It seems the two most disconcerting aspects of the architectural profession are:
1. We don't make enough money
2. Clients willing to build "Architecture" are few and far between.
My question is, why don't more poor/struggling architects pool their money together and build their own way? Sure the profits are less, but the right kind of extra curricular collaboration could yield some really great speculative developments. All things aside (current market, competition, etc) Are there any examples of built collaborative efforts?
By today's standards, this is not entirely spectacular work ... but this r.e. development is the result of such an effort by the founders of The Architect's Collaborative.
NOTE: the url provided is a little tempermental ... you may need to try it more than once for it to load.
I think a lot of architects do - just not in any ground breaking way. Its the old "put your money where your mouth is" syndrome. I guess when we have to pay for it we become less daring, least there be "design flaws".
That's part of it. Being a developer and a designer is counter productive, in many cases. If you are worried about profit (and you have to be to survive as a developer), then that big ass cool cantilever may become less cool looking at it from a $$ standpoint.
That said, I am trying to do that, ever so slowly. That's the big plan, anyway.
i know this is an implausible question but how likely is it to major in architecture and minor in say, computer science? arch students work a lot but is it possible to find some time to fit some cs courses in? like say during grad school or during the summer (or as part of the elective credits)
I'd figure maybe cs could be a nice secondary financial support esp when starting out as an architect, or a safety net..considering how much more programmers make.
I got a minor in business while getting my bach in architecture. It wasn't hard. Possibly even easier than if I had taken gen ed requirements.
NOTE TO ALL FRESHMAN: most schools let you waive gen ed requirements if you get a minor. For example, you can skip underwater basket weaving and take Intro to Biz Management. Not as much fun, of course, but it's a great trade. EVERYONE should do this. I found out a year late and wasted at least half a year of credits on bs classes.
But a minor ain't getting you a job in that profession, it's just a solid intro. I can't imagine having a dual major with someone completely unrelated. I can't imagine trying to program after a crit...
it seems like architectuer and computer science have many things in common. I think a lot of the thinking process is the same. They both operate on languages to create an end product. Creating a program is all about function and the way you design the program affects the way the program operates.
perhaps one of the differences is that architecture works more from a creative and social perspective and in cs, you work within a set of rules, logic, and language you cannot break....if i'm correct.
it seems like architectuer and computer science have many things in common. I think a lot of the thinking process is the same. They both operate on languages to create an end product. Creating a program is all about function and the way you design the program affects the way the program operates. like in both fields, you're always asking the question "how do i best achieve this function, or how should i create something in order for the system to work"
perhaps one of the differences is that architecture works more from a creative and social perspective and in cs, you work within a set of rules, logic, and language you cannot break....if i'm correct.
trace... why would you attempt to be a developer-architect without an architect's license? Are you saying you want to be a developer and then hire architects?
If I remember corrrectly you weren't too excited about getting the lic., or am I remembering wrong?
justin - well, I a only know parts of actionscript, javascript, html, etc., so it 's not hardcore or 'real' programming, but I can tell you that I don't believe my education in architecture helped at all. I've tried diving into PHP and CGI/Perl, but just couldn't grasp it (I am sure I could over time, but it's soooo boring).
Strawberry - well, it depends, but I am certainly not waiting until I am licensed. Finding licensed architects is not hard. I am choosing my battles as carefully as possible. It's a time thing, really. I have my own business, and am working on getting another one started (three, if you count the architecture). That takes all my time and I'd rather get those rolling and make my own schedule than work at an office with little pay to accumulate the necessary IDP credits.
I'd like to get licensed someday, but it's not a priority by any means. I'd rather design and build my own things, spend the time marketing, expanding business, etc.
We'll see, but licensure is the last thing on my mind.
tangent but: six moon hill was just profiled on this old house. they did gropius' house 2 weeks ago. all as an aside to the mid-modern house they're rennovating right now. pretty cool to see even them delving into modern stuff.
"t seems like architectuer and computer science have many things in common. I think a lot of the thinking process is the same. They both operate on languages to create an end product. "
The functon are most often the rules how the function work , best way to get the function to yield the right ansver is describing the ansver within the function ; But if architecture must be the result it is no good way, to just copy the way's it was "allway's done" --- now that don't realy "produce" anything but what was allway's possible allready.
"Creating a program is all about function and the way you design the program affects the way the program operates. like in both fields, you're always asking the question "how do i best achieve this function, or how should i create something in order for the system to work"
Creating a house are putting building compoments together, the more flexible the better the architecture can profit "how do I best produce a family house at a third the cost four times as strong" "whare are the limits for this attitude" --- now that's questions that ansvered will produce the best new functions within architecture, --- now please ansver me ; do you realy think those architect applications are so good ? Can't you even emagine how easy they can be made much better ?
depends on what you are doing. For me, probably 'no'. I will be working on small residential, which I don't need a license for. I'll be hiring/working with other architects, though, so if I need someone with a license it's not hard to find.
Would it help? Sure, it would help with credibility and other things but it's simply not worth the time. I am not far out of school (or at least I keep telling myself that) and it would take a long time to get the IDP credits, study, etc. I'd rather be making $ and building my designs.
e909 - that's true, firm's like Gensler will have a cad team that programs specific stuff in there. But they aren't architects, or if they are, they don't do anything with it anymore.
To me, they just seem counter productive. One is completely logical (if this, then that) whereas architecture is (should) be driven by creativity.
I think web design is a good field to look at. You have your designers and you have your programmers. A few know a little of both, but in general there is a clear separation.
A firm might love a guy with an arch degree that is their IT guy. You'd understand the architect's needs and be able to help that way. But you'd just be doing IT, not architecture.
appleseed, in my B arch program, no one got a minor that I know of. One attemtped a double major and had to drop one. No one played anything but intramural or club sports either for that matter. Very few held jobs, and those that did suffered.
Not a large liberal arts school? I'd say a third of the people in my class had minor's in art history or buisness or something. Even those who finished in 4 years.
Nov 18, 05 9:51 pm ·
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Poor Architects?
It seems the two most disconcerting aspects of the architectural profession are:
1. We don't make enough money
2. Clients willing to build "Architecture" are few and far between.
My question is, why don't more poor/struggling architects pool their money together and build their own way? Sure the profits are less, but the right kind of extra curricular collaboration could yield some really great speculative developments. All things aside (current market, competition, etc) Are there any examples of built collaborative efforts?
By today's standards, this is not entirely spectacular work ... but this r.e. development is the result of such an effort by the founders of The Architect's Collaborative.
NOTE: the url provided is a little tempermental ... you may need to try it more than once for it to load.
I think a lot of architects do - just not in any ground breaking way. Its the old "put your money where your mouth is" syndrome. I guess when we have to pay for it we become less daring, least there be "design flaws".
Babs - link worked great, thank you.
That's part of it. Being a developer and a designer is counter productive, in many cases. If you are worried about profit (and you have to be to survive as a developer), then that big ass cool cantilever may become less cool looking at it from a $$ standpoint.
That said, I am trying to do that, ever so slowly. That's the big plan, anyway.
Trace - sounds like you and I are on similar paths...
i know this is an implausible question but how likely is it to major in architecture and minor in say, computer science? arch students work a lot but is it possible to find some time to fit some cs courses in? like say during grad school or during the summer (or as part of the elective credits)
I'd figure maybe cs could be a nice secondary financial support esp when starting out as an architect, or a safety net..considering how much more programmers make.
jh - in an arch program all of your credits are pretty much laid out, getting a second major takes at least one more year.
I got a minor in business while getting my bach in architecture. It wasn't hard. Possibly even easier than if I had taken gen ed requirements.
NOTE TO ALL FRESHMAN: most schools let you waive gen ed requirements if you get a minor. For example, you can skip underwater basket weaving and take Intro to Biz Management. Not as much fun, of course, but it's a great trade. EVERYONE should do this. I found out a year late and wasted at least half a year of credits on bs classes.
But a minor ain't getting you a job in that profession, it's just a solid intro. I can't imagine having a dual major with someone completely unrelated. I can't imagine trying to program after a crit...
it seems like architectuer and computer science have many things in common. I think a lot of the thinking process is the same. They both operate on languages to create an end product. Creating a program is all about function and the way you design the program affects the way the program operates.
perhaps one of the differences is that architecture works more from a creative and social perspective and in cs, you work within a set of rules, logic, and language you cannot break....if i'm correct.
it seems like architectuer and computer science have many things in common. I think a lot of the thinking process is the same. They both operate on languages to create an end product. Creating a program is all about function and the way you design the program affects the way the program operates. like in both fields, you're always asking the question "how do i best achieve this function, or how should i create something in order for the system to work"
perhaps one of the differences is that architecture works more from a creative and social perspective and in cs, you work within a set of rules, logic, and language you cannot break....if i'm correct.
Maybe just major in computer science and then you can call yourself an architect right after graduation.
trace... why would you attempt to be a developer-architect without an architect's license? Are you saying you want to be a developer and then hire architects?
If I remember corrrectly you weren't too excited about getting the lic., or am I remembering wrong?
justin - well, I a only know parts of actionscript, javascript, html, etc., so it 's not hardcore or 'real' programming, but I can tell you that I don't believe my education in architecture helped at all. I've tried diving into PHP and CGI/Perl, but just couldn't grasp it (I am sure I could over time, but it's soooo boring).
Strawberry - well, it depends, but I am certainly not waiting until I am licensed. Finding licensed architects is not hard. I am choosing my battles as carefully as possible. It's a time thing, really. I have my own business, and am working on getting another one started (three, if you count the architecture). That takes all my time and I'd rather get those rolling and make my own schedule than work at an office with little pay to accumulate the necessary IDP credits.
I'd like to get licensed someday, but it's not a priority by any means. I'd rather design and build my own things, spend the time marketing, expanding business, etc.
We'll see, but licensure is the last thing on my mind.
sorry, Strawbeary....can't believe I didn't notice that until now!
??
half an hour later? not bad... don't sweat it.
tangent but: six moon hill was just profiled on this old house. they did gropius' house 2 weeks ago. all as an aside to the mid-modern house they're rennovating right now. pretty cool to see even them delving into modern stuff.
yeah, i saw that too db. cool indeed.
they are doing some cool things in san diego, jonathan segal, ted smith, and few other architects.
http://www.jonathansegalarchitect.com/
Hi
"t seems like architectuer and computer science have many things in common. I think a lot of the thinking process is the same. They both operate on languages to create an end product. "
The functon are most often the rules how the function work , best way to get the function to yield the right ansver is describing the ansver within the function ; But if architecture must be the result it is no good way, to just copy the way's it was "allway's done" --- now that don't realy "produce" anything but what was allway's possible allready.
"Creating a program is all about function and the way you design the program affects the way the program operates. like in both fields, you're always asking the question "how do i best achieve this function, or how should i create something in order for the system to work"
Creating a house are putting building compoments together, the more flexible the better the architecture can profit "how do I best produce a family house at a third the cost four times as strong" "whare are the limits for this attitude" --- now that's questions that ansvered will produce the best new functions within architecture, --- now please ansver me ; do you realy think those architect applications are so good ? Can't you even emagine how easy they can be made much better ?
i like architecture! yay!
why not get your license? can't you do a lot more WITH a license than without?
depends on what you are doing. For me, probably 'no'. I will be working on small residential, which I don't need a license for. I'll be hiring/working with other architects, though, so if I need someone with a license it's not hard to find.
Would it help? Sure, it would help with credibility and other things but it's simply not worth the time. I am not far out of school (or at least I keep telling myself that) and it would take a long time to get the IDP credits, study, etc. I'd rather be making $ and building my designs.
i think it's possible to meld all kinds of things. whether employers or clients will pay you, is another problem.
this one is too obvious: sysadmin for a cad network? lisp or vb enhancements for cad?
http://groups.google.com/groups?q=sysadmin+cad+|+Autocad+|microstation
Another degree takes an extra year??? I managed a B.Arch + a BA in a non related field in 4 years. If you put the effort into it, it's possible.
e909 - that's true, firm's like Gensler will have a cad team that programs specific stuff in there. But they aren't architects, or if they are, they don't do anything with it anymore.
To me, they just seem counter productive. One is completely logical (if this, then that) whereas architecture is (should) be driven by creativity.
I think web design is a good field to look at. You have your designers and you have your programmers. A few know a little of both, but in general there is a clear separation.
A firm might love a guy with an arch degree that is their IT guy. You'd understand the architect's needs and be able to help that way. But you'd just be doing IT, not architecture.
appleseed, in my B arch program, no one got a minor that I know of. One attemtped a double major and had to drop one. No one played anything but intramural or club sports either for that matter. Very few held jobs, and those that did suffered.
Not a large liberal arts school? I'd say a third of the people in my class had minor's in art history or buisness or something. Even those who finished in 4 years.
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