Question. Currently working on a project that the whole A&E team is doing in Revit 2019. The M&P firm sends an updated dated model in Revit 2020. This would be a mistake on their part correct.? They should not expect the rest of the team to upgrade to Revit 2020 during the middle of a project should they? Or am I wrong? I would very much appreciate some other opinions.
Thank you!
Chad Miller
Oct 2, 20 10:03 am
Hopefully someone at the MEP firm simply mistakenly upgraded the model and sent it out to you as changing Revit versions in the middle of a project is not normal.
If this wasn't an accident then you're fucked. You can't save down a Revit model so unless your MEP firm has an old model to use they will have to convert their views to AutoCAD and you're going to need to link it into your views.
Regardless of how you handle it this will be a lot of work for you if the MEP firm intentionally upgraded their model.
Bench
Oct 2, 20 10:14 am
Definitely on the MEP consultant to abide by established standards on the project. Upgrading a model in the middle of a project is a huge fuck up on their part. Are they pushing back against this? No BIM manager worth half their salt would make that mistake (IE - the consultant's BIM manager should never have let it get anywhere close to that mistake, their internal QA/QC should have caught it.)
sideMan
Oct 2, 20 10:39 am
Thank you. This is what I thought also. If I were to have made this mistake myself I would correct it on my own time. I would be ashamed!
They are pushing back. I need to make sure I have a leg to stand on before I push back.
Non Sequitur
Oct 2, 20 10:48 am
We make it very clear from the very first meeting that we will carry-on with version X of revit for the duration of the project. Certainly there is a contract, email or meeting minutes you can refer to.
apscoradiales
Oct 2, 20 1:45 pm
Who is paying who? Engineers paying you to work for them or you paying them to be your consultants?
Who is at the top of the pyramid? Whoever than is, that's who dictates what programme is to be used.
You have a contract with them or not?
Are they paying you to upgrade to a newer version?
If not, and if all other things are equal, tell them to take a hike.
gibbost
Oct 2, 20 11:29 am
Agree with general policy stated above on maintaining the version from start-to-finish of the project. At the top of the heap, the architect should dictate expectations for which version to use and if/when any updates should occur. Also, most firms have a back-up system for their server that will allow them to retrieve an older file. Hoping this is the case for your MEP group. Good luck.
sideMan
Oct 2, 20 11:34 am
Nothing in a contract or email. That is our fault. That will not happen again.
Bench
Oct 2, 20 11:37 am
That can't be right though, you had to have asked at some point what version of Revit that the project team will use. It seems very unlikely you all independently chose the same version and worked/coordinated in that for a period of time without that being explicitly mentioned somewhere?
Bench
Oct 2, 20 11:37 am
Further - your other consultants must have your back on this, as it affects them just as much as it affects you?
sideMan
Oct 2, 20 12:34 pm
All the work including the MEP was done on 2019. I think somebody just made a mistake and does not want to pay for it. And yes the other consultants will be affected and should have my back. Just getting started with the issue.
Jay1122
Oct 2, 20 12:43 pm
It is very unusual and probably a mistake but If the MEP have new work done in 2020, they will not likely back down because they have to find the old version(if it exists) and recreate the work. I think having the rest of people upgrading from 2019 to 2020 should not be a huge deal unless the CD is due real soon and QAQC has been done. Also consider how big is the project. I would try to update the model and see. often times, if there is a problem, you will get an error and warning messages. Just need to see whether it is less effort for MEP to come back down, or the rest to get to 2020. It sure beats laying blame and creating tensions when the project is still going. You don't want to plant that seed because of this. Save that when they mess up the drawing and coordination, things got screwed up, owners mad and threaten to sue.
Chad Miller
Oct 2, 20 12:47 pm
This is a good point. As long as you have 2020 upgrading the model may no produce major issues. You will still have minor problems converting annotation AutoCAD based family's though so beware . . .
sideMan
Oct 2, 20 12:47 pm
Good points to consider.
Jay1122
Oct 2, 20 12:52 pm
I have not done it and don't know your specific model. I recommend upgrade it and compare. I think it is real dumb to change version mid project and should be a common knowledge. But right now, you are looking for best solution forward with least turmoil. Save the fight when it gets real ugly.
natematt
Oct 2, 20 1:16 pm
The way we have our stuff set up we usually have some sort of thing in the contract I believe and we always do a digital execution plan. Which is to say if the consultant did that we would just be like, tough cookies change it back... unless it seemed like a good time to switch.
We tend to upgrade mid projects though, but most of our projects are pretty large and require years of access to the files so it tends to make more sense.
gibbost
Oct 2, 20 2:54 pm
For this reason, our office started adding R17, R19, etc at the end of the revit file name. It does help when you see it to know which version you should be using. (When consultants see it, it should remind them as well). If nothing else, it avoids the dreaded 10-minute 'upgrading your model' pop-up.
curtkram
Oct 2, 20 7:38 pm
mep works for you, not the other way around. Make sure they know that.
natematt
Oct 2, 20 10:58 pm
Most of the time....
b3tadine[sutures]
Oct 2, 20 8:44 pm
I mean fuck, when they open a 2019.rvt file it asks if you want to upgrade, even the links for the base model do that, they're the ones that fucked up.
sideMan
Oct 3, 20 2:01 pm
They you all for advice. They are going back and updating the 2019 model. And all is good with the team!!!
Question. Currently working on a project that the whole A&E team is doing in Revit 2019. The M&P firm sends an updated dated model in Revit 2020. This would be a mistake on their part correct.? They should not expect the rest of the team to upgrade to Revit 2020 during the middle of a project should they? Or am I wrong? I would very much appreciate some other opinions.
Thank you!
Hopefully someone at the MEP firm simply mistakenly upgraded the model and sent it out to you as changing Revit versions in the middle of a project is not normal.
If this wasn't an accident then you're fucked. You can't save down a Revit model so unless your MEP firm has an old model to use they will have to convert their views to AutoCAD and you're going to need to link it into your views.
Regardless of how you handle it this will be a lot of work for you if the MEP firm intentionally upgraded their model.
Definitely on the MEP consultant to abide by established standards on the project. Upgrading a model in the middle of a project is a huge fuck up on their part. Are they pushing back against this? No BIM manager worth half their salt would make that mistake (IE - the consultant's BIM manager should never have let it get anywhere close to that mistake, their internal QA/QC should have caught it.)
Thank you. This is what I thought also. If I were to have made this mistake myself I would correct it on my own time. I would be ashamed!
They are pushing back. I need to make sure I have a leg to stand on before I push back.
We make it very clear from the very first meeting that we will carry-on with version X of revit for the duration of the project. Certainly there is a contract, email or meeting minutes you can refer to.
Who is paying who? Engineers paying you to work for them or you paying them to be your consultants?
Who is at the top of the pyramid? Whoever than is, that's who dictates what programme is to be used.
You have a contract with them or not?
Are they paying you to upgrade to a newer version?
If not, and if all other things are equal, tell them to take a hike.
Agree with general policy stated above on maintaining the version from start-to-finish of the project. At the top of the heap, the architect should dictate expectations for which version to use and if/when any updates should occur. Also, most firms have a back-up system for their server that will allow them to retrieve an older file. Hoping this is the case for your MEP group. Good luck.
Nothing in a contract or email. That is our fault. That will not happen again.
That can't be right though, you had to have asked at some point what version of Revit that the project team will use. It seems very unlikely you all independently chose the same version and worked/coordinated in that for a period of time without that being explicitly mentioned somewhere?
Further - your other consultants must have your back on this, as it affects them just as much as it affects you?
All the work including the MEP was done on 2019. I think somebody just made a mistake and does not want to pay for it. And yes the other consultants will be affected and should have my back. Just getting started with the issue.
It is very unusual and probably a mistake but If the MEP have new work done in 2020, they will not likely back down because they have to find the old version(if it exists) and recreate the work. I think having the rest of people upgrading from 2019 to 2020 should not be a huge deal unless the CD is due real soon and QAQC has been done. Also consider how big is the project. I would try to update the model and see. often times, if there is a problem, you will get an error and warning messages. Just need to see whether it is less effort for MEP to come back down, or the rest to get to 2020. It sure beats laying blame and creating tensions when the project is still going. You don't want to plant that seed because of this. Save that when they mess up the drawing and coordination, things got screwed up, owners mad and threaten to sue.
This is a good point. As long as you have 2020 upgrading the model may no produce major issues. You will still have minor problems converting annotation AutoCAD based family's though so beware . . .
Good points to consider.
I have not done it and don't know your specific model. I recommend upgrade it and compare. I think it is real dumb to change version mid project and should be a common knowledge. But right now, you are looking for best solution forward with least turmoil. Save the fight when it gets real ugly.
The way we have our stuff set up we usually have some sort of thing in the contract I believe and we always do a digital execution plan. Which is to say if the consultant did that we would just be like, tough cookies change it back... unless it seemed like a good time to switch.
We tend to upgrade mid projects though, but most of our projects are pretty large and require years of access to the files so it tends to make more sense.
For this reason, our office started adding R17, R19, etc at the end of the revit file name. It does help when you see it to know which version you should be using. (When consultants see it, it should remind them as well). If nothing else, it avoids the dreaded 10-minute 'upgrading your model' pop-up.
mep works for you, not the other way around. Make sure they know that.
Most of the time....
I mean fuck, when they open a 2019.rvt file it asks if you want to upgrade, even the links for the base model do that, they're the ones that fucked up.
They you all for advice. They are going back and updating the 2019 model. And all is good with the team!!!