We've done research but would appreciate advice from fellow professionals.
Background Info: Undergraduate Architecture degree (pre-professional degree) and currently in Masters. We have an interior design commission which is strictly a renovation. This project requires demolition of one non load bearing, interior stud wall and a glass storefront.
How can we "design" this small store without being registered to the OAA. The RAIC-7 and OAA-600 does not apply as we aren't licensed (yet). Another strategy was to find contractors with a BCIN and act as designers. However, we wish to maintain control and act similar to a General Contractor. My team wants to 1. Design & 2. Source and specify our materials. We want the contractor to only apply for permits and demolish/install. This way we can minimize scope and potential for markups resulting in additional resources towards materials.
Also, can electrical engineers apply for BCIN? Preliminary research didn't show much about this topic and we're not sure if this is restricted to civil.
Any additional info we need to know such as calculating fees (assuming we can't just use fee calculations from the OAA chart)? We know we need BCIN/Architect/Engineer, Permit, Designer (us) Insurance, Contractor, and Materials.
Thank you everyone in advance for helping us out. It has always been a dream to create public excitement through architecture and this project gets us one step closer to achieving that goal.
Bench
Dec 26, 18 9:09 am
commercial or residential? I believe that distinction will have a big say on what you can or can’t do without a license.
Non Sequitur
Dec 26, 18 1:29 pm
In short, you can't. Ask your client to hire someone with full capabilities. They will likely pay more, and that's ok because real services cost money and your client will likely be required to demonstrate designer's BCIN credential anyways as part of the permit submission.
Now, the long story is you don't show that you understand the process well. You're looking at a likely a tenant fit-up in an existing commercial property. Do you know the building classification? the existing adjacent tenancies' occupancies? Demising wall ratings? Who told you it's a non-load bearing wall? Does demolishing that wall increase the sq.ft of the unit beyond it's exit capacity? What do the local zoning regs say about the storefront modifications? It's in Ontario, so how will you accommodate universal washroom security and nursing station reqs? And... it goes on.
lots of ice cream
Dec 26, 18 8:45 pm
@bench it is commercial. We are planning to go around the license part by having someone with a bcin/engineer/architect sign off.
@non That won’t be necessary as we are competent and will have guidance from owners of architectural/engineer offices. What we do need is getting around the legal requirements. I want to have more information before I approach them. Everybody starts somewhere and this is where we will start. Thank you for you concerns but we do have the answers to many of these questions. If you have any advice for seeking contractors for BCIN or perhaps know architects/engineers willing to work with small projects at a low price that would be helpful. Advice on the process would be great as well.
Non Sequitur
Dec 26, 18 8:59 pm
Ice Cream (good name btw), please note that the OAA does not allow architects to simply stamp another designer's drawings and no one will risk penalties (not to mention additional liability) to facilitate non-licensed designers. Our office takes on a few of these types of projects every year where an owner cheaped out on the consultants and only realized come permit time that they are stuck. We, as well as any other self-respecting office, charge full fees for this service and discard the previous designers even if the docs are already completed. Because in the end, we take responsibility for everything... not the initial designers. You only option (probably) is to source a BCIN sucker willing to put their name and insurance on the line who will review the important life-safety issues required for permit but before you do that, you need to know if your project's architectural scope is even permissible under a BCIN. Can't tell if yes or no based on your description. This is step no.1.
Steeplechase
Dec 26, 18 9:16 pm
“Getting around the legal requirements” is typically not a good place to start.
Non Sequitur
Dec 26, 18 9:17 pm
^Exactly.
lots of ice cream
Dec 26, 18 8:51 pm
also @non I dont see anywhere which requires double BCIN numbers. As long as we have professionals who qualify (bcin/architect license/engineer) oversee and check our project there should be no issues. If you have any sources that would be great.
I’ve also heard many people with less experience than me, hire an architect for sign off... never heard of any trouble. So your comment is quite a surprise in my anecdotal experience. Could you provide links further reading?
Non Sequitur
Dec 26, 18 9:03 pm
I stand strongly by my previous comment regarding the rubber-stamp. It is common is some areas and I know many american clients assume we can simply take their drawings and add our name and stamp, but the OAA and it's insurance company, does not permit it. Certainly there are weasels out there cutting corners and taking big chances, but they are exceptions.
Not sure I get the double BCIN question. There are project limitations for BCIN.
Non Sequitur
Dec 26, 18 9:09 pm
Are you certain your project falls within part 9 of the OBC?
We've done research but would appreciate advice from fellow professionals.
Background Info: Undergraduate Architecture degree (pre-professional degree) and currently in Masters. We have an interior design commission which is strictly a renovation. This project requires demolition of one non load bearing, interior stud wall and a glass storefront.
How can we "design" this small store without being registered to the OAA. The RAIC-7 and OAA-600 does not apply as we aren't licensed (yet). Another strategy was to find contractors with a BCIN and act as designers. However, we wish to maintain control and act similar to a General Contractor. My team wants to 1. Design & 2. Source and specify our materials. We want the contractor to only apply for permits and demolish/install. This way we can minimize scope and potential for markups resulting in additional resources towards materials.
Also, can electrical engineers apply for BCIN? Preliminary research didn't show much about this topic and we're not sure if this is restricted to civil.
Any additional info we need to know such as calculating fees (assuming we can't just use fee calculations from the OAA chart)? We know we need BCIN/Architect/Engineer, Permit, Designer (us) Insurance, Contractor, and Materials.
Thank you everyone in advance for helping us out. It has always been a dream to create public excitement through architecture and this project gets us one step closer to achieving that goal.
commercial or residential? I believe that distinction will have a big say on what you can or can’t do without a license.
In short, you can't. Ask your client to hire someone with full capabilities. They will likely pay more, and that's ok because real services cost money and your client will likely be required to demonstrate designer's BCIN credential anyways as part of the permit submission.
Now, the long story is you don't show that you understand the process well. You're looking at a likely a tenant fit-up in an existing commercial property. Do you know the building classification? the existing adjacent tenancies' occupancies? Demising wall ratings? Who told you it's a non-load bearing wall? Does demolishing that wall increase the sq.ft of the unit beyond it's exit capacity? What do the local zoning regs say about the storefront modifications? It's in Ontario, so how will you accommodate universal washroom security and nursing station reqs? And... it goes on.
@bench it is commercial. We are planning to go around the license part by having someone with a bcin/engineer/architect sign off.
@non That won’t be necessary as we are competent and will have guidance from owners of architectural/engineer offices. What we do need is getting around the legal requirements. I want to have more information before I approach them. Everybody starts somewhere and this is where we will start. Thank you for you concerns but we do have the answers to many of these questions. If you have any advice for seeking contractors for BCIN or perhaps know architects/engineers willing to work with small projects at a low price that would be helpful. Advice on the process would be great as well.
Ice Cream (good name btw), please note that the OAA does not allow architects to simply stamp another designer's drawings and no one will risk penalties (not to mention additional liability) to facilitate non-licensed designers. Our office takes on a few of these types of projects every year where an owner cheaped out on the consultants and only realized come permit time that they are stuck. We, as well as any other self-respecting office, charge full fees for this service and discard the previous designers even if the docs are already completed. Because in the end, we take responsibility for everything... not the initial designers. You only option (probably) is to source a BCIN sucker willing to put their name and insurance on the line who will review the important life-safety issues required for permit but before you do that, you need to know if your project's architectural scope is even permissible under a BCIN. Can't tell if yes or no based on your description. This is step no.1.
“Getting around the legal requirements” is typically not a good place to start.
^Exactly.
also @non I dont see anywhere which requires double BCIN numbers. As long as we have professionals who qualify (bcin/architect license/engineer) oversee and check our project there should be no issues. If you have any sources that would be great.
I’ve also heard many people with less experience than me, hire an architect for sign off... never heard of any trouble. So your comment is quite a surprise in my anecdotal experience. Could you provide links further reading?
I stand strongly by my previous comment regarding the rubber-stamp. It is common is some areas and I know many american clients assume we can simply take their drawings and add our name and stamp, but the OAA and it's insurance company, does not permit it. Certainly there are weasels out there cutting corners and taking big chances, but they are exceptions.
Not sure I get the double BCIN question. There are project limitations for BCIN.
Are you certain your project falls within part 9 of the OBC?