A bit about myself. I'm a licensed architect and I've spent the great majority of my career working in commercial projects. I've always worked for someone else (production mostly) and don't really have experience figuring out rates and hours.
Recently I started venturing out to do side work in which I will be the AOR. I have a potential client who needs me to design and submit CDs for an outdoor patio deck. I was wondering if anyone had any tips as to how to figure out my fee and how many hours of design/CD work I should present in my proposal for a small-ish residential project like that.
I just received the client's request through Upwork.com. I can add details as I get them from her (size, "complexity" etc).
Thank you in advance.
senjohnblutarsky
Apr 3, 18 5:08 pm
Cost of insurance for 7 years, plus hourly rate.
Plus irritation fee for having to submit sealed CDs for a deck.
joseffischer
Apr 3, 18 5:39 pm
We (previous residential arch firm) had a lot of deck details required in the city of Atlanta, 6x6 posts with carriage bolts and (forgetting the name now so I'll call them) tiebacks to the joist beyond so that the post isn't just attached to the rim joists. There's other details too. They also make us show ALL elevations existing and new even if the deck is just a backyard deck. Yes, I have to show the facade (front elevation) and then show the exact same facade labeled new with nothing changed. The longest part of a deck project from permitting perspective is drawing the existing house. This should take no more than a day if you have a laptop and can draw what you're measuring at the same time. Don't include any details on siding, windows (beyond rough openings) etc. We try to keep it as kindergarden as possible... I mean it's not like we're doing anything to the house anyway.
We have a tool in revit that draws our framing plan for us, with minor adjustments. we also have picket families for the owner to choose from. The actual deck drawing takes maybe 4 hours. Usually we'd have a cover page with floor plan, a site disturbance and erosion control plan (there's another 4 hours) the elevation sheet, and the detail sheets (2). I think we charged around $2000. Arguably, I should be able to knock out 2 a week, but it'd always take longer because owners would change their mind and otherwise do some 'designing'.
We also built the decks often (design-build). Prices would vary considerably for a myriad of reasons. (double deck with bottom screened in? wrap around deck? pergola? etc?) Cheapest deck I've seen us built was around $10000.
YMMV
joseffischer
Apr 3, 18 5:46 pm
I used to also do decks on the side if they weren't in my boss's region. He didn't want to work in SW Atlanta, stayed NE and slightly SE. I'd charge $500-750. People there were always doing it themselves, so they'd look at the material costs (let's say $2k?) and balk at any 4-digit number. The decks were always way smaller than the fancy ones I worked on for my boss, but still require the same details, erosion control plans, etc. I always tried to sell owners on the idea that they were starting their set of as-builts, and I did convince some people to let me do entire as-builts of their houses interior, exterior, crawlspace, roof plan, elevations, stair section, etc... basically everything an architect would need if they were going to permit a renovation. I charged between $2-3k for that. These were recession times in an area where houses were under $100k and I wasn't registered and doing side work.
I wouldn't even take any of those jobs at those prices anymore. Which leads me to my final point. I've always frequented a lot of contractor forums and all the time younger guys are asking the seniors, how do I bid this, what's your swag on that. The seniors always reply, charge as much as can get away with!
Tico71t
Apr 3, 18 6:01 pm
Thank you all for the helpful and prompt replies!!
chigurh
Apr 3, 18 6:09 pm
25% cost of construction MINIMUM
proto
Apr 3, 18 7:41 pm
agreed...decks are all details if you care about what they look like
Non Sequitur
Apr 3, 18 10:51 pm
what if the deck is just a few discarded shipping pallets and concrete blocks?
Non Sequitur
Apr 3, 18 10:56 pm
but... it's so tantalizing.
accesskb
Apr 4, 18 10:33 pm
Don't cut yourself short in order to get any work.
A bit about myself. I'm a licensed architect and I've spent the great majority of my career working in commercial projects. I've always worked for someone else (production mostly) and don't really have experience figuring out rates and hours.
Recently I started venturing out to do side work in which I will be the AOR. I have a potential client who needs me to design and submit CDs for an outdoor patio deck. I was wondering if anyone had any tips as to how to figure out my fee and how many hours of design/CD work I should present in my proposal for a small-ish residential project like that.
I just received the client's request through Upwork.com. I can add details as I get them from her (size, "complexity" etc).
Thank you in advance.
Cost of insurance for 7 years, plus hourly rate.
Plus irritation fee for having to submit sealed CDs for a deck.
We (previous residential arch firm) had a lot of deck details required in the city of Atlanta, 6x6 posts with carriage bolts and (forgetting the name now so I'll call them) tiebacks to the joist beyond so that the post isn't just attached to the rim joists. There's other details too. They also make us show ALL elevations existing and new even if the deck is just a backyard deck. Yes, I have to show the facade (front elevation) and then show the exact same facade labeled new with nothing changed. The longest part of a deck project from permitting perspective is drawing the existing house. This should take no more than a day if you have a laptop and can draw what you're measuring at the same time. Don't include any details on siding, windows (beyond rough openings) etc. We try to keep it as kindergarden as possible... I mean it's not like we're doing anything to the house anyway.
We have a tool in revit that draws our framing plan for us, with minor adjustments. we also have picket families for the owner to choose from. The actual deck drawing takes maybe 4 hours. Usually we'd have a cover page with floor plan, a site disturbance and erosion control plan (there's another 4 hours) the elevation sheet, and the detail sheets (2). I think we charged around $2000. Arguably, I should be able to knock out 2 a week, but it'd always take longer because owners would change their mind and otherwise do some 'designing'.
We also built the decks often (design-build). Prices would vary considerably for a myriad of reasons. (double deck with bottom screened in? wrap around deck? pergola? etc?) Cheapest deck I've seen us built was around $10000.
YMMV
I used to also do decks on the side if they weren't in my boss's region. He didn't want to work in SW Atlanta, stayed NE and slightly SE. I'd charge $500-750. People there were always doing it themselves, so they'd look at the material costs (let's say $2k?) and balk at any 4-digit number. The decks were always way smaller than the fancy ones I worked on for my boss, but still require the same details, erosion control plans, etc. I always tried to sell owners on the idea that they were starting their set of as-builts, and I did convince some people to let me do entire as-builts of their houses interior, exterior, crawlspace, roof plan, elevations, stair section, etc... basically everything an architect would need if they were going to permit a renovation. I charged between $2-3k for that. These were recession times in an area where houses were under $100k and I wasn't registered and doing side work.
I wouldn't even take any of those jobs at those prices anymore. Which leads me to my final point. I've always frequented a lot of contractor forums and all the time younger guys are asking the seniors, how do I bid this, what's your swag on that. The seniors always reply, charge as much as can get away with!
Thank you all for the helpful and prompt replies!!
25% cost of construction MINIMUM
agreed...decks are all details if you care about what they look like
what if the deck is just a few discarded shipping pallets and concrete blocks?
but... it's so tantalizing.
Don't cut yourself short in order to get any work.