I am starting a new thread that is about other threads. You can talk about other discussions taking a place in Archinect and make cross references to a particular link, picture, response and whatever else you deem necessary or entertaining or thought provoking about the other thread. thus the name: Thread Central
here are some examples of comments that comes to mind:
* hey did you read on --------- thread ------- thinks frank gehry is good. hahahaharhar..
or,
*i can't believe he said that. how stupid of him. asshole.on top of it he is got hundreds of posts. gimme a break.
or,
* this is the best thread.. fuck the others..
or,
*****Thread Alert******
read the -----thread yet??? there is a dog fight going on between ----- and-----.it is about gondolas and pollution in Venice..see you there.
or,
* yeaah, i don't read that thread either. its kind a boring.
or,
*i am thinking about starting a discussion about ------------- ---- ---- will you guys in Thread Central post in it and say wow it a great thread?. it was about time 'somebody' (insert my name please) picked up on it.. and discuss it?
like whatever..
tduds
Jan 9, 17 4:18 pm
At what point does a tiny shutter become a big shingle?
Donna Sink
Jan 9, 17 4:24 pm
Great post, Josh.
I need a new job. I guess it's a good time to be looking.
senjohnblutarsky
Jan 9, 17 4:49 pm
/sarcasm
archietechie
Jan 9, 17 4:50 pm
Patrik (ZHA) just posted images of his entry for Mies' National Gallery in Berlin. I dislike the man but I think it's fittingly gorgeous...could be the rendering.
snooker-doodle-dandy
Jan 9, 17 6:25 pm
I shutter at the thought of a colonial house without shutters.....ya right! You ever try to paint shutters..It is a pain in the Arshe!
Josh Mings
Jan 9, 17 9:12 pm
Yeah, that ZHA entry is really nice...and a bit of a departure from their normal work.
Mr_Wiggin
Jan 10, 17 12:21 pm
Any of you all ever had your parents guilt you into designing a house for them? Seems like a relational minefield, and it appears I'm about to be right in the middle.
b3tadine[sutures]
Jan 10, 17 12:30 pm
Yeah, no. If you do it, set clear and unwavering ground rules. You are the client, I am a professional.
Non Sequitur
Jan 10, 17 12:33 pm
My dad keeps making renovations to their house then showing me the results... which, in several (if not all) instances were against code (unprotected openings against property lines) or against better judgement (cheap wall paint with no sanding on stained kitchen cabinets).
Wilma Buttfit
Jan 10, 17 12:33 pm
Yes. Not a good idea.
Josh Mings
Jan 10, 17 12:36 pm
I have a very explicit no family or friends rule. I'll take a friend of a friend for a client, but that's as close as it gets.
Wilma Buttfit
Jan 10, 17 12:43 pm
I pointed out that my parents new kitchen counters were installed wrong and I got sent to my room. Depends on who they are. I've worked for in-laws with no problem though, because they don't see me as an 8 year old I suppose.
Mr_Wiggin
Jan 10, 17 1:04 pm
Yeah, I'm fully aware of the possible shit storm awaiting me, but I'm not sure there's any way out of this. Any suggestions for ground-rules/conditions?
shellarchitect
Jan 10, 17 1:12 pm
maybe suggest they look at other architects first, once they have an idea of the cost of the service you are providing they may be more considerate of your time/effort
senjohnblutarsky
Jan 10, 17 1:22 pm
I've done work for family and friends.
I do it in an adviser type role. I've never given a sealed drawing. Just schematics and let them figure it out with a contractor.
And I have yet to charge anyone.
Donna Sink
Jan 10, 17 1:30 pm
Mr Wiggin, I'm going to make the assumption that your parents are nice normal people, not pretentious design aficionados.
It might help if you tell yourself that this is a project to make your parents happy, it's not a time for you to express your creative vision. Your role is to make sure that what they get is well-scaled, simple, functionally straightforward, of good quality....but not necessarily any kind of design statement.
Like, when you have a baby, it's cool to do a bitchin' modern design-forward nursery for the kid, but, the kid doesn't really care one way or another. What really matters is that they have a safe place to sleep and you give them love. That's it. Think of this as returning the favor to your parents: safe, good, filled with love, and about *them*.
Now if they ARE design aficionados and want you to fully express your creative vision through this building...that's another story, and excellent.
Mr_Wiggin
Jan 10, 17 3:02 pm
Thanks guys, there may be stories coming out of this in the ensuing months...
mightyaa
Jan 10, 17 3:08 pm
Pretty much everyone in my family is either an architect or in the design field. So it's no problem to get together as a family and critique/charrette our various remodels. Think of it more like peer reviews with lots of wine. It's actually kind of nice with everyone able to speak the same language and understand the ramifications of choices on budget, design intent, function, etc. Oh, and our patriarch also tends to be bullheaded and set in his ways, so family dynamics kick in with his brood ganging up on him with our matriarch (mom), being the referee and person who can defuse.
Not all roses though. Conflicting design ideals, spouse involvement, who makes the drawings, etc. become a minefield. At least everyone is on the same page that they aren't 'entitled' to this work, and appreciate whomever steps up to do some drafting / detail sketching, etc..
Feel sorry for the poor GC; with a family of architects who live within a few minutes of each other, there are regular 'hit and run' field observations... . :P
I advised on a house addition for my father-in-law, a retired contractor. His regret is not asking me for more help. No charge for a few sketches, ideas, thoughts, and I gave him some pictures. For my brother-in-law, I did two basement finishes with drawings. He offered to pay, I declined. He and the framer both gave me money and beer to watch their kids while working though, so I got some $ out of it. My brother insisted on paying me a small fee for plans for his business fit-out but he never paid. My parents have tried to get me to draw their designs for an addition to their house and a few new houses on various proposed lots, and I have tried many times... none of which they had an intention of paying nor letting use any knowledge or expertise. My parents don't know what architects do, they wanted me to hire subs and GC the project and were confused when I told them I didn't do that. :(
Wilma Buttfit
Jan 10, 17 3:37 pm
^ adding to that... my bro-in-law also loaned me his car for a whole month and helped me redo my bathroom so doing plans for free seemed right.
Donna Sink
Jan 10, 17 3:59 pm
nICE FIND, TDUDS. i LOVE THAT KIND OF CONTEXTUAL PHOTOGRAPHY, THOUGH i SUSPECT SOME TELEPHOTO-ING IS EVIDENT.
Oops, CADding.
Marc Miller
Jan 10, 17 5:51 pm
I hope the image in the dezeen link are not overly photoshopped. If I recall correctly, I read an article (NYTimes?) that suggested that one of the ways ZHA evaluates completed projects was how the photos compared to the renderings (intended image vs actual).
If these are not overly manipulated they add another layer to this evaluation, begging more consideration of what the rendered images represent when they include "atmosphere" or why that is not a part of the rendering itself.
b3tadine[sutures]
Jan 10, 17 9:29 pm
So. So, our PEEOTUS likes getting golden showers from Russian prostitutes. Ok, back to your regularly scheduled programming.
Bench
Jan 11, 17 3:55 am
^ ^ Apparently not that crazy. The Guardian and other (reputable) news sources are reporting this morning of that scenario potenitally being a reality:
i'm loving that groups that propagated fake news, are saying this is fake 4chan news. a guy who for 8 years spun that Obama is a secret, foreign muslim, is complaining that this is fake. i can't stop laughing, can't. stop.
DTL DWG
Jan 11, 17 8:31 pm
came to the conclusion last night, a disappointing one, but there really is no difference between Intelligence Agencies and the Media anymore. They have kind of merged - socially.
curtkram
Jan 11, 17 8:34 pm
if you have friends try to get you to be their architect, the best response is to go all prima donna on them. can i be a prima donna if i'm male? maybe there is a better term. douchnozzle? still not very gender-neutral. anyway, i've told people i want to be 'their architect' and shown this clip when they asked me about their new house:
Whoa, I just googled a question and an archinect thread came up in the results. I clicked on it and read thru the responses. Found the answer to my question.... get this.... written by myself... almost 10 years ago. How cool is that? Or, I have a bad memory.
Donna Sink
Jan 11, 17 9:35 pm
That's awesome and funny, tint.
Bench
Jan 12, 17 4:03 am
there really is no difference between Intelligence Agencies and the Media anymore
Have they merged?
OR,
is the selective interpretation/acceptance of media to fit one's world view just permeated into anything that questions it, be it journalism or intelligence agencies? As in - did you just not like the message they were giving and therefore rejected it out of hand?
DTL DWG
Jan 12, 17 7:43 am
Bench, was looking at the big picture. your 2nd statement is accurate in that people will believe whatever they want to believe, not like Intelligent Agents are any different. They believe whatever they want to believe which is what they are often asked to believe within a greater cause. Think about it ths way. Almost all information classified or not can be accessed remotely now.
How much of your personal life is documented completely detached from any electronic network of any type? Does anyone really have to invade you home anymore to find stuff? You still only use landlines and pay phones? Physical interactions versus facebook, not much a difference anymore. You can tell the truth or lie just the same with the information. Last but not least, unless you are an Intelligent Agent the infromation you hear like the rest of us comes from some form of media. The classsified reports themselves are a type a media intended for limited viewer ship, but its still just the same a "news" report. How do you gather hidden motives? How hard is it to make fake news anymore and have it gain believable traction? Why are you any smarter as an intelligent agent than a journalist if you have information you believe no one else has or has interpreted as such? other than predicting violence and stopping it in defense how is the information more valuable then insider stock tips? In simples terms, do you think anyone who vited for Trump cares where the information came from? Until the information affects your daily lives, no one cares. In the past you could have remained in a detached bubble and when a newspaper was delievered or an Intelligent Agent told you something there was value right? there is no value to information anymore unless it accurately predicts the future and the difference between the media, intelligent agents, and a psychic is practically nothing.
b3tadine[sutures]
Jan 12, 17 7:48 am
MSM is used, rather universally, by Trumpists, to describe anything that challenges their world view - to be honest, even by those not part of the traditional Democratic Party - and while that is useful to punch at MSNBC, FOXNews and CNN - all media/news organizations - it cannot be said of the NYT, WaPo, WSJ, FT, The Atlantic, and others.
We have to decide that news matters.
DTL DWG
Jan 12, 17 7:50 am
shorter version of above. univerally socially - internet killed traditional media. internet and wikileaks killed classified information. Secrecy does not matter, just political agenda.
DTL DWG
Jan 12, 17 7:55 am
beta, news has lost value in that it took on a political agenda. its hard to make news matter when its just a story to support some ideology. Central Intelligence Agencies have always had political agendas. So another non difference between media and intelligence.
Non Sequitur
Jan 12, 17 8:10 am
I get all my news from Archinect.
senjohnblutarsky
Jan 12, 17 8:17 am
Internet media is a joke. It's all just click bait headlines and spun content. Sadly, real media is following the same trends. It's sad.
archiwutm8
Jan 12, 17 8:30 am
I get all my news from my dog, he tells me as he sees it.
DTL DWG
Jan 12, 17 8:30 am
yup. anothet interesting parallel to note based on my travels and meeting many people of various backgrounds. In some parts of the world when news favors one side or the other the automatic response is "government propaganda". the same skepticism and what would many Americans would believe to be a conspiracy like thinking in the US has now been applied to the media in general. its not a conspitacy theory in many countries, its accepted as fact. whether Americans realize it or not we have developed the same mindset as a members of an oppressive or corrupt country that finds all media suspect and equally oppressive and corrupt - but we hardly the same county where if you do protest or say something out of line - bing bang boom - you are dead. wonder what you call that condition? its like the rich kid pretending to be poor?
DTL DWG
Jan 12, 17 8:31 am
archi, I am heading in that direction, or the stars.
Josh Mings
Jan 12, 17 10:44 am
I'd watch a newscast that had voice actors supplying voices for dogs.
Everyday Intern
Jan 12, 17 1:28 pm
This infographic was making the rounds about a month ago regarding news sources, partisan bias, and journalistic quality. I don't necessarily agree with everything on it, but I found it interesting.
Pew Research Center also published some research on political polarization and the media a couple of years ago that I think is still good.
archietechie
Jan 12, 17 1:52 pm
^ They should add that clickbait shit Buzzfeed into the "just no" section.
Better still out of the graph yet still visible to the reader.
senjohnblutarsky
Jan 12, 17 2:08 pm
NBC and CBS with minimal partisan bias??? What a joke.
b3tadine[sutures]
Jan 12, 17 2:13 pm
Show me a piece on CBS, within the past 5 years biased. Not Mike Wallace or Dan Rather era.
Everyday Intern
Jan 12, 17 2:20 pm
Simmer down gentleman. I don't think the infographic is perfect, almost everyone will find something the disagree with on it. However, just because it is in the center doesn't mean it isn't biased. They still acknowledge that the partisan bias is there, albeit minimally. The Pew Research Center link notes that almost all news sources have some bias ... most of them slightly left.
b3tadine[sutures]
Jan 12, 17 2:56 pm
EI I think it's a good source though.
senjohnblutarsky
Jan 12, 17 3:31 pm
Eh, just watch Charlie Rose interview a Republican. It shines through pretty quickly.
Wilma Buttfit
Jan 12, 17 4:07 pm
I get my news from late night/early morning truck driver geared radio programs, NPR and PBS. Some news magazines too like the New Yorker and the Economist. None of the rest of it makes sense to me and is all sensationalized IMO. The media has long been dubbed the 4th branch of government. I would watch the show that had dogs delivering the headlines though. Good idea.
I am starting a new thread that is about other threads. You can talk about other discussions taking a place in Archinect and make cross references to a particular link, picture, response and whatever else you deem necessary or entertaining or thought provoking about the other thread. thus the name: Thread Central
here are some examples of comments that comes to mind:
* hey did you read on --------- thread ------- thinks frank gehry is good. hahahaharhar..
or,
*i can't believe he said that. how stupid of him. asshole.on top of it he is got hundreds of posts. gimme a break.
or,
* this is the best thread.. fuck the others..
or,
*****Thread Alert******
read the -----thread yet??? there is a dog fight going on between ----- and-----.it is about gondolas and pollution in Venice..see you there.
or,
* yeaah, i don't read that thread either. its kind a boring.
or,
*i am thinking about starting a discussion about ------------- ---- ---- will you guys in Thread Central post in it and say wow it a great thread?. it was about time 'somebody' (insert my name please) picked up on it.. and discuss it?
like whatever..
At what point does a tiny shutter become a big shingle?
Great post, Josh.
I need a new job. I guess it's a good time to be looking.
/sarcasm
Patrik (ZHA) just posted images of his entry for Mies' National Gallery in Berlin. I dislike the man but I think it's fittingly gorgeous...could be the rendering.
I shutter at the thought of a colonial house without shutters.....ya right! You ever try to paint shutters..It is a pain in the Arshe!
Yeah, that ZHA entry is really nice...and a bit of a departure from their normal work.
Any of you all ever had your parents guilt you into designing a house for them? Seems like a relational minefield, and it appears I'm about to be right in the middle.
Yeah, no. If you do it, set clear and unwavering ground rules. You are the client, I am a professional.
My dad keeps making renovations to their house then showing me the results... which, in several (if not all) instances were against code (unprotected openings against property lines) or against better judgement (cheap wall paint with no sanding on stained kitchen cabinets).
Yes. Not a good idea.
I have a very explicit no family or friends rule. I'll take a friend of a friend for a client, but that's as close as it gets.
I pointed out that my parents new kitchen counters were installed wrong and I got sent to my room. Depends on who they are. I've worked for in-laws with no problem though, because they don't see me as an 8 year old I suppose.
Yeah, I'm fully aware of the possible shit storm awaiting me, but I'm not sure there's any way out of this. Any suggestions for ground-rules/conditions?
maybe suggest they look at other architects first, once they have an idea of the cost of the service you are providing they may be more considerate of your time/effort
I've done work for family and friends.
I do it in an adviser type role. I've never given a sealed drawing. Just schematics and let them figure it out with a contractor.
And I have yet to charge anyone.
Mr Wiggin, I'm going to make the assumption that your parents are nice normal people, not pretentious design aficionados.
It might help if you tell yourself that this is a project to make your parents happy, it's not a time for you to express your creative vision. Your role is to make sure that what they get is well-scaled, simple, functionally straightforward, of good quality....but not necessarily any kind of design statement.
Like, when you have a baby, it's cool to do a bitchin' modern design-forward nursery for the kid, but, the kid doesn't really care one way or another. What really matters is that they have a safe place to sleep and you give them love. That's it. Think of this as returning the favor to your parents: safe, good, filled with love, and about *them*.
Now if they ARE design aficionados and want you to fully express your creative vision through this building...that's another story, and excellent.
Thanks guys, there may be stories coming out of this in the ensuing months...
Pretty much everyone in my family is either an architect or in the design field. So it's no problem to get together as a family and critique/charrette our various remodels. Think of it more like peer reviews with lots of wine. It's actually kind of nice with everyone able to speak the same language and understand the ramifications of choices on budget, design intent, function, etc. Oh, and our patriarch also tends to be bullheaded and set in his ways, so family dynamics kick in with his brood ganging up on him with our matriarch (mom), being the referee and person who can defuse.
Not all roses though. Conflicting design ideals, spouse involvement, who makes the drawings, etc. become a minefield. At least everyone is on the same page that they aren't 'entitled' to this work, and appreciate whomever steps up to do some drafting / detail sketching, etc..
Feel sorry for the poor GC; with a family of architects who live within a few minutes of each other, there are regular 'hit and run' field observations... . :P
Speaking of ZHA, this is a brilliant bit of editorial photography: https://www.dezeen.com/2012/11/15/galaxy-soho-by-zaha-hadid-architects-photographed-by-hufton-crow/
I advised on a house addition for my father-in-law, a retired contractor. His regret is not asking me for more help. No charge for a few sketches, ideas, thoughts, and I gave him some pictures. For my brother-in-law, I did two basement finishes with drawings. He offered to pay, I declined. He and the framer both gave me money and beer to watch their kids while working though, so I got some $ out of it. My brother insisted on paying me a small fee for plans for his business fit-out but he never paid. My parents have tried to get me to draw their designs for an addition to their house and a few new houses on various proposed lots, and I have tried many times... none of which they had an intention of paying nor letting use any knowledge or expertise. My parents don't know what architects do, they wanted me to hire subs and GC the project and were confused when I told them I didn't do that. :(
^ adding to that... my bro-in-law also loaned me his car for a whole month and helped me redo my bathroom so doing plans for free seemed right.
nICE FIND, TDUDS. i LOVE THAT KIND OF CONTEXTUAL PHOTOGRAPHY, THOUGH i SUSPECT SOME TELEPHOTO-ING IS EVIDENT.
Oops, CADding.
I hope the image in the dezeen link are not overly photoshopped. If I recall correctly, I read an article (NYTimes?) that suggested that one of the ways ZHA evaluates completed projects was how the photos compared to the renderings (intended image vs actual).
If these are not overly manipulated they add another layer to this evaluation, begging more consideration of what the rendered images represent when they include "atmosphere" or why that is not a part of the rendering itself.
So. So, our PEEOTUS likes getting golden showers from Russian prostitutes. Ok, back to your regularly scheduled programming.
^ ^ Apparently not that crazy. The Guardian and other (reputable) news sources are reporting this morning of that scenario potenitally being a reality:
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/jan/10/fbi-chief-given-dossier-by-john-mccain-alleging-secret-trump-russia-contacts
i'm loving that groups that propagated fake news, are saying this is fake 4chan news. a guy who for 8 years spun that Obama is a secret, foreign muslim, is complaining that this is fake. i can't stop laughing, can't. stop.
came to the conclusion last night, a disappointing one, but there really is no difference between Intelligence Agencies and the Media anymore. They have kind of merged - socially.
if you have friends try to get you to be their architect, the best response is to go all prima donna on them. can i be a prima donna if i'm male? maybe there is a better term. douchnozzle? still not very gender-neutral. anyway, i've told people i want to be 'their architect' and shown this clip when they asked me about their new house:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rn9pk_186P4
amour propre amour de soi
primo uomo
Whoa, I just googled a question and an archinect thread came up in the results. I clicked on it and read thru the responses. Found the answer to my question.... get this.... written by myself... almost 10 years ago. How cool is that? Or, I have a bad memory.
That's awesome and funny, tint.
there really is no difference between Intelligence Agencies and the Media anymore
Have they merged?
OR,
is the selective interpretation/acceptance of media to fit one's world view just permeated into anything that questions it, be it journalism or intelligence agencies? As in - did you just not like the message they were giving and therefore rejected it out of hand?
Bench, was looking at the big picture. your 2nd statement is accurate in that people will believe whatever they want to believe, not like Intelligent Agents are any different. They believe whatever they want to believe which is what they are often asked to believe within a greater cause. Think about it ths way. Almost all information classified or not can be accessed remotely now. How much of your personal life is documented completely detached from any electronic network of any type? Does anyone really have to invade you home anymore to find stuff? You still only use landlines and pay phones? Physical interactions versus facebook, not much a difference anymore. You can tell the truth or lie just the same with the information. Last but not least, unless you are an Intelligent Agent the infromation you hear like the rest of us comes from some form of media. The classsified reports themselves are a type a media intended for limited viewer ship, but its still just the same a "news" report. How do you gather hidden motives? How hard is it to make fake news anymore and have it gain believable traction? Why are you any smarter as an intelligent agent than a journalist if you have information you believe no one else has or has interpreted as such? other than predicting violence and stopping it in defense how is the information more valuable then insider stock tips? In simples terms, do you think anyone who vited for Trump cares where the information came from? Until the information affects your daily lives, no one cares. In the past you could have remained in a detached bubble and when a newspaper was delievered or an Intelligent Agent told you something there was value right? there is no value to information anymore unless it accurately predicts the future and the difference between the media, intelligent agents, and a psychic is practically nothing.
MSM is used, rather universally, by Trumpists, to describe anything that challenges their world view - to be honest, even by those not part of the traditional Democratic Party - and while that is useful to punch at MSNBC, FOXNews and CNN - all media/news organizations - it cannot be said of the NYT, WaPo, WSJ, FT, The Atlantic, and others.
We have to decide that news matters.
shorter version of above. univerally socially - internet killed traditional media. internet and wikileaks killed classified information. Secrecy does not matter, just political agenda.
beta, news has lost value in that it took on a political agenda. its hard to make news matter when its just a story to support some ideology. Central Intelligence Agencies have always had political agendas. So another non difference between media and intelligence.
I get all my news from Archinect.
Internet media is a joke. It's all just click bait headlines and spun content. Sadly, real media is following the same trends. It's sad.
I get all my news from my dog, he tells me as he sees it.
yup. anothet interesting parallel to note based on my travels and meeting many people of various backgrounds. In some parts of the world when news favors one side or the other the automatic response is "government propaganda". the same skepticism and what would many Americans would believe to be a conspiracy like thinking in the US has now been applied to the media in general. its not a conspitacy theory in many countries, its accepted as fact. whether Americans realize it or not we have developed the same mindset as a members of an oppressive or corrupt country that finds all media suspect and equally oppressive and corrupt - but we hardly the same county where if you do protest or say something out of line - bing bang boom - you are dead. wonder what you call that condition? its like the rich kid pretending to be poor?
archi, I am heading in that direction, or the stars.
I'd watch a newscast that had voice actors supplying voices for dogs.
This infographic was making the rounds about a month ago regarding news sources, partisan bias, and journalistic quality. I don't necessarily agree with everything on it, but I found it interesting.
Pew Research Center also published some research on political polarization and the media a couple of years ago that I think is still good.
^ They should add that clickbait shit Buzzfeed into the "just no" section.
Better still out of the graph yet still visible to the reader.
NBC and CBS with minimal partisan bias??? What a joke.
Show me a piece on CBS, within the past 5 years biased. Not Mike Wallace or Dan Rather era.
Simmer down gentleman. I don't think the infographic is perfect, almost everyone will find something the disagree with on it. However, just because it is in the center doesn't mean it isn't biased. They still acknowledge that the partisan bias is there, albeit minimally. The Pew Research Center link notes that almost all news sources have some bias ... most of them slightly left.
EI I think it's a good source though.
Eh, just watch Charlie Rose interview a Republican. It shines through pretty quickly.
I get my news from late night/early morning truck driver geared radio programs, NPR and PBS. Some news magazines too like the New Yorker and the Economist. None of the rest of it makes sense to me and is all sensationalized IMO. The media has long been dubbed the 4th branch of government. I would watch the show that had dogs delivering the headlines though. Good idea.