I've been out of school for 5 years. I'm currently working on my portfolio and am wondering whether I should include school projects - I've been working on a lot of great projects since I've graduated and would rather focus on them. Any comments?
will galloway
May 2, 07 9:42 pm
rem put his grad project from AA in SMLXL.
if good no problem to include. if looks like student work then fogedaboutit.
darthlook
May 2, 07 9:44 pm
thanks. i just dont want to get a beat down in an interview because there isnt any student work in the portfolio.
Gloominati
May 2, 07 10:13 pm
I don't usually see student work in portfolios from applicants with more than a year or two of fulltime experience since graduation. On the other hand I can think of one firm where the firm's Principal displays a studio project that he did while an M.Arch student in 1988. So I can't say that there's a rule against it. But with 5 years of experience you probably have more than enough professional work to support you. At that level employers are usually most in judging your construction knowledge, management experience, ability to put together complete packages - such as proposals, feasibility studies, and full CD sets. Photos of built work are good to have in your portfolio, as are construction details, one or two complete CD sets, sketches and studies done for professional projects, etc. If you do want to continue to include student work I'd limit it to one great project or a few nice drawings or something like that.
Carl Douglas (agfa8x)
May 2, 07 11:29 pm
As long as they are still relevant, and show currently applicable skills, you should include them.
vado retro
May 2, 07 11:54 pm
use real buildings whenever possible.
liberty bell
May 3, 07 7:02 am
Depends on the interview, IMO. In very broad terms, if you're looking for a job where you will be asked to think, inlcude some work that shows where your interests lie in architectural thought. A thesis or school project might be perfect for this. If you're looking for work related to construction admin, include built projects you've completed.
Basically, use whatever you have to highlight what skills you have relevant to the work you are looking for. I would say 5 years out of school isn't very long, and I'm guessing you're not yet registered? So I think showing good schoolwork is fine, though not as the majority of your portfolio. Maybe only one.
4arch
May 3, 07 9:07 am
I'm in about the same boat as darth and it's a tough call. I'm four years out of school and don't feel like I have much to show for it beyond a ton of cad drawings. My goal is to be a designer rather than a glorified draftsman, so it's hard to get too excited about showing the professional projects I've worked on.
+i
May 3, 07 9:13 am
this is where it is a benefit to have done a research intense thesis and not a "comprehensive project"...
myself and eight of my fellow alums all know we got our jobs (and subsequent jobs years later) based not only on firm experience but the strength of our theses in our portfolios.
as jump said-
if it's strong, put it in there. if it isnt, i wouldnt totally leave it out and replace it with a bunch of ridiculous CD's... i would revamp it and put it back in as a student project. (be realistic- obviously your 5th year thesis is not going to be as good as that international competition you worked on at X-firm with 12 other people)
isnt the point of a portfolio to show a progression and logical learned sequence?
vado retro
May 3, 07 9:13 am
a designer is a glorified draftsman.
+i
May 3, 07 9:14 am
as a sidenote-
a friend of mine just interviewed at a few firms here in DC (grad 3 years ago)... and he didnt include any work from his student years. a few of the firms turned him down because they wanted to see his work on his own as well as the work he did at the firm. they found it deceiving to only show work from firms.
i tend to agree.
+i
May 3, 07 9:15 am
YESSSS 400 posts :)
Fred Scharmen
May 3, 07 9:26 am
vado, you sound really bitter, man. Do you wanna talk about it?
evilplatypus
May 3, 07 10:44 am
Ive been 50/ 50 - just a couple years out of school nobody even looked at the school work in my portfolio, some didnt even look at the portfolio, but my last interview the principle specificly wanted to see school work - from 7 years ago - go figure - theres no right answer - just be prepared to go any direction the interview takes you.
larslarson
May 3, 07 11:04 am
personally i include student work from back then..10 years out of
school now and i have about 10-20 projects under my belt..but
i only show four or five of those. i feel like my student work shows
some of my personality..and shows i can draw/think etc.
but i also bring cd sets/ competition boards etc. the portfolio only
starts the conversation.
will galloway
May 3, 07 11:09 am
vado is always so smart.
...not sure about the above bit of pithy wisdom though. in my experience (as a design architect) drafting is a very poor use of my time (and wages/salary), specially on bigger projects. this is not always a good thing, but still true...
in my portfolio i still have one student project, and 3 professional competitions i did as a student with european (licenced) students...
i seldom show these works to clients but did show them during interviews when looking for a job...like liberty bell says it depends on the audience...
vado retro
May 3, 07 11:09 am
if you think you are designer. what the fuck does that mean? everything is design. everything is detail. if you expect someone else to work out the details then you are a half ass.
4arch
May 3, 07 11:17 am
i don't expect someone else to work out the details for me. i just don't want to be the one working out the details for my boss forever.
vado retro
May 3, 07 11:26 am
then marry a rich girl.
work for idle hands
May 3, 07 11:32 am
its all about presentation. you can sell a school project better than another persons fully executed and built project if you know what you're doing and value the project. if you put in school work and they ignore it its probably becuase you're presenting it as 'oh this is just an old school project i did once'.
one thing you can do is present maybe one school project that you consider your best and then kind of a 'greatest hits' of other school work. i have a few very nice hand models and hand drawings for various projects which i don't necessarily need to be fully shown as projects but i show bits and pieces as an example of my craft skills.
you have to decide, only you, what is the best of your best regardless of what it is. but variety is key, cadd details, basswood models, sketches, is all relevent....its all PRESENTATION.
J3
May 3, 07 12:46 pm
Yes to many of the above...but I would add this...
I've been interviewing candidates lately in my office (from recent grad to 14+ years exp.) and have this to add. I would definitely add work that shows your design process (yes from initial concept to the most minute detail). There is nothing more boring than a portfolio full of crappy shots of completed work and CAD drawings. Variety is very important. I want to see thinking...creativity...process! If including school work will show this, then by all means show it.
thenewold
May 3, 07 1:22 pm
I still include about 50% school or otherwise extra cirricular (side) projects in portfolios precisely because I'm looking for the 'right' kind of offices to respond. It's a little like fishing and I always feel mostly in the driver's seat in interviews (I'm interviewing the office as well) so I don't feel the need to focus only on professional or managerial bonefides. If an interviewer makes a snide comment about the inclusion of non professional work, I probably don't want to work there....
whistler
May 3, 07 3:59 pm
Forget the school projects asap unless it shows a skill or aspect that isn't covered in the real world projects.
will galloway
May 4, 07 8:57 am
i am surprised at that pov whistler, but respect it, coming from you.
as for drafting, well, i draft for my own work in my own office cuz there are only 2 of us, but in my work with old firm (kind of freelance-ish) it is far easier for me to sketch details and hav the young feller draft it up proper. That is called delegation and it is so important to making my life bearable it isn't funny....
Steven Ward
May 4, 07 9:11 am
i've gotten a lot of mileage out of my masters project, a study of an urban neighborhood that is becoming a very impt 'next step' in our city. it's a good point-of-entry in talking about current urban issues affecting our downtown.
nothing else, though.
mon11
Dec 19, 17 9:44 pm
if you've been working full time for 2+ years and plan on returning to grad school, would you start your application portfolio off with professional/built work (followed by undergrad and personal work)? or are schools more interested in seeing undergrad work?
Non Sequitur
Dec 19, 17 9:48 pm
Maybe start by not resurrecting 10-year old threads. You'll need better research skills than that if you want to make it through grad school. Schools want to see how to develop ideas into compelling projects. Work towards that when building a portfolio.
mon11
Dec 19, 17 11:53 pm
the fact that this is a 10-year old thread is besides the point. this is an appropriate thread to bring up a somewhat related question, rather than starting a new one. i'm not sure what you're trying to get at, besides being contemptuous as usual.
i've done my research and i'll continue to do so. i am asking on this forum for opinions/past experiences, just like the others on this thread have done. thank you for yours.
3tk
Dec 20, 17 1:19 pm
Would most likely depend on your professional work. If its cutting edge, relevant to the programs pedagogy and shows a level of academic ability, then yes. If it's run of the mill stuff, then less interesting to see. It is 2 yrs, but not that long ago back to undergrad work - there's always good to clean them up and update the graphics
.
mon11
Dec 20, 17 3:23 pm
thank you 3tk!
randomised
Dec 21, 17 2:18 pm
It depends on the scope of the work you did and how you want to organise your work in the portfolio: by scale, chronological, theme, location, etc. There's something to say for all of those strategies. I usually rearrange the order of my portfolio for every interview to build a specific narrative tailored to what I want to communicate and who I am addressing.
I've been out of school for 5 years. I'm currently working on my portfolio and am wondering whether I should include school projects - I've been working on a lot of great projects since I've graduated and would rather focus on them. Any comments?
rem put his grad project from AA in SMLXL.
if good no problem to include. if looks like student work then fogedaboutit.
thanks. i just dont want to get a beat down in an interview because there isnt any student work in the portfolio.
I don't usually see student work in portfolios from applicants with more than a year or two of fulltime experience since graduation. On the other hand I can think of one firm where the firm's Principal displays a studio project that he did while an M.Arch student in 1988. So I can't say that there's a rule against it. But with 5 years of experience you probably have more than enough professional work to support you. At that level employers are usually most in judging your construction knowledge, management experience, ability to put together complete packages - such as proposals, feasibility studies, and full CD sets. Photos of built work are good to have in your portfolio, as are construction details, one or two complete CD sets, sketches and studies done for professional projects, etc. If you do want to continue to include student work I'd limit it to one great project or a few nice drawings or something like that.
As long as they are still relevant, and show currently applicable skills, you should include them.
use real buildings whenever possible.
Depends on the interview, IMO. In very broad terms, if you're looking for a job where you will be asked to think, inlcude some work that shows where your interests lie in architectural thought. A thesis or school project might be perfect for this. If you're looking for work related to construction admin, include built projects you've completed.
Basically, use whatever you have to highlight what skills you have relevant to the work you are looking for. I would say 5 years out of school isn't very long, and I'm guessing you're not yet registered? So I think showing good schoolwork is fine, though not as the majority of your portfolio. Maybe only one.
I'm in about the same boat as darth and it's a tough call. I'm four years out of school and don't feel like I have much to show for it beyond a ton of cad drawings. My goal is to be a designer rather than a glorified draftsman, so it's hard to get too excited about showing the professional projects I've worked on.
this is where it is a benefit to have done a research intense thesis and not a "comprehensive project"...
myself and eight of my fellow alums all know we got our jobs (and subsequent jobs years later) based not only on firm experience but the strength of our theses in our portfolios.
as jump said-
if it's strong, put it in there. if it isnt, i wouldnt totally leave it out and replace it with a bunch of ridiculous CD's... i would revamp it and put it back in as a student project. (be realistic- obviously your 5th year thesis is not going to be as good as that international competition you worked on at X-firm with 12 other people)
isnt the point of a portfolio to show a progression and logical learned sequence?
a designer is a glorified draftsman.
as a sidenote-
a friend of mine just interviewed at a few firms here in DC (grad 3 years ago)... and he didnt include any work from his student years. a few of the firms turned him down because they wanted to see his work on his own as well as the work he did at the firm. they found it deceiving to only show work from firms.
i tend to agree.
YESSSS 400 posts :)
vado, you sound really bitter, man. Do you wanna talk about it?
Ive been 50/ 50 - just a couple years out of school nobody even looked at the school work in my portfolio, some didnt even look at the portfolio, but my last interview the principle specificly wanted to see school work - from 7 years ago - go figure - theres no right answer - just be prepared to go any direction the interview takes you.
personally i include student work from back then..10 years out of
school now and i have about 10-20 projects under my belt..but
i only show four or five of those. i feel like my student work shows
some of my personality..and shows i can draw/think etc.
but i also bring cd sets/ competition boards etc. the portfolio only
starts the conversation.
vado is always so smart.
...not sure about the above bit of pithy wisdom though. in my experience (as a design architect) drafting is a very poor use of my time (and wages/salary), specially on bigger projects. this is not always a good thing, but still true...
in my portfolio i still have one student project, and 3 professional competitions i did as a student with european (licenced) students...
i seldom show these works to clients but did show them during interviews when looking for a job...like liberty bell says it depends on the audience...
if you think you are designer. what the fuck does that mean? everything is design. everything is detail. if you expect someone else to work out the details then you are a half ass.
i don't expect someone else to work out the details for me. i just don't want to be the one working out the details for my boss forever.
then marry a rich girl.
its all about presentation. you can sell a school project better than another persons fully executed and built project if you know what you're doing and value the project. if you put in school work and they ignore it its probably becuase you're presenting it as 'oh this is just an old school project i did once'.
one thing you can do is present maybe one school project that you consider your best and then kind of a 'greatest hits' of other school work. i have a few very nice hand models and hand drawings for various projects which i don't necessarily need to be fully shown as projects but i show bits and pieces as an example of my craft skills.
you have to decide, only you, what is the best of your best regardless of what it is. but variety is key, cadd details, basswood models, sketches, is all relevent....its all PRESENTATION.
Yes to many of the above...but I would add this...
I've been interviewing candidates lately in my office (from recent grad to 14+ years exp.) and have this to add. I would definitely add work that shows your design process (yes from initial concept to the most minute detail). There is nothing more boring than a portfolio full of crappy shots of completed work and CAD drawings. Variety is very important. I want to see thinking...creativity...process! If including school work will show this, then by all means show it.
I still include about 50% school or otherwise extra cirricular (side) projects in portfolios precisely because I'm looking for the 'right' kind of offices to respond. It's a little like fishing and I always feel mostly in the driver's seat in interviews (I'm interviewing the office as well) so I don't feel the need to focus only on professional or managerial bonefides. If an interviewer makes a snide comment about the inclusion of non professional work, I probably don't want to work there....
Forget the school projects asap unless it shows a skill or aspect that isn't covered in the real world projects.
i am surprised at that pov whistler, but respect it, coming from you.
as for drafting, well, i draft for my own work in my own office cuz there are only 2 of us, but in my work with old firm (kind of freelance-ish) it is far easier for me to sketch details and hav the young feller draft it up proper. That is called delegation and it is so important to making my life bearable it isn't funny....
i've gotten a lot of mileage out of my masters project, a study of an urban neighborhood that is becoming a very impt 'next step' in our city. it's a good point-of-entry in talking about current urban issues affecting our downtown.
nothing else, though.
if you've been working full time for 2+ years and plan on returning to grad school, would you start your application portfolio off with professional/built work (followed by undergrad and personal work)? or are schools more interested in seeing undergrad work?
Maybe start by not resurrecting 10-year old threads. You'll need better research skills than that if you want to make it through grad school. Schools want to see how to develop ideas into compelling projects. Work towards that when building a portfolio.
the fact that this is a 10-year old thread is besides the point. this is an appropriate thread to bring up a somewhat related question, rather than starting a new one. i'm not sure what you're trying to get at, besides being contemptuous as usual. i've done my research and i'll continue to do so. i am asking on this forum for opinions/past experiences, just like the others on this thread have done. thank you for yours.
Would most likely depend on your professional work. If its cutting edge, relevant to the programs pedagogy and shows a level of academic ability, then yes. If it's run of the mill stuff, then less interesting to see. It is 2 yrs, but not that long ago back to undergrad work - there's always good to clean them up and update the graphics .
thank you 3tk!
It depends on the scope of the work you did and how you want to organise your work in the portfolio: by scale, chronological, theme, location, etc. There's something to say for all of those strategies. I usually rearrange the order of my portfolio for every interview to build a specific narrative tailored to what I want to communicate and who I am addressing.