After an incredibly long and arduous job search in the US from abroad, I have received an offer from an architectural firm, for my first full-time job. It seems like the firm will give me good experience and exposure to all project phases, which is something I'm definitely looking for. Only thing, the firm's portfolio is comprised mostly of apartment renovations, and designwise it isn't the strongest firm out there.
While I feel that at this point I really need experience, since I am a recent graduate, I'm wondering how or if starting my career in a firm with such a portfolio will affect my chances of moving up to a higher profile firm with larger projects; I'd love it if some of you with similar concerns or insight on this matter could share your opinions here.
Thank you so much in advance for your input
Non Sequitur
Sep 24, 19 9:59 am
Design is only a small fraction of the profession. Sure, it gets all the attention when you're in school and certainly has sex appeal, but not every project and not every firm will even come close to sniff at the level of design and flair fresh grads aspire to.
Not to say good design is not out there, but it varies and experience managing real projects, with real clients, and participating in as many phases as possible is where you need to be. Maybe you don't have the chops top shiny firms are looking for, so take this opp as a first step in enlarging your skill set and re-apply once you've built up a sizable professional portfolio.
xuwei93
Sep 24, 19 10:27 am
Thank you Non Sequitur. Going for experience and exposure to all parts of the profession feels like the right thing to do. I'm not necessarily after top shiny firms now; on the short term I'm definitely happy learning the basics and building up skill in this firm. I want to make sure that my decision now doesn't limit my future to one path of work or one type of firm.
Thank you very much again, NS.
GridBubbles
Sep 24, 19 12:25 pm
A job is better than no job. We all have to start somewhere so you might as well start with something and move on up. Some graduates get lucky and land their dream job, some have the talent and skill to work for star architects, and majority will just be in "average" (however you subjectively define as average) offices. Truth be told, majority of graduates start out at "average" and move on up and that is normal and statistically a fact. Majority of graduates are closer to average than most people think - myself included. Architecture is a LONG career, why sweat the big stuff if you haven't even dipped your toes into the fundamentals first?
xuwei93
Sep 24, 19 5:20 pm
As long as the opportunity to move up is there, I'll make an effort to take it. I'm frustrated because I've managed to get interviews with world class firms- two Pritzker winning firms included- and some incredible local firms, but no offers have been issued. Most interviews were prospective and did not necessarily include the possibility of an immediate hire. Being so close yet so far is what's killing me. I'm willing to take a step back, gather the necessary skills, and try again in a while, but I wanted to check first and make sure it has been done before and it's not such a rare thing. I realize as well that what I've just told you might mean I'm close but not quite good enough for those firms, but I do hope to get there with a year or two of hard work.
Also, thanks a lot for taking the time to share your view.
GridBubbles
Sep 24, 19 5:35 pm
No problem. I don't want to come across as rude... but if you were truly this good, then these award winning firms would be bending over backwards to retain you. Are you overestimating your abilities? Yes you will get interviews, but interviews are nothing more than just feelers from the employers point of view unless you are as good as you say you are. Its simply supply and demand. There may be more, if not better candidates than you are that offer better skills, talent, or are simply willing to work for less pay. I think that graduates need to be less naive about the real world. No one has ever hit it out the park with their first job and its called a first job for a reason. Nothing wrong with being average (most of us are). Leave the ego at home, it will do better for your career in the long run. Like I said earlier, there is simply no point in worrying about future career when you don't even have the basics mastered.
xuwei93
Sep 24, 19 5:46 pm
No worries, I get what you're saying. I am indeed trying to figure out where I stand or where I fit. I'd rather be aware of my limitations and work on them than be delusional. Now, I didn't claim to be that good per se, simply trying to get a feel of where I stand based on feedback from prospective employers. But then again, verbal feedback and factual events are separate things, and I haven't got offers from those people. I'll take it as a cue to be humble, learn and build up progressively. Thank you again for your insight :)
thisisnotmyname
Sep 24, 19 1:06 pm
You need to take the job. A year or so at an "average" firm on your resume will not necessarily block you from working someplace more prestigious in the future. You will, however, need to make sure you build the skills, network, and portfolio needed to get in at a more design-oriented place. That may take some independent effort on your part outside of your job setting at an "average" firm.
xuwei93
Sep 24, 19 5:23 pm
Thank you for sharing your advice with me.
My plan is to participate in competitions and become LEED certified, as well as working on becoming licensed relatively early. Obviously those three things are extremely hard to combine with each other, let alone while holding a full-time job, but the plan is to explore how to advance in those three regards in order to build a stronger candidacy for future openings. I'm simply hoping that there is a way to show potential to future employers. I wish I could be more confident about this, or know the way to do it, but unfortunately my lack of experience also means that I don't have a good grasp of how the job market works in that sense.
kjdt
Sep 24, 19 7:41 pm
Getting some US experience for a year or two will make you more employable at US firms of all types, including more design-oriented firms. Getting licensed as soon as possible will make you more employable in a management type role, but isn't necessarily going to help with a design role. Competitions probably aren't going to help, unless you're very careful about which ones you choose to enter (and you win them or place highly) - most competitions are exploitive and many architects view them negatively. LEED accreditation isn't likely to make much difference in most firms, as accredited people are a dime a dozen and most clients don't want to pay for LEED certification anyway. It can be important for those firms that do public projects in a few states that have QBS (quality-based selection) laws that advantage LEED projects - but usually the firms for which it's important will pay for the employee to take the exam, and won't pass over an otherwise strong applicant just because they lack that credential.
xuwei93
Sep 25, 19 8:56 am
Got it! I had the impression that the US market in architecture was very standardized and that all those qualifications were generally desirable and rewarded regardless of the specific path to follow. I'm reassured to hear that taking the offer is a good step ahead in any case. I'll make the best of it!
Thank you, kjdt.
OddArchitect
Sep 24, 19 5:52 pm
Here is the hard truth, unless you're incredibly talented and luck you will not be doing conceptual design on buildings right out of school.
You've got a lot to learn still so try and find a firm that is going mentor you and nurture the talents you have while also exposing you to all the areas of experience that make up architecture. If you're at a good firm they will recognize your contributions and give you more opportunities to design. Depending on how good you are this could be a rather fast or slow progression. It may never happen if you don't posses good design skills that can actually be built on time and on budget.
xuwei93
Sep 25, 19 9:29 am
Thank you Chad. As far as I've been able to find out, this firm should be a great place for a beginner like me, as it is small and very willing to help me acquire the skills I need. It's the reason I applied in the first place, But when things started developing I started worrying about what'll happen after. Thank you again for your advice!
OddArchitect
Sep 25, 19 9:55 am
Gain some experience first. Then if the firm and your career isn't progressing in the direction you'd like find another firm.
Hi Archinect,
After an incredibly long and arduous job search in the US from abroad, I have received an offer from an architectural firm, for my first full-time job. It seems like the firm will give me good experience and exposure to all project phases, which is something I'm definitely looking for. Only thing, the firm's portfolio is comprised mostly of apartment renovations, and designwise it isn't the strongest firm out there.
While I feel that at this point I really need experience, since I am a recent graduate, I'm wondering how or if starting my career in a firm with such a portfolio will affect my chances of moving up to a higher profile firm with larger projects; I'd love it if some of you with similar concerns or insight on this matter could share your opinions here.
Thank you so much in advance for your input
Design is only a small fraction of the profession. Sure, it gets all the attention when you're in school and certainly has sex appeal, but not every project and not every firm will even come close to sniff at the level of design and flair fresh grads aspire to.
Not to say good design is not out there, but it varies and experience managing real projects, with real clients, and participating in as many phases as possible is where you need to be. Maybe you don't have the chops top shiny firms are looking for, so take this opp as a first step in enlarging your skill set and re-apply once you've built up a sizable professional portfolio.
Thank you Non Sequitur. Going for experience and exposure to all parts of the profession feels like the right thing to do. I'm not necessarily after top shiny firms now; on the short term I'm definitely happy learning the basics and building up skill in this firm. I want to make sure that my decision now doesn't limit my future to one path of work or one type of firm.
Thank you very much again, NS.
A job is better than no job. We all have to start somewhere so you might as well start with something and move on up. Some graduates get lucky and land their dream job, some have the talent and skill to work for star architects, and majority will just be in "average" (however you subjectively define as average) offices. Truth be told, majority of graduates start out at "average" and move on up and that is normal and statistically a fact. Majority of graduates are closer to average than most people think - myself included. Architecture is a LONG career, why sweat the big stuff if you haven't even dipped your toes into the fundamentals first?
As long as the opportunity to move up is there, I'll make an effort to take it. I'm frustrated because I've managed to get interviews with world class firms- two Pritzker winning firms included- and some incredible local firms, but no offers have been issued. Most interviews were prospective and did not necessarily include the possibility of an immediate hire. Being so close yet so far is what's killing me. I'm willing to take a step back, gather the necessary skills, and try again in a while, but I wanted to check first and make sure it has been done before and it's not such a rare thing. I realize as well that what I've just told you might mean I'm close but not quite good enough for those firms, but I do hope to get there with a year or two of hard work.
Also, thanks a lot for taking the time to share your view.
No problem. I don't want to come across as rude... but if you were truly this good, then these award winning firms would be bending over backwards to retain you. Are you overestimating your abilities? Yes you will get interviews, but interviews are nothing more than just feelers from the employers point of view unless you are as good as you say you are. Its simply supply and demand. There may be more, if not better candidates than you are that offer better skills, talent, or are simply willing to work for less pay. I think that graduates need to be less naive about the real world. No one has ever hit it out the park with their first job and its called a first job for a reason. Nothing wrong with being average (most of us are). Leave the ego at home, it will do better for your career in the long run. Like I said earlier, there is simply no point in worrying about future career when you don't even have the basics mastered.
No worries, I get what you're saying. I am indeed trying to figure out where I stand or where I fit. I'd rather be aware of my limitations and work on them than be delusional. Now, I didn't claim to be that good per se, simply trying to get a feel of where I stand based on feedback from prospective employers. But then again, verbal feedback and factual events are separate things, and I haven't got offers from those people. I'll take it as a cue to be humble, learn and build up progressively. Thank you again for your insight :)
You need to take the job. A year or so at an "average" firm on your resume will not necessarily block you from working someplace more prestigious in the future. You will, however, need to make sure you build the skills, network, and portfolio needed to get in at a more design-oriented place. That may take some independent effort on your part outside of your job setting at an "average" firm.
Thank you for sharing your advice with me.
My plan is to participate in competitions and become LEED certified, as well as working on becoming licensed relatively early. Obviously those three things are extremely hard to combine with each other, let alone while holding a full-time job, but the plan is to explore how to advance in those three regards in order to build a stronger candidacy for future openings. I'm simply hoping that there is a way to show potential to future employers. I wish I could be more confident about this, or know the way to do it, but unfortunately my lack of experience also means that I don't have a good grasp of how the job market works in that sense.
Getting some US experience for a year or two will make you more employable at US firms of all types, including more design-oriented firms. Getting licensed as soon as possible will make you more employable in a management type role, but isn't necessarily going to help with a design role. Competitions probably aren't going to help, unless you're very careful about which ones you choose to enter (and you win them or place highly) - most competitions are exploitive and many architects view them negatively. LEED accreditation isn't likely to make much difference in most firms, as accredited people are a dime a dozen and most clients don't want to pay for LEED certification anyway. It can be important for those firms that do public projects in a few states that have QBS (quality-based selection) laws that advantage LEED projects - but usually the firms for which it's important will pay for the employee to take the exam, and won't pass over an otherwise strong applicant just because they lack that credential.
Got it! I had the impression that the US market in architecture was very standardized and that all those qualifications were generally desirable and rewarded regardless of the specific path to follow. I'm reassured to hear that taking the offer is a good step ahead in any case. I'll make the best of it!
Thank you, kjdt.
Here is the hard truth, unless you're incredibly talented and luck you will not be doing conceptual design on buildings right out of school.
You've got a lot to learn still so try and find a firm that is going mentor you and nurture the talents you have while also exposing you to all the areas of experience that make up architecture. If you're at a good firm they will recognize your contributions and give you more opportunities to design. Depending on how good you are this could be a rather fast or slow progression. It may never happen if you don't posses good design skills that can actually be built on time and on budget.
Thank you Chad. As far as I've been able to find out, this firm should be a great place for a beginner like me, as it is small and very willing to help me acquire the skills I need. It's the reason I applied in the first place, But when things started developing I started worrying about what'll happen after. Thank you again for your advice!
Gain some experience first. Then if the firm and your career isn't progressing in the direction you'd like find another firm.