/2" drop to the middle along the east-west axis from the door on the east side and the garage door on the west. The more I am discussing this, the more I'm thinking about the notes and what I had determine. Along the N/S axis it's like 1" or so through center line. When it was a laundromat, there was linoleum, carpet and the concrete floor and all. It is not even really a drainage slope.
where is this professional misconduct standard in the law or anywhere else? I don't recall reading about this in prep for any exam
Oh fuck! I accidentally clicked on this and this idiot is on this as well!
The burn is strong this morning.
Rick the engineers' field measurements that I was referring to are the ones completed for the proposed addition - they were not done from your drawings - how could you even think that's possible - your plan dimensions and theirs disagree by several inches.
You admitted above that you didn't do accurate field measurements (drop ceiling in the way, layers of carpet, blah blah blah). Their measurements exactly match all conditions visible in the current photos - there is no reason to doubt them
12 f****ing pages of non sense? balkins you need professional help, of the mental kind.
Doesn't really mean squat, but Balki Bartokomous your AIBD membership expired over the weekend.
god, the irony is rich.
balkans cocks his way through a simple remodel, failing to control his own documents, which results in a questionably safe assembly space, then when called out for it, questions our professional standards
i feel like this is balkans distilled down to his purest essence
The difference Ricky is that everyone calling themselves architects on this forum could easily back it up ... they just don't because they don't have to. Whereas, you go around trying to play like you're an architect trying to stroke your own ego, but since you are not licensed and have run into your own ineptitude in trying to become one, you call yourself a building designer and then screw stuff up like this.
Take this moment of AIBD expiration to not renew and do something else with your life ... something you can succeed in, something you are qualified for, or can become qualified for.
It finally happened.
I had a dream I visited this building and inspected it.
Time to quit the internet
god, the irony is rich.
balkans cocks his way through a simple remodel, failing to control his own documents, which results in a questionably safe assembly space, then when called out for it, questions our professional standards
Do you provide or submit to clients DD drawing? Do they ever possess them for review beyond just the time you are physically in front of the client?
^ Holograms Ricky ... the answer is hologram kangaroos.
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