My university offers a degree in Construction Management. I'm curious as to what they do and if it's anything remotely similar to Architecture? I've done a little bit of research and they appear to make really good money. Is it a lot of field work? Or is it more an office type job?
wurdan freo
Mar 18, 16 9:23 pm
Do some more research.... not hard to find a job description out there... look at websites such as mccarthy, turner, mortenson, kitchell, sundt, etc.
Carrera
Mar 18, 16 10:20 pm
In the simplest of terms architecture is drawing things and CM is building things (managing the building of things). Curriculum content overlaps somewhat, because they both involve buildings. There’s no licensing involved in the CM path and depending on the size of the CM company & projects it’s 50/50 on whether you would be in the office or field….big companies doing big projects (like Turner) move both disciplines to field offices for the duration of projects….so everybody is technically in the field. The larger firms like Turner have intern development programs and great need to beginners to manage the minutiae associated with large projects.
Mar 19, 16 3:58 am
Carrera,
Sometimes in some places, CM may require licensing. This depends on the licensing board in charge of licensing construction contractors. It depends on how the laws are written and interpreted.
This depends on interpretation of the term Construction Management. If you are operating more as Owner's Authorized Representative / Owner's Project Manager.... no.... a license is not required. It's kind of similar to a PM combined with the age old..... Clerk of the Works. Sometimes, the CoW was also PM/Owner's Authorized Rep. So what that title means exactly is sort of fluid and up to interpretation.
Mar 19, 16 4:32 am
In Oregon,
"Construction Management" is defined in OAR 812 and would be considered Work of Contractor and therefore would likely fall into requiring a license. CCB even requires a license for developer.
There is multiple licensing tiers in Oregon.
812-002-0760 Work as a Contractor Includes “Work as a contractor”, as used in ORS 701.021 includes, but is not limited to:
(1) Except as modified by section (8) of this rule, construction, alteration, repair, improvement, inspection, set-up, erection, moving, or demolition of a structure or any other improvement to real estate, including activities performed on-site in the normal course of construction, or receiving and accepting any payments for the above.
(2) Concrete, asphalt and other testing that involves structural modifications, and soils testing associated with planned or existing structures.
(3) Construction management.
.... (SNIPPED the rest of that)
and
701.021 License requirement; endorsements. (1) Except as provided in ORS 701.010, a person or joint venture that undertakes, offers to undertake or submits a bid to do work as a contractor must have a current license issued by the Construction Contractors Board and possess an appropriate endorsement as provided in this section. For purposes of offering to undertake or submitting a bid to do work, a partnership or joint venture is licensed and endorsed if any partner or joint venturer whose name appears in the business name of the partnership or joint venture has a current license issued by the board and possesses an appropriate endorsement.
(2) A person or joint venture that undertakes, offers to undertake or submits a bid to do work as a contractor in preparation for or in connection with a residential structure must have one of the following endorsements:
(a) Residential general contractor.
(b) Residential specialty contractor.
(c) Residential limited contractor.
(d) Residential developer.
... (Snipped the rest)
Now OAR 812 does define Construction Management to describe what they mean:
812-002-0160 Construction Management “Construction management” is the coordinating of a construction project, including, but not limited to, selecting contractors to perform work on the project, obtaining permits, scheduling specialty contractors’ work, and purchasing materials. “Construction management” does not include consulting work performed by a registered engineer or a licensed architect when operating as provided by ORS 701.010(8).
So long as you don't use the term or the title above, and what you do doesn't run afoul of the rules.... you should be okay. You might just have to use PM instead or Owner's Rep. or somehow fall into an exemption.
Mar 19, 16 4:33 am
Other states rule may differ.
I just quoted Oregon as that is more easier for me to point out. Others can dig through their own state laws and rules. I don't want the headache.
I have provided a supporting evidence in at least one state where a contractor license maybe required.
Mar 19, 16 4:37 am
Believe me guys, if you can pass the CCB exam, the Oregon's JE exam for Architect licensure is a piece of cake.
Awsilva
Mar 19, 16 6:15 am
Thank you for all the info, guys!
@RickB-OR to get more to the point of my thread, would a bachelors degree in Construction Management make it easier for me to pass the ARE and become a licensed architect? The reason I don't want to necessarily go for the bachelors in Architecture is because there aren't that many universities in my state that offer it. Most are private and have a tuition of 30k+. So considering how architects don't necessarily have the best job security, I want to avoid being in a massive hole of student debt. A construction management bachelors degree is offered at my local university, I can graduate 3 years earlier, and the tuition is basically free. (Under 6k, but financial aid pays most of it).
Mar 19, 16 7:20 am
Awsilva,
I don't know where you plan to be licensed but what I do know is the licensing laws are geared around making the prescriptive NAAB accredited degree, IDP or I should say AXP in June, ARE path being the most widely accepted and easiest path to licensure and shortest.
The main NAAB accredited degree path, we have today were contrived to support the Architecture school accredited by NAAB. It is a text book, joined to hip.... partners in 'crime' approach of AIA... NAAB...NCARB as the triad that governs the licensing process for the licensed profession.
If you want a license in the fewest possible years, you would logically get the NAAB accredited degree. HOWEVER, not so fast.... it isn't a guarantee that is will be the shortest path for you especially if you don't get employed because you have just yet another joe with a NAAB degree but nothing else that makes you stand out or necessarily show that you have something to offer the firm beyond everyone else. What makes you wanted and would help you keep the job instead of being just another disposable intern.
In which case, it MIGHT make more sense to have a CM degree and then pick up an NAAB accredited degree. So it might be 2 years more in education but it could be a trade off in being more valuable and marketable. I suppose with each firm out there, it will be an opinion take. I have heard some that would value the CM especially you are into design & construction.
However, I would NOT recommend getting just a CM degree alone because some states don't recognize it for much more than many 1-3 years of education out of 8 or so years combination of education/experience as an alternative. Some states, don't recognize it at all for an initial registration so you have to either reciprocate or do the BEA process of getting some sort of NCARB Certification of sort.
To BEST answer you, it helps to know WHERE you intend to become licensed. What states do you intend to practice. However, you will need to periodically reassess at times for changes unless you take the most universal path to licensure in the U.S..... (NAAB accredited architecture degree + IDP + ARE.... path).
Outside the U.S., and we are talking a whole different ball game. Different rules. So forth.
You mention student loan debt concern, having an education that keeps you busy and having an income in the AEC field, perhaps first getting a CM degree and then getting an NAAB accredited architecture degree in one of those M.Arch programs. It might help keep you out of being laid off as much as some because you maybe even valued more at a firm than an intern with only an NAAB degree.
I don't know how to direct you on any path.
As for passing the ARE, I am not sure. They are introducing the ARE 5.0 at some point. Anyone good at studying can probably pass the ARE. However, being an architect and such and getting authorized to take the test would be the first hurdle..... GETTING there.
By the time you take the ARE, it could be ARE 5.1 or 5.5 or 6.0. I wouldn't get too concerned about an exam that will probably morph in some way between now and the time you are authorized to take the ARE. It is hard to know until you get closer to that point.
Beepbeep
Mar 19, 16 8:59 am
Get the free CM BS degree and go work for a large contractor for a bit. Plus the CM program will really give you a better understanding of what an architect actually does. If you still want to become an architect after your undergrad and maybe a year or two of work you can go into a 3 yr M.arch program and will even get some credits for structures, building systems and materials and methods. I would recommend picking up a minor or even a double BS degree with a Fine Arts 3D emphasis or studio art if your local university has that. You will be extremely well prepared for an architectural program this way. However, I would bet that you would be happy with the CM jobs and not want to be an architect in a few years.
gdub
Mar 19, 16 6:03 pm
A construction management degree, leads to a job as an: estimator, project manager, superintendent or construction manager and then can move you into a path as a Operations Manager, Branch Manager, VP or President of a construction company. With respect to is it more of a field or office job, well, let's go through them one by one:
-(Entry level is Estimator/Quantity Surveyor)Pre-Construction Manager: The person in this role is generally in the office full time and is dealing with numbers. They are performing take off's and are pricing what is shown on the engineering and architectural drawings.
-(Entry level is Project Coordinator/Field Engineer)Project Manager: Some companies will put you on site in a field trailer and you will be working to assist the project manager and superintendent until you learn the ropes. Some companies will keep you in the office and you will visit your various sites from time to time. The people who get field training generally outperform those who don't. Project Managers who work on large projects($60 million+) generally are always stationed on site and have only that one project. Project Managers who have several projects at once, visits site from time to time and work from the office. Project Managers follow the designs of the consultant team and look after the cost and quality of the project to ensure that it meets the standards of the owner/developer.
-(Entry level is General Foreman, Assistant Super or Field Engineer)Superintendent: This position is on site full time and looks after all of the trades that work on site. When you graduate, you may start off as a foreman or carpenter, just so you get some experience on the tools, or you can go right into a field engineer or assistant super role. The Superintendent manages the construction schedule in combination with the project manager and literally runs the site activities.
-(Entry level is Assistant Constriction Manager)Construction Manager: A construction manager and project manager role are very similar. You look after the financials, protect the budget, look after the contracts, organize all the meetings and communicate with the consultant team(architect, electrical engineer, structural engineer, geotech engineer, mechanical engineer). You work in combination with the superintendent to run the project. In some companies, a construction manager is the role one attains after being a project manager for 6+ years, in which case the person in this role looks after several pm's and advises them with respect to construction and drives the hands on/technical side of construction of the company when problems arise.
-(Entry level: Intern Architect/Drafter/BIM Person/Contract Administrator)Architect: This person designs the built form of the building. They work with the client to come up with how the building will look and feel. They perform all associated drawings for architecture specifically. They perform field reviews to ensure that the building is being built in conformance to their design standards. Depending on the contract, the architect may be the Prime Consultant, in which case they are tasked with looking after the contracts for the entire design team of consultants. The architect works with the other consultants to ensure that their designs are coordinated with the other disciplines.
scottcaroline115
Aug 26, 21 8:03 pm
They are different. Construction Managers oversee daily project activities such as estimating, creating schedules, preparing budgets, etc. To answer your other question, yes, they typically work on-site since they oversee the progress of the projects. If you really want to pursue that career, I suggest you do a lot of research regarding the position of Construction Manager/Operations Manager. It does pay good but that's because it's not an easy job. Best of luck!
My university offers a degree in Construction Management. I'm curious as to what they do and if it's anything remotely similar to Architecture? I've done a little bit of research and they appear to make really good money. Is it a lot of field work? Or is it more an office type job?
Do some more research.... not hard to find a job description out there... look at websites such as mccarthy, turner, mortenson, kitchell, sundt, etc.
In the simplest of terms architecture is drawing things and CM is building things (managing the building of things). Curriculum content overlaps somewhat, because they both involve buildings. There’s no licensing involved in the CM path and depending on the size of the CM company & projects it’s 50/50 on whether you would be in the office or field….big companies doing big projects (like Turner) move both disciplines to field offices for the duration of projects….so everybody is technically in the field. The larger firms like Turner have intern development programs and great need to beginners to manage the minutiae associated with large projects.
Carrera,
Sometimes in some places, CM may require licensing. This depends on the licensing board in charge of licensing construction contractors. It depends on how the laws are written and interpreted.
This depends on interpretation of the term Construction Management. If you are operating more as Owner's Authorized Representative / Owner's Project Manager.... no.... a license is not required. It's kind of similar to a PM combined with the age old..... Clerk of the Works. Sometimes, the CoW was also PM/Owner's Authorized Rep. So what that title means exactly is sort of fluid and up to interpretation.
In Oregon,
"Construction Management" is defined in OAR 812 and would be considered Work of Contractor and therefore would likely fall into requiring a license. CCB even requires a license for developer.
There is multiple licensing tiers in Oregon.
812-002-0760 Work as a Contractor Includes “Work as a contractor”, as used in ORS 701.021 includes, but is not limited to:
(1) Except as modified by section (8) of this rule, construction, alteration, repair, improvement, inspection, set-up, erection, moving, or demolition of a structure or any other improvement to real estate, including activities performed on-site in the normal course of construction, or receiving and accepting any payments for the above.
(2) Concrete, asphalt and other testing that involves structural modifications, and soils testing associated with planned or existing structures.
(3) Construction management.
.... (SNIPPED the rest of that)
and
701.021 License requirement; endorsements. (1) Except as provided in ORS 701.010, a person or joint venture that undertakes, offers to undertake or submits a bid to do work as a contractor must have a current license issued by the Construction Contractors Board and possess an appropriate endorsement as provided in this section. For purposes of offering to undertake or submitting a bid to do work, a partnership or joint venture is licensed and endorsed if any partner or joint venturer whose name appears in the business name of the partnership or joint venture has a current license issued by the board and possesses an appropriate endorsement.
(2) A person or joint venture that undertakes, offers to undertake or submits a bid to do work as a contractor in preparation for or in connection with a residential structure must have one of the following endorsements:
(a) Residential general contractor.
(b) Residential specialty contractor.
(c) Residential limited contractor.
(d) Residential developer.
... (Snipped the rest)
Now OAR 812 does define Construction Management to describe what they mean:
812-002-0160 Construction Management “Construction management” is the coordinating of a construction project, including, but not limited to, selecting contractors to perform work on the project, obtaining permits, scheduling specialty contractors’ work, and purchasing materials. “Construction management” does not include consulting work performed by a registered engineer or a licensed architect when operating as provided by ORS 701.010(8).
So long as you don't use the term or the title above, and what you do doesn't run afoul of the rules.... you should be okay. You might just have to use PM instead or Owner's Rep. or somehow fall into an exemption.
Other states rule may differ.
I just quoted Oregon as that is more easier for me to point out. Others can dig through their own state laws and rules. I don't want the headache.
I have provided a supporting evidence in at least one state where a contractor license maybe required.
Believe me guys, if you can pass the CCB exam, the Oregon's JE exam for Architect licensure is a piece of cake.
Thank you for all the info, guys!
@RickB-OR to get more to the point of my thread, would a bachelors degree in Construction Management make it easier for me to pass the ARE and become a licensed architect? The reason I don't want to necessarily go for the bachelors in Architecture is because there aren't that many universities in my state that offer it. Most are private and have a tuition of 30k+. So considering how architects don't necessarily have the best job security, I want to avoid being in a massive hole of student debt. A construction management bachelors degree is offered at my local university, I can graduate 3 years earlier, and the tuition is basically free. (Under 6k, but financial aid pays most of it).
Awsilva,
I don't know where you plan to be licensed but what I do know is the licensing laws are geared around making the prescriptive NAAB accredited degree, IDP or I should say AXP in June, ARE path being the most widely accepted and easiest path to licensure and shortest.
The main NAAB accredited degree path, we have today were contrived to support the Architecture school accredited by NAAB. It is a text book, joined to hip.... partners in 'crime' approach of AIA... NAAB...NCARB as the triad that governs the licensing process for the licensed profession.
If you want a license in the fewest possible years, you would logically get the NAAB accredited degree. HOWEVER, not so fast.... it isn't a guarantee that is will be the shortest path for you especially if you don't get employed because you have just yet another joe with a NAAB degree but nothing else that makes you stand out or necessarily show that you have something to offer the firm beyond everyone else. What makes you wanted and would help you keep the job instead of being just another disposable intern.
In which case, it MIGHT make more sense to have a CM degree and then pick up an NAAB accredited degree. So it might be 2 years more in education but it could be a trade off in being more valuable and marketable. I suppose with each firm out there, it will be an opinion take. I have heard some that would value the CM especially you are into design & construction.
However, I would NOT recommend getting just a CM degree alone because some states don't recognize it for much more than many 1-3 years of education out of 8 or so years combination of education/experience as an alternative. Some states, don't recognize it at all for an initial registration so you have to either reciprocate or do the BEA process of getting some sort of NCARB Certification of sort.
To BEST answer you, it helps to know WHERE you intend to become licensed. What states do you intend to practice. However, you will need to periodically reassess at times for changes unless you take the most universal path to licensure in the U.S..... (NAAB accredited architecture degree + IDP + ARE.... path).
Outside the U.S., and we are talking a whole different ball game. Different rules. So forth.
You mention student loan debt concern, having an education that keeps you busy and having an income in the AEC field, perhaps first getting a CM degree and then getting an NAAB accredited architecture degree in one of those M.Arch programs. It might help keep you out of being laid off as much as some because you maybe even valued more at a firm than an intern with only an NAAB degree.
I don't know how to direct you on any path.
As for passing the ARE, I am not sure. They are introducing the ARE 5.0 at some point. Anyone good at studying can probably pass the ARE. However, being an architect and such and getting authorized to take the test would be the first hurdle..... GETTING there.
By the time you take the ARE, it could be ARE 5.1 or 5.5 or 6.0. I wouldn't get too concerned about an exam that will probably morph in some way between now and the time you are authorized to take the ARE. It is hard to know until you get closer to that point.
Get the free CM BS degree and go work for a large contractor for a bit. Plus the CM program will really give you a better understanding of what an architect actually does. If you still want to become an architect after your undergrad and maybe a year or two of work you can go into a 3 yr M.arch program and will even get some credits for structures, building systems and materials and methods. I would recommend picking up a minor or even a double BS degree with a Fine Arts 3D emphasis or studio art if your local university has that. You will be extremely well prepared for an architectural program this way. However, I would bet that you would be happy with the CM jobs and not want to be an architect in a few years.
A construction management degree, leads to a job as an: estimator, project manager, superintendent or construction manager and then can move you into a path as a Operations Manager, Branch Manager, VP or President of a construction company. With respect to is it more of a field or office job, well, let's go through them one by one:
-(Entry level is Estimator/Quantity Surveyor)Pre-Construction Manager: The person in this role is generally in the office full time and is dealing with numbers. They are performing take off's and are pricing what is shown on the engineering and architectural drawings.
-(Entry level is Project Coordinator/Field Engineer)Project Manager: Some companies will put you on site in a field trailer and you will be working to assist the project manager and superintendent until you learn the ropes. Some companies will keep you in the office and you will visit your various sites from time to time. The people who get field training generally outperform those who don't. Project Managers who work on large projects($60 million+) generally are always stationed on site and have only that one project. Project Managers who have several projects at once, visits site from time to time and work from the office. Project Managers follow the designs of the consultant team and look after the cost and quality of the project to ensure that it meets the standards of the owner/developer.
-(Entry level is General Foreman, Assistant Super or Field Engineer)Superintendent: This position is on site full time and looks after all of the trades that work on site. When you graduate, you may start off as a foreman or carpenter, just so you get some experience on the tools, or you can go right into a field engineer or assistant super role. The Superintendent manages the construction schedule in combination with the project manager and literally runs the site activities.
-(Entry level is Assistant Constriction Manager)Construction Manager: A construction manager and project manager role are very similar. You look after the financials, protect the budget, look after the contracts, organize all the meetings and communicate with the consultant team(architect, electrical engineer, structural engineer, geotech engineer, mechanical engineer). You work in combination with the superintendent to run the project. In some companies, a construction manager is the role one attains after being a project manager for 6+ years, in which case the person in this role looks after several pm's and advises them with respect to construction and drives the hands on/technical side of construction of the company when problems arise.
-(Entry level: Intern Architect/Drafter/BIM Person/Contract Administrator)Architect: This person designs the built form of the building. They work with the client to come up with how the building will look and feel. They perform all associated drawings for architecture specifically. They perform field reviews to ensure that the building is being built in conformance to their design standards. Depending on the contract, the architect may be the Prime Consultant, in which case they are tasked with looking after the contracts for the entire design team of consultants. The architect works with the other consultants to ensure that their designs are coordinated with the other disciplines.
They are different. Construction Managers oversee daily project activities such as estimating, creating schedules, preparing budgets, etc. To answer your other question, yes, they typically work on-site since they oversee the progress of the projects. If you really want to pursue that career, I suggest you do a lot of research regarding the position of Construction Manager/Operations Manager. It does pay good but that's because it's not an easy job. Best of luck!