hi! my feeling is its not really about merit entirely but also about your ability to fit into the willingness to learn a plethora of pedagogy and expand on existing interests and beyond, which are demonstrated in the portfolio submitted. As the course (im talking about MArch I/II) is half non arch bg, its not really about skillset and previous experience but about potential. Based on this, I think it is 'easier' to get in than other architecture schools, but I don't believe it impacts the quality of learning and scope of what students can produce. having attended previous open houses and seminars, i think the people who usually attend are also highly intelligent empathetic individuals.
archi_gram
Mar 13, 22 12:36 am
I won't say half. Very very few are non-arc background nowadays
e_zam
Apr 21, 22 4:23 pm
hey sabbyyuu great portfolio. It's always great to see 4 year degrees get jobs in big offices. One of my colleagues (head designer) at my last firm worked at David Chipperfield's office here in the US. Do you have any tips or advise as to how to get admitted into a firm like that or Norman Foster's with a pre-professional degree? Also, congrats on your admissions!
reanq
Mar 4, 23 11:37 pm
I know its extremely weird to dig out the old thread, but I just want to say I agree with you Sab 120% about your statement on how grad archi schools select students. I'm a GSD MArch I student and about to graduate this may. I felt suuuper imposter syndrome when I got in because of my mixed background of archi theory and tech, and my portfolio was a dumpster of micro-geopolitical urban design, installation-ish temporary building, and speculative film. Like why did they choose me? Am I really going to be a "good enough" architect? After 3.5 years of sleep deprivation, the answer is, ironically, no. I'm sure I am not aspiring to pursue architectural practice, and I totally thank GSD for their decision to let me in. It is all about "personal potentials"; even in a dogmatic school like GSD they still value this more than anything, and they acknowledge my potential as a designer of interdisciplinary practices and researches. (p.s. your portfolio is so well-structured, insightfully narrated, concisely represented. one of the best student portfolio I've ever seen. thank you for sharing)
221120
Mar 10, 22 12:58 pm
well...if we purely look at numbers... yes
the gsd has a higher acceptance rate among the east coast schools due to its large class size.
gsd used to publish a "factbook" every year, and the admission rate was about 15% across the whole school (2018), while the admission rate for its neighbor down on mass ave was between 3% and 7% over the past few years
EvanTang
Mar 21, 22 12:15 am
Definitely not for international student
hcth
Mar 23, 22 7:31 pm
All of my friends who I'm referring to are international students
Non Sequitur
Mar 23, 22 7:32 pm
The door is always open to those paying the big tuition freedom dollars.
kidomega
Mar 24, 22 12:42 am
I noticed from years of looking at these Application threads that international students that usually get in (a) have received bachelor's degrees in the US; (b) come from a usual pool of schools that get admitted to the GSD; (c) have limited years of work experience, if not straight out of their bachelor's.
EvanTang
Apr 1, 22 10:39 pm
Thank you for your reply. I guess I overestimated the value of the portfolio and essay, while underestimating the importance of the other materials & background.
kidomega
Apr 2, 22 4:49 am
Suppose meritocracy has the heavier weight in selecting and decision-making acceptances. In that case, schools like the GSD have to accept more than what they're already taking. By accepting more, they lower their passing rate and elite reputation.
^sabbyyuu's comment can be one perspective as to why there's a pseudo-bias preference for international students who've attained education in a familiar system and are less-experienced/fresh from their bachelor's because they're not far off yet to acclimate to their postgraduate pedagogy.
kidomega
Apr 2, 22 5:08 am
(they *increase their passing rate)
kidomega
Apr 2, 22 5:15 am
(they *increase their passing rate but it affects their elite reputation)
kidomega
Apr 2, 22 5:46 am
I believe someone said in another thread that graduate school is all experimental. There's an element of systemic capitalism and sociopolitics in any institution that grants or decides who can be part of them or not (the rest is mainly being able to earn from those willing). And that's when other factors come into play in the decision-making process. Doesn't Harvard have an extension school marketed explic
itly for those with a "decade-old GPA"? Do decade-old + GPAs not belong in the primary graduate schools?
So, even if you've worked five years or more and have a stellar portfolio and essay polished by alumni with recommendations, if they find you somehow no longer "fit" for their standard or desired demographic, it's no longer your shortcoming you didn't get in.
EvanTang
Apr 3, 22 7:22 am
Many thanks for the perspective you provided. I've been thinking a lot lately and have decided to take a break from this career. But I still want to communicate and thus better review the process. Here is my portfolio if you are interested.
This is an elite portfolio Evan. May I know if you’ve tried applying to any other schools and how were they?
kidomega
Apr 3, 22 10:56 am
That's a mighty impressive portfolio—possibly one of the best ones I've seen shared on this site. If admissions rejected you with that, then it's not your loss.
HeptagonAgency
Apr 3, 22 11:12 am
Absolutely — it’s their loss. I’ve seen really, like really, mediocre portfolios that end up making to the GSD and sometimes I wonder if they make admissions not based on merit but on -
diversity- instead.
monosierra
Apr 3, 22 1:50 pm
The one downside is that it might seem a bit too similar to other applicants with comparable backgrounds. The quality is there but you might be missing a "WOW" moment that some portfolios have.
This brings in the question of diversity as HeptagonAgency alluded to. Say, there's a sculptor, poet, or investment banker who want to switch to architecture and who have a pretty solid portfolio given their backgrounds - but not as thorougly architectural as your's.
You will be competing not against them but the best students from Berkeley, HKU, NUS, Wash U, McGill - and they might just have edged your work at the margin. A stunning model shot, for instance, or a project that really stands out in its inception, process, and execution.
In building a "diverse" class, a former banker might be offered admission despite having less architectural projects while you may have been rejected because a comparable bloke with an architectural degree had a better portfolio in the eyes of the committee.
Ultimately, it doesn't matter - the future remains in your hands and plenty of folks do very well even if they didn't go to their dream school. It is what you do in school and in practice that counts. A ton of folks from my class straight up left architecture right after graduation, regardless of their academic performance.
EvanTang
Apr 3, 22 10:46 pm
Thank you all very much, especially kidomega, who started the conversation. This forum has opened the door to a new world for me. monosierra, your comments are exactly what I was expecting. I am missing some of the instant inspiration and passion to put it into practice, making my architecture often fall into homogeneity. Actually, I sent my portfolio to some of my European architectural colleagues, who seem to be uninterested in commenting due to the lack of highlight moments. HeptagonAgency's point about diversity also inspired me. I thought I was special, adding many relevant topics and thinking around architecture, but in fact most architecture students/architects in the world do this, just at a different depth of thinking. This meant that my career possibilities as an architectural practitioner were limited. From what the top school saw, I was just another ordinary person obsessed with the architecture itself. I didn't apply for many architecture degrees because I wanted to enter the field of technology to seek potentially greater possibilities. During my years of work, I realized that society lacks a well-developed system and an atmosphere of discussion, so something "hardcore" might support my career path better. I used the same portfolio to apply for some computational design-related degrees and expected it to impress some schools. Ironically, I received rejection letters from GSD (march2), UCB (maad), CMU (mscd), Cornell (mdc), etc., except for UCLA which offered me the earliest offer in February, so I still have a chance to set foot in the US this year. Anyway, My original intention was to express some different views on this topic. And again I sincerely thank you all for your perspectives.
sabbyyuu
Apr 4, 22 9:23 am
kidomega, hi - as an international stuednt here I disagree with your statement that itl's who get accepted come from a usual pool/limited professional experience. speaking to the eu/british system specifically, it is required to gain experience before embarking on your MArch, and from my observations i've noticed it to be the opposite with US students, most of whom have pursued their graduate degrees straight of their bachelors.
sabbyyuu
Apr 4, 22 9:30 am
hi Evan, nice portfolio, layout and design work/diagrams but my comment would be the lack of personality in the work might have been the reason for the rejections perhaps? I mean, you can clearly design and are very well read but maybe these schools are looking for more of an empathetic design sensibility, a willingness to engage in a diversity of pedagogies and experimentation.. the portfolio should showcase a variety of projects and not just in one 'style'/pedagogy. Its a suppper polished out portfolio, which is great for when seeking professional work and maybe its even better for applying to 'technogolical' courses you speak of, but idk maybe this is just my perspective but I think its equally valuable to show stuff that is also 'messy'/wip. Like i mentioned previously the layout is good, but maybe the portfolio could breathe a bit more? It's hard to focus on one page and to really understand the narrative of each project..
Have you applied to only US institutions?
oops i sent it without any description by mistake but this is what i used to apply to the bartlett. i presented a similar one to all my other schools (was accepted to gsd, yale, sci arc, gsapp, aa, rca, bartlett .. waiting for others in EU).
bvz7
Apr 4, 22 9:40 am
sab super cool portfolio. love it
kidomega
Apr 4, 22 3:49 pm
sabbyyuu - There aren't as many placements for international students in most of these ivy US M.Arch programs (and don't even get started on scholarships), hence the ones that get usually admitted somehow have those three factors I mentioned above (in addition to their meritocratic credentials, of course). No one is admitted solely for their portfolio/essay/recs/CV/GPA/GRE/TOEFL and other physical requirements. For institutions like the GSD, especially for those with architectural/design backgrounds, where you come from can be an invisible but vital factor, but isn't necessarily cultural or geographical to comply with a diversity requirement. I saw your portfolio and it's very impressive and unsurprisingly deserving of all your acceptances, but it's also undeniable you have had the extra edge of already coming from The Bartlett (a common "pool" school of the Ivies and even of other non-ivy schools), which shares almost similar academic sensibilities to the American/European GSDs and SOAs. For all we know, you could be one of the international students they chose over Evan. My point is international applicants with a fully foreign education/background like Evan, despite all the merits of his application, are likely to be overlooked in favor, as monosierra puts it above, of the best (international/domestic) students from the usual pool of schools (a.k.a. part of their network for student exchanges and/or competitors) that get admitted---which can or is part of a larger systemic issue that is often brushed under the rug by such institutions and commonly disguised through academic/moral compatibility narrative.
EvanTang
Apr 5, 22 1:28 am
Hi sabbyyuu, thank you for sharing your portfolio. I am amazed by your mastery of imagery and narrative techniques. On the personality part, my definition is slow self-awareness, like before Trump, I didn't even know the difference between democrat/ republican. But gradually I became more aware of the relationship between society and the role of an architect. The direction of research in my portfolio is unusual for my environment and my peers, and these kinds of topics don't usually come up in people's daily chats/academic discussions. In this way I believe I am unique. Many of my classmates were willing to spend over $10k to seek the help of tutoring agencies to produce a short-term "personality-enhancing" drawing that objectively helped them get into good schools. But I prefer to take a relatively slow path, and perhaps at some point I can express my character more succinctly and strongly, as you do, rather than obsessing over irrelevant digressions. Your portfolio has qualities that I like, and I wish you the best of luck in getting the results you want in the March program.
sabbyyuu
Apr 5, 22 4:54 am
hi kidomega! thank you!! just a quicky i didnt go to the bartlett I went to the university of westminser haha. which isnt even in the top 50 UK schools I think @_@
Questions
Apr 5, 22 3:54 pm
Sabbyyuu has put together a helpful explanation of top ivy league admissions.
Something about this conversation between Saby and Ethan felt very wholesome to me.
2 years ago, I applied, and of course, I was rejected by every school I applied to, I got on the waitlist for GSAPP, and that was about it.
Graduate school was my ultimate goal, and I tried so hard to be unique in my essay, which turned out to be weird and goofy. It seemed I was being unique, but no one understood what I was attempting to convey or my clear stand on architecture.
Many students are given the advice that they should be unique, but what does it mean to be unique really, when uniqueness quality is based on a particular committee standard on that particular year.
When I found out the result of my graduate application process, I was so heartbroken. At the moment, I am working, and I would like to apply again, being less unique but maybe being a bit more clear about what I am trying to accomplish.
EvanTang
Mar 23, 22 10:14 pm
If you don't mind, can you describe the general background of your friend? I worked for five years, spent a lot of time polishing my portfolio and ps, and got some GSD alumni to review and recommend. But the result was unsatisfactory and some friends with similar background as mine were rejected. No offense, you have your reasons, but the reality I see is obviously different.
hcth
Apr 12, 22 9:33 pm
My friend has a similar background as what @kidomega mentioned. They have received bachelor's degrees in the US (not a Top 10 school but I would say top 20) and they have limited years of work experience. They are not the top students in class but they all did pretty well. I did take a look at your portfolio, I would say it is a good portfolio from my perspective but I definitely agree with all the above comments that it still missing a 'wow' moment. The layout is smooth and clean so you did a great job on that, but nothing impressed me in particular.
greenlander1
Apr 13, 22 10:24 am
On a % basis, unlikely much change unless the overall demand for architecture schooling has changed.
Admissions is extremely discretionary so there's gonna be a lot of variance.
A number of my friends got accepted into GSD but rejected by other schools. Is GSD accepting more students nowadays?
which program did they apply to?
Mostly MArch I/II but also MDes
I'd like to see some cases of admitted MDes candidates
https://instagram.com/gsd.conf...
hi! my feeling is its not really about merit entirely but also about your ability to fit into the willingness to learn a plethora of pedagogy and expand on existing interests and beyond, which are demonstrated in the portfolio submitted. As the course (im talking about MArch I/II) is half non arch bg, its not really about skillset and previous experience but about potential. Based on this, I think it is 'easier' to get in than other architecture schools, but I don't believe it impacts the quality of learning and scope of what students can produce. having attended previous open houses and seminars, i think the people who usually attend are also highly intelligent empathetic individuals.
I won't say half. Very very few are non-arc background nowadays
hey sabbyyuu great portfolio. It's always great to see 4 year degrees get jobs in big offices. One of my colleagues (head designer) at my last firm worked at David Chipperfield's office here in the US. Do you have any tips or advise as to how to get admitted into a firm like that or Norman Foster's with a pre-professional degree? Also, congrats on your admissions!
I know its extremely weird to dig out the old thread, but I just want to say I agree with you Sab 120% about your statement on how grad archi schools select students. I'm a GSD MArch I student and about to graduate this may. I felt suuuper imposter syndrome when I got in because of my mixed background of archi theory and tech, and my portfolio was a dumpster of micro-geopolitical urban design, installation-ish temporary building, and speculative film. Like why did they choose me? Am I really going to be a "good enough" architect? After 3.5 years of sleep deprivation, the answer is, ironically, no. I'm sure I am not aspiring to pursue architectural practice, and I totally thank GSD for their decision to let me in. It is all about "personal potentials"; even in a dogmatic school like GSD they still value this more than anything, and they acknowledge my potential as a designer of interdisciplinary practices and researches. (p.s. your portfolio is so well-structured, insightfully narrated, concisely represented. one of the best student portfolio I've ever seen. thank you for sharing)
well...if we purely look at numbers... yes
the gsd has a higher acceptance rate among the east coast schools due to its large class size.
gsd used to publish a "factbook" every year, and the admission rate was about 15% across the whole school (2018), while the admission rate for its neighbor down on mass ave was between 3% and 7% over the past few years
Definitely not for international student
All of my friends who I'm referring to are international students
The door is always open to those paying the big tuition freedom dollars.
I noticed from years of looking at these Application threads that international students that usually get in (a) have received bachelor's degrees in the US; (b) come from a usual pool of schools that get admitted to the GSD; (c) have limited years of work experience, if not straight out of their bachelor's.
Thank you for your reply. I guess I overestimated the value of the portfolio and essay, while underestimating the importance of the other materials & background.
Suppose meritocracy has the heavier weight in selecting and decision-making acceptances. In that case, schools like the GSD have to accept more than what they're already taking. By accepting more, they lower their passing rate and elite reputation. ^sabbyyuu's comment can be one perspective as to why there's a pseudo-bias preference for international students who've attained education in a familiar system and are less-experienced/fresh from their bachelor's because they're not far off yet to acclimate to their postgraduate pedagogy.
(they *increase their passing rate)
(they *increase their passing rate but it affects their elite reputation)
I believe someone said in another thread that graduate school is all experimental. There's an element of systemic capitalism and sociopolitics in any institution that grants or decides who can be part of them or not (the rest is mainly being able to earn from those willing). And that's when other factors come into play in the decision-making process. Doesn't Harvard have an extension school marketed explic itly for those with a "decade-old GPA"? Do decade-old + GPAs not belong in the primary graduate schools? So, even if you've worked five years or more and have a stellar portfolio and essay polished by alumni with recommendations, if they find you somehow no longer "fit" for their standard or desired demographic, it's no longer your shortcoming you didn't get in.
Many thanks for the perspective you provided. I've been thinking a lot lately and have decided to take a break from this career. But I still want to communicate and thus better review the process. Here is my portfolio if you are interested.
https://issuu.com/evantang/docs/portfolio-12_x_18_0123
Comments from all others are also welcome.
This is an elite portfolio Evan. May I know if you’ve tried applying to any other schools and how were they?
That's a mighty impressive portfolio—possibly one of the best ones I've seen shared on this site. If admissions rejected you with that, then it's not your loss.
Absolutely — it’s their loss. I’ve seen really, like really, mediocre portfolios that end up making to the GSD and sometimes I wonder if they make admissions not based on merit but on -
diversity- instead.
The one downside is that it might seem a bit too similar to other applicants with comparable backgrounds. The quality is there but you might be missing a "WOW" moment that some portfolios have.
This brings in the question of diversity as HeptagonAgency alluded to. Say, there's a sculptor, poet, or investment banker who want to switch to architecture and who have a pretty solid portfolio given their backgrounds - but not as thorougly architectural as your's.
You will be competing not against them but the best students from Berkeley, HKU, NUS, Wash U, McGill - and they might just have edged your work at the margin. A stunning model shot, for instance, or a project that really stands out in its inception, process, and execution.
In building a "diverse" class, a former banker might be offered admission despite having less architectural projects while you may have been rejected because a comparable bloke with an architectural degree had a better portfolio in the eyes of the committee.
Ultimately, it doesn't matter - the future remains in your hands and plenty of folks do very well even if they didn't go to their dream school. It is what you do in school and in practice that counts. A ton of folks from my class straight up left architecture right after graduation, regardless of their academic performance.
Thank you all very much, especially kidomega, who started the conversation. This forum has opened the door to a new world for me. monosierra, your comments are exactly what I was expecting. I am missing some of the instant inspiration and passion to put it into practice, making my architecture often fall into homogeneity. Actually, I sent my portfolio to some of my European architectural colleagues, who seem to be uninterested in commenting due to the lack of highlight moments. HeptagonAgency's point about diversity also inspired me. I thought I was special, adding many relevant topics and thinking around architecture, but in fact most architecture students/architects in the world do this, just at a different depth of thinking. This meant that my career possibilities as an architectural practitioner were limited. From what the top school saw, I was just another ordinary person obsessed with the architecture itself. I didn't apply for many architecture degrees because I wanted to enter the field of technology to seek potentially greater possibilities. During my years of work, I realized that society lacks a well-developed system and an atmosphere of discussion, so something "hardcore" might support my career path better. I used the same portfolio to apply for some computational design-related degrees and expected it to impress some schools. Ironically, I received rejection letters from GSD (march2), UCB (maad), CMU (mscd), Cornell (mdc), etc., except for UCLA which offered me the earliest offer in February, so I still have a chance to set foot in the US this year. Anyway, My original intention was to express some different views on this topic. And again I sincerely thank you all for your perspectives.
kidomega, hi - as an international stuednt here I disagree with your statement that itl's who get accepted come from a usual pool/limited professional experience. speaking to the eu/british system specifically, it is required to gain experience before embarking on your MArch, and from my observations i've noticed it to be the opposite with US students, most of whom have pursued their graduate degrees straight of their bachelors.
hi Evan, nice portfolio, layout and design work/diagrams but my comment would be the lack of personality in the work might have been the reason for the rejections perhaps? I mean, you can clearly design and are very well read but maybe these schools are looking for more of an empathetic design sensibility, a willingness to engage in a diversity of pedagogies and experimentation.. the portfolio should showcase a variety of projects and not just in one 'style'/pedagogy. Its a suppper polished out portfolio, which is great for when seeking professional work and maybe its even better for applying to 'technogolical' courses you speak of, but idk maybe this is just my perspective but I think its equally valuable to show stuff that is also 'messy'/wip. Like i mentioned previously the layout is good, but maybe the portfolio could breathe a bit more? It's hard to focus on one page and to really understand the narrative of each project.. Have you applied to only US institutions?
https://issuu.com/sabrahislam/docs/sabrah_islam_bartlett_2022
oops i sent it without any description by mistake but this is what i used to apply to the bartlett. i presented a similar one to all my other schools (was accepted to gsd, yale, sci arc, gsapp, aa, rca, bartlett .. waiting for others in EU).
sab super cool portfolio. love it
sabbyyuu - There aren't as many placements for international students in most of these ivy US M.Arch programs (and don't even get started on scholarships), hence the ones that get usually admitted somehow have those three factors I mentioned above (in addition to their meritocratic credentials, of course). No one is admitted solely for their portfolio/essay/recs/CV/GPA/GRE/TOEFL and other physical requirements. For institutions like the GSD, especially for those with architectural/design backgrounds, where you come from can be an invisible but vital factor, but isn't necessarily cultural or geographical to comply with a diversity requirement. I saw your portfolio and it's very impressive and unsurprisingly deserving of all your acceptances, but it's also undeniable you have had the extra edge of already coming from The Bartlett (a common "pool" school of the Ivies and even of other non-ivy schools), which shares almost similar academic sensibilities to the American/European GSDs and SOAs. For all we know, you could be one of the international students they chose over Evan. My point is international applicants with a fully foreign education/background like Evan, despite all the merits of his application, are likely to be overlooked in favor, as monosierra puts it above, of the best (international/domestic) students from the usual pool of schools (a.k.a. part of their network for student exchanges and/or competitors) that get admitted---which can or is part of a larger systemic issue that is often brushed under the rug by such institutions and commonly disguised through academic/moral compatibility narrative.
Hi sabbyyuu, thank you for sharing your portfolio. I am amazed by your mastery of imagery and narrative techniques. On the personality part, my definition is slow self-awareness, like before Trump, I didn't even know the difference between democrat/ republican. But gradually I became more aware of the relationship between society and the role of an architect. The direction of research in my portfolio is unusual for my environment and my peers, and these kinds of topics don't usually come up in people's daily chats/academic discussions. In this way I believe I am unique. Many of my classmates were willing to spend over $10k to seek the help of tutoring agencies to produce a short-term "personality-enhancing" drawing that objectively helped them get into good schools. But I prefer to take a relatively slow path, and perhaps at some point I can express my character more succinctly and strongly, as you do, rather than obsessing over irrelevant digressions. Your portfolio has qualities that I like, and I wish you the best of luck in getting the results you want in the March program.
hi kidomega! thank you!! just a quicky i didnt go to the bartlett I went to the university of westminser haha. which isnt even in the top 50 UK schools I think @_@
Sabbyyuu has put together a helpful explanation of top ivy league admissions. Something about this conversation between Saby and Ethan felt very wholesome to me. 2 years ago, I applied, and of course, I was rejected by every school I applied to, I got on the waitlist for GSAPP, and that was about it. Graduate school was my ultimate goal, and I tried so hard to be unique in my essay, which turned out to be weird and goofy. It seemed I was being unique, but no one understood what I was attempting to convey or my clear stand on architecture. Many students are given the advice that they should be unique, but what does it mean to be unique really, when uniqueness quality is based on a particular committee standard on that particular year. When I found out the result of my graduate application process, I was so heartbroken. At the moment, I am working, and I would like to apply again, being less unique but maybe being a bit more clear about what I am trying to accomplish.
If you don't mind, can you describe the general background of your friend? I worked for five years, spent a lot of time polishing my portfolio and ps, and got some GSD alumni to review and recommend. But the result was unsatisfactory and some friends with similar background as mine were rejected. No offense, you have your reasons, but the reality I see is obviously different.
My friend has a similar background as what @kidomega mentioned. They have received bachelor's degrees in the US (not a Top 10 school but I would say top 20) and they have limited years of work experience. They are not the top students in class but they all did pretty well. I did take a look at your portfolio, I would say it is a good portfolio from my perspective but I definitely agree with all the above comments that it still missing a 'wow' moment. The layout is smooth and clean so you did a great job on that, but nothing impressed me in particular.
On a % basis, unlikely much change unless the overall demand for architecture schooling has changed.
Admissions is extremely discretionary so there's gonna be a lot of variance.