UC Berkeley: unaccredited bachelors, would have to pursue M.Arch, access to other cultures/majors/experiences
Cal Poly Slo: B.Arch, CAED is x2 the size of Berkeley CED, not as globally recognized, sheltered college town
I'm a California senior who has the misfortune of choosing a college while all my schools are shut down. A thorough education is important to me with a good range of study, but I know I want to pursue architecture and I would like to be as technically prepared as I can be.
Is a M.Arch worth the extra cost? Are Berkeley undergrads somewhat ignored? If earning a bachelors from Berkeley, could/should I study for the masters from Berkeley as well?
Thank you! I losing my mind trying to decide.
Archlandia
Mar 30, 20 11:51 pm
this is something that you’ll need to do personal research on for sure, and it depends on what you want to be doing when you’re done with school. If I were in your position, I would go Berkeley in a heartbeat though.
kmskt
Mar 31, 20 1:56 am
thank you for the feedback! as a reference, what difference do you see between a berkeley m.arch grad and a cal poly b.arch grad? just from your own opinion, like the different direction these programs would lead an architect towards
Archlandia
Mar 31, 20 2:38 am
Most that I have worked with that did their B.arch at SLO are technically inept but had a very poor design sense. And Berkeley undergrads typically get into top grad schools. If you specifically want to be a designer or teach, I would go for Berkeley. Otherwise, SLO is a great school for just going to work in the field.
kmskt
Mar 31, 20 10:56 am
thank you for this opinion! I’m definitely aiming to do design for significant projects, not just to be guaranteed a spot in the field
I'm not sure what your argument is @betonbrut "Each year, DesignIntelligence (DI) conducts a survey of America’s top architecture schools, ranking undergraduate and graduate programs from the perspective of practitioners who hire graduates of those programs." It says right in the methodology exactly what I'm talking about. And like I said, I'm not basing my experience of graduates off of some list, these are my friends and were my colleagues
Archlandia
Mar 31, 20 5:21 pm
Here's a response to consider "AlexanderChristoforidisOctober 2, 2019
I take the Design Intelligence Survey every year as a firm principal. I also meet faculty from schools across the U.S. at NCARB Licensing Advisor Summits and other academic events. However, it is still very difficult to base my survey answers on anything rational. The survey asks me to rank among over 100 schools. Which survey taker really knows the quality of even 10 of those programs. Perhaps architects who do accreditation visits? Like many of my colleagues who are asked to take the DI survey, I have received e-mails from my alma matter near the time that the survey appears encouraging me to "remember them" this started around 2008 or 2009. Many schools probably go on campaigns to help them boost their rankings. I noticed one school went from totally unranked to the number one position in one year. Really? So much of a school's ability to do what they do is influenced by these rankings because it is the only ranking system we have to figure out something nobody will truly know. I suggest that we come up with a better system - perhaps one based on a scoring system derived from accreditation visits. For now in order to have something objective in DI's rankings they should make ARE pass rates one of the categories we look at. Although we do not want to see schools "teaching to the test" it could at least be just one of the many aspects of a schools' quality that we can truly compare head to head. Just food for thought...."
kmskt
Mar 31, 20 5:28 pm
thank you for this response to the survey! it has been a slight bother to keep seeing Cal Poly listed as a highly admired program and yet hear from people in forums/in person how the Berkeley program offers more enrichment...... I want to make a living salary but at the same time I don't want to underestimate myself and undermine all the work I've done in school because it would result in a safer path to employment
Archlandia
Mar 31, 20 5:33 pm
Don't get me wrong,they're both fine schools and you could probably make a great career out of either one. but you'll also have trouble teaching with a B.Arch only. I don't know about private schools but public schools usually require a masters degree to teach. This also shows up on RFQ and resume and etc.. just throwing all the info out there
muji-pen
Mar 31, 20 12:43 pm
if your undergrad is accredited you can get a masters thats further specialized, like historic preservation, planning, computation, management, etc.. instead of having 2 architecture degrees.
It'll actually make you broader, a few liberal art undergrad courses won't.
just making a case for cal poly, its a solid school
But it's also berkeley haha so i get the tough choice! good luck!
kmskt
Mar 31, 20 1:26 pm
thank you for this info! could you maybe list some pros and cons of getting a bachelors of the arts in architecture? just from your perspective
Stasis
Mar 31, 20 6:35 pm
Cal grad here. You can still get a CA license without going for a MArch. I graduated 13 years ago, so I cannot tell what Berkeley is like now.. When i was there, Cal wanted to be Columbia of the West and pushed really hard on digital designs using Maya and Mel/Python script... As for working in the professional field, i don't think i have ever been overlooked by graduates from other schools. In SF Bay Area, you will compete with people from everywhere, but being a Cal grad sometimes have advantage in getting hired by other cal grads..
kmskt
Apr 3, 20 10:36 pm
thank you for the reply! was the program fairly balanced in teaching technical skills with design and theory or did you find it leaned towards a single direction? also, do you still keep in touch with classmates from Cal, specifically in the industry?
Stasis
Apr 8, 20 4:52 pm
I think Berkeley's more leaning onto the design and theoretical side. Once again, I graduated 13 years ago, so things may be different now. However, lot of majors in Berkeley are typically very academic oriented.. If I offer an insight, you will get ample chance to gain technical skills once you get into the field, unless you choose to teach. My classmates went really broad directions. Some went to great grad schools like GSD then became professors somewhere. My friend went to Yale Arch/MBA program, then became a venture capitalist. Some chose to work and became directors/associate principal level. One got into tech startup and became rich. I didn't become as successful as some of peers and work as a PM... I think you'll be fine with eith
er schools. I see plenty of folks from both schools in this area.
ahhhhh
Mar 31, 20 7:42 pm
I'm a pretty recent SLO grad. Both are good schools, I would say just try to find out as much as possible about the curricula, student life, and the faculty and see if one speaks more to you. I don't think the distinction between B.Arch and M.Arch is that huge since both are accredited. There is also the path of B.Arch to an M.Arch II (or anything else) from another institution.
I will say that I think the stereotype of SLO as a kind of technical/industry pipeline school is pretty outdated. For better or worse, I think the student work will be pretty comparable between the two.. Here are some instagram feeds to compare:
thank you for the links! I've heard that the B.Arch at Cal Poly is pretty rigorous and arch-heavy, do the students sometimes feel burnt out or overwhelmed by all the architecture work? not just in terms of sheer energy, but in passion too, like feeling over saturated in architecture (weird question, sorry about it!)
ahhhhh
Apr 4, 20 5:47 pm
Architecture school can definitely be overwhelming, but I think that's pretty universal. It's a huge demand on your time, especially at the beginning before you have the skills to work quickly. Personally, I found it all so exciting that I never felt mentally burned out, but it was very demanding.
I suppose a good thing about Cal Poly is that it's such a large program that once you start choosing your own professors in the second year, you can
ahhhhh
Apr 4, 20 6:07 pm
-- sorry, the comment system here is so bad -- you can tailor your own experience. There were definitely easier or harder paths to take. And eventually the strange thing you will find in school is that the pressure is really just self-imposed :)
soham86
Apr 8, 20 12:38 am
University of Illinois at Urbana Champaign, Arizona State University, University at Buffalo and University of Arizona.
Which one these grad schools should i pick up for Master of Architecture program? And which one of these is preferred considering all aspects.. job opportunities, Do we land up in good jobs early, payscale, how good is the course and curriculum, location and overall ranking?
kmskt
Apr 8, 20 5:07 pm
hello! if you want to ask for advice about your own school decision, you can post your own question on the broader forum. this is not a general architecture school post, but is specific to the undergrad programs at Berkeley and Cal Poly
zonker
Apr 8, 20 5:58 pm
I work in the Bay area, and many of my co-workers are from Cal and Cal Poly, almost 50/50
Cal grads become designers
Cal Poly = production
kmskt
Apr 8, 20 7:07 pm
are the Cal grads from the graduate program or the undergrad program? i've been hearing that the difference is pretty substantial between the two
zonker
Apr 8, 20 7:21 pm
all BA grads, they start out doing sketchup for the lead designers, then over a 3 year time span, 1/2 go into production.
kmskt
Apr 8, 20 9:48 pm
this may seem like a very ignorant question, but what is "production" in architecture? i can guess the meaning... but could you help explain?
autofireunit
Apr 8, 20 9:16 pm
I will say Berkeley. It is just a better undergraduate school to my knowledge. I feel it is important to be exposed to other things in undergrad. Also based on my own observation, Berkeley graduates get into very good grad schools.
UC Berkeley: unaccredited bachelors, would have to pursue M.Arch, access to other cultures/majors/experiences
Cal Poly Slo: B.Arch, CAED is x2 the size of Berkeley CED, not as globally recognized, sheltered college town
I'm a California senior who has the misfortune of choosing a college while all my schools are shut down. A thorough education is important to me with a good range of study, but I know I want to pursue architecture and I would like to be as technically prepared as I can be.
Is a M.Arch worth the extra cost? Are Berkeley undergrads somewhat ignored? If earning a bachelors from Berkeley, could/should I study for the masters from Berkeley as well?
Thank you! I losing my mind trying to decide.
this is something that you’ll need to do personal research on for sure, and it depends on what you want to be doing when you’re done with school. If I were in your position, I would go Berkeley in a heartbeat though.
thank you for the feedback! as a reference, what difference do you see between a berkeley m.arch grad and a cal poly b.arch grad? just from your own opinion, like the different direction these programs would lead an architect towards
Most that I have worked with that did their B.arch at SLO are technically inept but had a very poor design sense. And Berkeley undergrads typically get into top grad schools. If you specifically want to be a designer or teach, I would go for Berkeley. Otherwise, SLO is a great school for just going to work in the field.
thank you for this opinion! I’m definitely aiming to do design for significant projects, not just to be guaranteed a spot in the field
https://www.architecturalrecord.com/articles/14289-americas-top-architecture-schools-2020#Tables
I'm not sure what your argument is @betonbrut "Each year, DesignIntelligence (DI) conducts a survey of America’s top architecture schools, ranking undergraduate and graduate programs from the perspective of practitioners who hire graduates of those programs." It says right in the methodology exactly what I'm talking about. And like I said, I'm not basing my experience of graduates off of some list, these are my friends and were my colleagues
Here's a response to consider "AlexanderChristoforidisOctober 2, 2019 I take the Design Intelligence Survey every year as a firm principal. I also meet faculty from schools across the U.S. at NCARB Licensing Advisor Summits and other academic events. However, it is still very difficult to base my survey answers on anything rational. The survey asks me to rank among over 100 schools. Which survey taker really knows the quality of even 10 of those programs. Perhaps architects who do accreditation visits? Like many of my colleagues who are asked to take the DI survey, I have received e-mails from my alma matter near the time that the survey appears encouraging me to "remember them" this started around 2008 or 2009. Many schools probably go on campaigns to help them boost their rankings. I noticed one school went from totally unranked to the number one position in one year. Really? So much of a school's ability to do what they do is influenced by these rankings because it is the only ranking system we have to figure out something nobody will truly know. I suggest that we come up with a better system - perhaps one based on a scoring system derived from accreditation visits. For now in order to have something objective in DI's rankings they should make ARE pass rates one of the categories we look at. Although we do not want to see schools "teaching to the test" it could at least be just one of the many aspects of a schools' quality that we can truly compare head to head. Just food for thought...."
thank you for this response to the survey! it has been a slight bother to keep seeing Cal Poly listed as a highly admired program and yet hear from people in forums/in person how the Berkeley program offers more enrichment...... I want to make a living salary but at the same time I don't want to underestimate myself and undermine all the work I've done in school because it would result in a safer path to employment
Don't get me wrong,they're both fine schools and you could probably make a great career out of either one. but you'll also have trouble teaching with a B.Arch only. I don't know about private schools but public schools usually require a masters degree to teach. This also shows up on RFQ and resume and etc.. just throwing all the info out there
if your undergrad is accredited you can get a masters thats further specialized, like historic preservation, planning, computation, management, etc.. instead of having 2 architecture degrees.
It'll actually make you broader, a few liberal art undergrad courses won't.
just making a case for cal poly, its a solid school
But it's also berkeley haha so i get the tough choice! good luck!
thank you for this info! could you maybe list some pros and cons of getting a bachelors of the arts in architecture? just from your perspective
Cal grad here. You can still get a CA license without going for a MArch. I graduated 13 years ago, so I cannot tell what Berkeley is like now.. When i was there, Cal wanted to be Columbia of the West and pushed really hard on digital designs using Maya and Mel/Python script... As for working in the professional field, i don't think i have ever been overlooked by graduates from other schools. In SF Bay Area, you will compete with people from everywhere, but being a Cal grad sometimes have advantage in getting hired by other cal grads..
thank you for the reply! was the program fairly balanced in teaching technical skills with design and theory or did you find it leaned towards a single direction? also, do you still keep in touch with classmates from Cal, specifically in the industry?
I think Berkeley's more leaning onto the design and theoretical side. Once again, I graduated 13 years ago, so things may be different now. However, lot of majors in Berkeley are typically very academic oriented.. If I offer an insight, you will get ample chance to gain technical skills once you get into the field, unless you choose to teach. My classmates went really broad directions. Some went to great grad schools like GSD then became professors somewhere. My friend went to Yale Arch/MBA program, then became a venture capitalist. Some chose to work and became directors/associate principal level. One got into tech startup and became rich. I didn't become as successful as some of peers and work as a PM... I think you'll be fine with eith er schools. I see plenty of folks from both schools in this area.
I'm a pretty recent SLO grad. Both are good schools, I would say just try to find out as much as possible about the curricula, student life, and the faculty and see if one speaks more to you. I don't think the distinction between B.Arch and M.Arch is that huge since both are accredited. There is also the path of B.Arch to an M.Arch II (or anything else) from another institution.
I will say that I think the stereotype of SLO as a kind of technical/industry pipeline school is pretty outdated. For better or worse, I think the student work will be pretty comparable between the two.. Here are some instagram feeds to compare:
https://www.instagram.com/addp...
https://www.instagram.com/calp...
https://www.instagram.com/berkeleyarchitecture/
thank you for the links! I've heard that the B.Arch at Cal Poly is pretty rigorous and arch-heavy, do the students sometimes feel burnt out or overwhelmed by all the architecture work? not just in terms of sheer energy, but in passion too, like feeling over saturated in architecture (weird question, sorry about it!)
Architecture school can definitely be overwhelming, but I think that's pretty universal. It's a huge demand on your time, especially at the beginning before you have the skills to work quickly. Personally, I found it all so exciting that I never felt mentally burned out, but it was very demanding. I suppose a good thing about Cal Poly is that it's such a large program that once you start choosing your own professors in the second year, you can
-- sorry, the comment system here is so bad -- you can tailor your own experience. There were definitely easier or harder paths to take. And eventually the strange thing you will find in school is that the pressure is really just self-imposed :)
University of Illinois at Urbana Champaign, Arizona State University, University at Buffalo and University of Arizona.
Which one these grad schools should i pick up for Master of Architecture program? And which one of these is preferred considering all aspects.. job opportunities, Do we land up in good jobs early, payscale, how good is the course and curriculum, location and overall ranking?
hello! if you want to ask for advice about your own school decision, you can post your own question on the broader forum. this is not a general architecture school post, but is specific to the undergrad programs at Berkeley and Cal Poly
I work in the Bay area, and many of my co-workers are from Cal and Cal Poly, almost 50/50
Cal grads become designers
Cal Poly = production
are the Cal grads from the graduate program or the undergrad program? i've been hearing that the difference is pretty substantial between the two
all BA grads, they start out doing sketchup for the lead designers, then over a 3 year time span, 1/2 go into production.
this may seem like a very ignorant question, but what is "production" in architecture? i can guess the meaning... but could you help explain?
I will say Berkeley. It is just a better undergraduate school to my knowledge. I feel it is important to be exposed to other things in undergrad. Also based on my own observation, Berkeley graduates get into very good grad schools.
thank you for the perspective!