Dec 16 '13 29 Last Comment
Dec 16, 13 6:36 pm

So I logged into my NCARB account, and behold- all my hours are gone! WTF just happened to all my approved and submitted hours!!! 


Dec 16, 13 7:22 pm

Damn.  Ncarb is the worst bullshit system ever.  This is why anti monopoly laws were passed!  Without any competition they have no incentive to provide good service.  Pos ncarb!!!

Dec 16, 13 7:30 pm

Monopolies are "legal" provided you have the backing of the government.

Dec 16, 13 7:33 pm

So was slavery at one time. Legal dosent mean constitutional.  

Dec 16, 13 7:35 pm

My comment was not meant to endorse or excuse the massive pile of bureaucratic excrement called NCARB.

Dec 16, 13 8:02 pm

My fave was that I logged WAY more IDP hours than required. After being registered in WA, went for recriprocity in NY. NY does not accept IDP hours while enrolled in a degree program. Thusly, some of my summer job hours were not valid. NCARB seems to have lost my extra hours, so I was put in the humiliating position of asking my current boss to sign off on more IDP even though I was already registered.

Dec 17, 13 9:17 am

It's their way of helping you shed what little pride you have left.

Dec 17, 13 9:55 am


Dec 17, 13 10:03 am

actually- i figured it out. ISSUE RESOLVED. 

In case anyone else has the same problem: NCARB now requires you to include your High School Information. I accidentally typed the wrong graduation year (2013). Got the month correct... the year... force of habit... 

thanks archinect for the moral support haha

Dec 17, 13 10:35 am

I'm relieved that they require proof of HS Graduation. I was worried about the influx of M.Arch. grads who never completed High School. Lazy bastards.

Dec 17, 13 10:50 am


Dec 17, 13 10:56 am

GED. Good enough education.  So lets say a person dropped out of HS and then got a GED went to a community college etc...then MArch... Can they still be licensed?  

Dec 17, 13 11:10 am

Man. I need to stop using sarcasm. 

Dec 17, 13 11:21 am

No I get you sneaky Pete.  Lol.   I knew you were being sarcastic.  I was just asking a hypothetical question.  

Dec 17, 13 11:25 am

GED works for NCARB. At least they got something right.

Dec 17, 13 11:54 am

My wife (with 1 undergrad, 2 masters & 1 phd) has no HS diploma due to entering college early. She has a GED.

Actually, this is a legit complaint about NCARB, they do not allow alternative paths.

Dec 17, 13 12:24 pm

They say they allow GEDs for the requirement on their website.

Dec 17, 13 12:28 pm

They create a conventional path and consequently a conventional practice,  and then wonder why the profession is failing society and itself. 

Evolutionary Bio 101!

there is no there
Dec 17, 13 1:04 pm

I am pretty sure my NCARB file spent a few years behind a radiator in some packrat's office at NCARB. I actually accused them of this when they told me that they had no record for me or my hours. It took many phone calls till they "found" a record for me although I had records of my original application and cleared checks they had cashed. 

There is nothing more frustrating. Keep good records yourself always

Dec 17, 13 1:15 pm

I used the excel spreadsheets they provided to keep track of hours.

Dec 17, 13 3:21 pm

Just paid the renewal fee today! Woo hoo! (On top of the $800 this year for 2 states worth of reciprocity)

Dec 24, 13 2:00 am

Hello all, they now require the High school diploma or equivalent... That includes GED. I provided that some time ago and gave them a scan copy of my wallet GED certificate because when I filed that, I was in Eugene, Oregon and my full sheet version of the GED certificate with the gold foil seal (after all, both are issued by the state) was 200 miles away in Astoria, Oregon. Therefore, I gave them a scan of it. I wasn't about to give them my formal copy.

I had manage to get my IDP eligibility date awhile ago as well -retroactively (although, it was no longer valid for actually earning the IDP training hours but it was valid enough for IDP eligibility date).

Anyway, the new policy would now make it more easier for gaining IDP training hours and be recognized. It is that finally IDP hours can be recognized without the minimum duration. However, it is necessary to also to comply with state requirements as some states have their own minimum duration.

Gregory WalkerGregory Walker
Dec 25, 13 3:38 pm

jla-x - just for clarification: ncarb has no monopoly. you and i could go start a competitor tomorrow. our main trick would be getting states to adopt our criteria for licensure - without that, why would anyone pay us to join?

i'd love for ncarb to have some competition (really). i'm on record as wanting to throw out idp and rethink the whole thing. that said, what they do well (for licensed professionals) is this: it's far easier and more streamlined to get reciprocity than the way it used to be BECAUSE there's a 'standard' in place that most states recognize. and i'd argue that's good for business overall. 

so, yeah, let's start an alternative. figure out how to safeguard some basic standards for professional practice and create a test for that and we'll see where it goes. i can tell you georgia just about threw ncarb out 2 years ago (not them in particular, but as part of wanting to overhaul all professional standards in the state to be 'georgia only'). it went to the last day of the legislative session. so, we've got a shot!

Dec 25, 13 10:43 pm


Actually, nope you can't so much... At least not as easy as you might think. NCARB is an entity created by a consortium of state licensing boards and expanded as more states formed licensing boards. In essence, NCARB is the state licensing boards. Note the plurality. 

A state doesn't have to be part of NCARB but NCARB itself are the state licensing boards. It is a government owned nonprofit corporation (public nonprifit corporation) comprised of the architectural registration boards. What you can do is create a private non-profit corporation and that would be equivalent to NCBDC. Since it is governmental policy to not accept private certification programs to meet their licensing/certification requirements... UNLESS it is ANSI accredited.

However, the licensing laws were created by AIA and the architecture schools through Closed door politics and potentially illegal bribery of state lesgislature and ultimately created a state sponsored cartel of architects in attempts to limit and control the amount of licensed architects. Originally, these licensing boards did not have any public member but eventually they added public members under scrutiny of public with concerns that government agencies are not having public interest in mind. Public members were not added to architectural licensing boards because they were targetting the architectural licensing but was part of response to other boards and agencies being targetted so changes were made. Even then, the public members portion is minor.

Dec 25, 13 10:52 pm

Well to be more specific, NCARB is a public owned 501(c)6 in that they are a federation of state licensing board that makes up NCARB.

Dec 28, 13 1:14 am

If there are no prospects of practicing in another state can someone tell us the need and direct value of renewal? I assume prestige would be the first answer but if you aren't impressing anyone into a higher fee with 5 letter prestige then what is the direct value?   

Dec 28, 13 8:57 am

You need ncarb to send your record to any state you want to get licensed in, even if they have reciprocity.  If you don't keep your dues up to date there will be a pretty significant penalty once you do need them to transfer your record to a state board. 

There isn't any prestige in having an ncarb record.  They're just parasites.

I agree that NCARB record and particularly the NCARB Certification is not a prestige thing and should not be viewed as such. It simply may make the reciprocity processing quicker because of uniform standards. It costs like a money sucking parasite but it makes the reciprocity process more quicker since some states don't have any active policy for a decade or more, on how to handle issues without an NCARB certificate and have to recreate the policies because the old policies had been discarded a long time ago so they don't even have them to reference on. 

In any case, it shouldn't be looked at as a matter of prestige and most architects don't look at NCARB with any prestige and there is more perceived prestige with AIA membership than there is with NCARB record/certificate.

Dec 28, 13 5:57 pm

There isn't any prestige in having an ncarb record.  They're just parasites.

I agree with you which, as you know, is atypical!  Some people who don't have AIA after their name add the suffix NCARB.  Most people don't know what that is. Some states allow for direct reciprocity, albeit at a higher fee.  So what?  If you don't do this all the time, that could be more economical.  In fact, that's the way it should be.  Again, this is yet another area where the architecture profession makes people bend over.  The accountants, lawyers, doctors, and other professionals tend not to have an "overlay" of an extra certificate to get a license in another state.  They simply apply to that other state.

Dec 28, 13 8:50 pm

Seems to me the only people using NCARB after their names are those who are hoping to draw work from prospective clients who build  in multiple states -- I'm guessing they think that will cause the client to believe it will be easier for the architect to travel with them when necessary.

I've practiced for nearly 40 years and have been licensed for 36 years, with an NCARB file the whole time. I never used the initials after my name and used the reciprocity process only once - but, in hindsight, I always was glad to have the flexibility, if it was ever needed. 

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