Does anybody think that one day paper blueprints will be completely obsolete. I know that AR tech is still in its infancy, but one day I'm sure there is going to be AR safety glasses (billion dollar idea right there.)
How long do you think before they're no more?
I'm mostly curious because I work at a reprographics shop and I'm also really into VR/AR. My boss is pretty old and I showed him AR and blew his mind. We're coming up with a business plan in case all goes to crap in the next 10-20 years.
Non Sequitur
Jan 12, 17 8:46 pm
blueprints are already obsolete. Construction docs are printed on normal paper using conventional printers.
now you go tell my drywaller he needs to wear these big goggles in order to find out where to snap his chalk line.
Wilma Buttfit
Jan 12, 17 10:08 pm
^I was thinking the same, but then thought why couldn't it be legal? They use AR a lot in court these days.
Bench
Jan 13, 17 4:21 am
Why would the legality of AR/VR be any different from using model delivery for construction documents?
Lee Robert
Jan 13, 17 10:06 am
Construction sites are (and probably always will be) a very messy place. Printed drawings can withstand most of this abuse pretty well. Low-tech is a better solution to some problems in my mind. AR may supplement printed drawing at some point, but not until they prove their resilience on the job site.
Sam Singer
Jan 13, 17 11:43 am
Well, I should start looking for a new career path lol. Maybe 3d reprographics. I can print prosthetics by day and be the Masked Amputator by night. Full proof business plan.
this product has been around, but it's really half baked at the moment
Josh Mings
Jan 13, 17 12:35 pm
If they ever get some AR into some stylish Warby Parker glasses, I'm in. I haven't played around with it much, but I should.
Wilma Buttfit
Jan 13, 17 12:38 pm
I have a VR headset. It's pretty cool. I don't use it much because I'm claustrophobic.
Sam Singer
Jan 13, 17 12:54 pm
Damn Daqri stole my idea I just made up yesterday. I have a VR headset too. It's pretty sweet. I really want to test out the Microsoft Hololens. That thing looks pretty sweet.
Sam Singer
Jan 13, 17 1:09 pm
The extent of my vocabulary is pretty sweet.
Josh Mings
Jan 13, 17 1:56 pm
These guys approve of your vocabulary. It's just 2 sweeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeet.
Non Sequitur
Jan 13, 17 2:04 pm
.
Josh Mings
Jan 13, 17 2:08 pm
The weird thing is I saw Scott Hall doing the DX chop on that poster and thought it was very wrong.
This is what you get growing up watching wrestling. It's still my go to "I don't want to think anymore" guilty viewing pleasure.
Sam Singer
Jan 13, 17 2:12 pm
RIP Chyna
mightyaa
Jan 13, 17 2:50 pm
Back to the AR thing.
Sorry... it won't happen. CAD has been around a couple decades now and it's still rare for a GC to do more with it than take-offs.
The other reality is that drawings are really 'conceptual'. As in Door 06 is really just a symbol that has conceptual meaning. It has a schedule, hardware, specification, and requires specific framing and so forth that no one in right mind is going so far as to model everything into the drawings. Basically that means your AR stuff, to be any more useful than just a videogame walkthrough, would need all the bits and pieces modeled just like it's built. That's manhours you'd have to build into your fee structure (good luck with that).
And after you've spent all that time... the door installer won't care anyway because he knows how to install a door and doesn't need all that information; He just needs to know what you want and will take care of the rest (and probably knows more about that stuff than you will ever need to know). So you are doing it for what reason exactly and who is going to find value in it? Just because you can, doesn't mean you should.
Sam Singer
Jan 13, 17 4:07 pm
Good point Mightyaa. I get what you're saying. What if they make contacts or glasses able to show virtual images and they process through your phone and cost less than $100. Then wouldn't it be more beneficial just to have a pair of those and you can resize the plans right in front of you. Always having them floating next to you if you need them rather then spend however much money printing blueprints. It doesn't to be full 3D rendering through out the space. It can just be a pdf file that you can turn off and on. I know AR won't be that refined for another decade or so maybe, but it'll get there for sure.
Non Sequitur
Jan 13, 17 4:34 pm
^no.
If you spent literally less than 12 seconds on a construction site you'd see why it's totally impractical idea. My site super on a large office building carries an ipad mini around with all the current CDs, SI,s CCN, and various reports all tied into an interactive package. Tradesmen asks a question and he looks it up to see what instructions I've made.
Sam Singer
Jan 13, 17 4:54 pm
^I literally have no idea what the hell you just said.
I don't have 12 seconds to be on a construction site. I have a VR headset and the internet has VR porn.
Non Sequitur
Jan 14, 17 7:38 am
You also know why it's ridiculous Ricky Bobby if you ever spent any time in either an arch office or a construction site.
Non Sequitur
Jan 14, 17 9:45 am
Wrong.
Everyday Intern
Jan 14, 17 11:06 am
If an alien landed in Astoria, Balkins would be the one to lecture the alien on what the alien's home planet is like ... as well as the alien's language, civilization, technologies, biology, physiology, psychology, etc.
Sebastian Mlekicki
Jan 25, 17 3:37 pm
The fact that clients can barely tell what is going on when looking at conventional drawings/CDs and often need renderings to understand the design of the space - AR and VR (presentation techniques) would be an elegant solution to visualization inabilities on the clients side.
s=r*(theta)
Jan 25, 17 5:36 pm
HIGHLY DOUBT IT!
mightyaa
Jan 25, 17 8:52 pm
Man, I missed Rick's wall of text...
Just a couple corrections... I've been around the block a long time. The government actually isn't slow to adopt in their requirements; just slow in getting it themselves. The first CAD station my Dad's firm got in the '80's was specifically required by their Federal work with GSA, DOD and Postal Service. All the other projects were still on drafting boards.
The first adopters of Revit and BIM was also government. My personal theory is Autodesk, with the absurd fees they collect from us doesn't spend it on development; they spend a ton on marketing. You can look it up, but they spend just over half of what the AIA does on professional political lobbying efforts.... So... Government REQUIRES certain formats because they get sold on the idea.
I go round and round with this with my sister who is a university campus architect and their regulations. They require all this BIM and standards. I ask her if she's ever or knows anyone on staff who has ever opened the file to find a certain part or spec rather than just look at the problem and fix it (like replacing a flush valve or drinking fountain)... She hasn't. They are sold on the theory, but it doesn't go beyond that.
So... if they want to get AR in the mainstream, they need to market those that set the standards/regulations we have to conform to. Government agencies are really the only ones who's reach is large enough, and build enough to force adoption throughout an industry.
thisisnotmyname
Nov 25, 19 11:58 am
If AR puts Autodesk and Adobe out of business, I'm OK with that.
Does anybody think that one day paper blueprints will be completely obsolete. I know that AR tech is still in its infancy, but one day I'm sure there is going to be AR safety glasses (billion dollar idea right there.)
How long do you think before they're no more?
I'm mostly curious because I work at a reprographics shop and I'm also really into VR/AR. My boss is pretty old and I showed him AR and blew his mind. We're coming up with a business plan in case all goes to crap in the next 10-20 years.
blueprints are already obsolete. Construction docs are printed on normal paper using conventional printers.
now you go tell my drywaller he needs to wear these big goggles in order to find out where to snap his chalk line.
^I was thinking the same, but then thought why couldn't it be legal? They use AR a lot in court these days.
Why would the legality of AR/VR be any different from using model delivery for construction documents?
Construction sites are (and probably always will be) a very messy place. Printed drawings can withstand most of this abuse pretty well. Low-tech is a better solution to some problems in my mind. AR may supplement printed drawing at some point, but not until they prove their resilience on the job site.
Well, I should start looking for a new career path lol. Maybe 3d reprographics. I can print prosthetics by day and be the Masked Amputator by night. Full proof business plan.
^Brilliant idea.
VR =/ construction drawings, maybe one day
https://daqri.com/products/smart-helmet/
this product has been around, but it's really half baked at the moment
If they ever get some AR into some stylish Warby Parker glasses, I'm in. I haven't played around with it much, but I should.
I have a VR headset. It's pretty cool. I don't use it much because I'm claustrophobic.
Damn Daqri stole my idea I just made up yesterday. I have a VR headset too. It's pretty sweet. I really want to test out the Microsoft Hololens. That thing looks pretty sweet.
The extent of my vocabulary is pretty sweet.
These guys approve of your vocabulary. It's just 2 sweeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeet.
.
The weird thing is I saw Scott Hall doing the DX chop on that poster and thought it was very wrong.
This is what you get growing up watching wrestling. It's still my go to "I don't want to think anymore" guilty viewing pleasure.
RIP Chyna
Back to the AR thing.
Sorry... it won't happen. CAD has been around a couple decades now and it's still rare for a GC to do more with it than take-offs.
The other reality is that drawings are really 'conceptual'. As in Door 06 is really just a symbol that has conceptual meaning. It has a schedule, hardware, specification, and requires specific framing and so forth that no one in right mind is going so far as to model everything into the drawings. Basically that means your AR stuff, to be any more useful than just a videogame walkthrough, would need all the bits and pieces modeled just like it's built. That's manhours you'd have to build into your fee structure (good luck with that).
And after you've spent all that time... the door installer won't care anyway because he knows how to install a door and doesn't need all that information; He just needs to know what you want and will take care of the rest (and probably knows more about that stuff than you will ever need to know). So you are doing it for what reason exactly and who is going to find value in it? Just because you can, doesn't mean you should.
Good point Mightyaa. I get what you're saying. What if they make contacts or glasses able to show virtual images and they process through your phone and cost less than $100. Then wouldn't it be more beneficial just to have a pair of those and you can resize the plans right in front of you. Always having them floating next to you if you need them rather then spend however much money printing blueprints. It doesn't to be full 3D rendering through out the space. It can just be a pdf file that you can turn off and on. I know AR won't be that refined for another decade or so maybe, but it'll get there for sure.
^no.
If you spent literally less than 12 seconds on a construction site you'd see why it's totally impractical idea. My site super on a large office building carries an ipad mini around with all the current CDs, SI,s CCN, and various reports all tied into an interactive package. Tradesmen asks a question and he looks it up to see what instructions I've made.
^I literally have no idea what the hell you just said.
I don't have 12 seconds to be on a construction site. I have a VR headset and the internet has VR porn.
You also know why it's ridiculous Ricky Bobby if you ever spent any time in either an arch office or a construction site.
Wrong.
If an alien landed in Astoria, Balkins would be the one to lecture the alien on what the alien's home planet is like ... as well as the alien's language, civilization, technologies, biology, physiology, psychology, etc.
The fact that clients can barely tell what is going on when looking at conventional drawings/CDs and often need renderings to understand the design of the space - AR and VR (presentation techniques) would be an elegant solution to visualization inabilities on the clients side.
HIGHLY DOUBT IT!
Man, I missed Rick's wall of text...
Just a couple corrections... I've been around the block a long time. The government actually isn't slow to adopt in their requirements; just slow in getting it themselves. The first CAD station my Dad's firm got in the '80's was specifically required by their Federal work with GSA, DOD and Postal Service. All the other projects were still on drafting boards.
The first adopters of Revit and BIM was also government. My personal theory is Autodesk, with the absurd fees they collect from us doesn't spend it on development; they spend a ton on marketing. You can look it up, but they spend just over half of what the AIA does on professional political lobbying efforts.... So... Government REQUIRES certain formats because they get sold on the idea.
I go round and round with this with my sister who is a university campus architect and their regulations. They require all this BIM and standards. I ask her if she's ever or knows anyone on staff who has ever opened the file to find a certain part or spec rather than just look at the problem and fix it (like replacing a flush valve or drinking fountain)... She hasn't. They are sold on the theory, but it doesn't go beyond that.
So... if they want to get AR in the mainstream, they need to market those that set the standards/regulations we have to conform to. Government agencies are really the only ones who's reach is large enough, and build enough to force adoption throughout an industry.
If AR puts Autodesk and Adobe out of business, I'm OK with that.