Before you smart asses get started, I have an AS in drafting and design and a BS in construction management. I swung a hammer for about 5 years working on large custom homes, multifamily, and production housing. I also have worked for a licensed architect for about 2 years (though this was about 8 years ago). My background also includes estimating and construction management. Currently, I am working for a large general contractor and work as a freelance architectural/structural drafter. How much of this experience do you think could be used towards getting licensed? I am in a state where you can get licensed with only 8 years of experience and no degree. I am just curious if all this experience would knock a few years off the requirements?
Non Sequitur
Aug 29, 16 5:21 pm
... probably best to ask you state's licensing board although I'm not sure swinging a hammer counts for much nor does a drafting certificate... you don't get much reliable code or building systems/assembly experience that way. Your best bet is probably the time spent in the office.
Don't you still have to write the exams thou?
Everyday Intern
Aug 29, 16 6:46 pm
In addition to asking the state licensing board, you should probably get familiar with NCARB and their website and start looking around there for how your experience will be credited in AXP (I'd start here and here, establish a record if you haven't already). I'm not sure whether the 8 years required by your state need to be in Experience Setting A, or if employment in Experience Setting O will count. You might be able to get credit for the two years you worked for a licensed architect toward the 8 total you'll need in your state. If you can get some under Setting O then you might be able to reduce the 8 substantially.
You might be able to get some credit toward AXP from those two years via an AXP Portfolio (some restrictions apply). Since the experience is older than 5 years though that is really the only way I know of.
You can't count your current freelance drafting work toward AXP, unless they've changed their stance on independent contractors vs. employees. However, you can start counting some of the work you're doing for the GC under Experience Setting O (only a certain number of hours though before you max out). Eventually, you're going to have to get a job under an architect (especially if the 8 years required by your state need to be in Setting A).
citizen
Aug 29, 16 9:42 pm
"Before you smart asses get started..." You sure know how to sweet-talk a girl, don't you? That cracked me up because it's so true.
The range of experience you describe would make you a great practitioner, though I don't know how much of it will plug specific holes in the licensing process. I agree that time spent communicating with someone knowledgeable at your state board is your best next step. Much better info there than from the smart-asses here...
gruen
Aug 29, 16 10:32 pm
Ricky Ricky Ricky.
Beepbeep
Aug 31, 16 10:18 pm
Depending on the state... Which is it? I would assume that your as and bs would count for some since it is architecturally related and your 2 years would count and also some of the construction, I bet you could probably start taking he exams and by the time ou finished and worked for an architect a couple more years you would be good.
If that's the case, my same advice applies. I'll add to it that you should look at neighboring states like Washington (who only makes you work for 5 years with a bachelor's degree). Don't bother looking at Oregon, we all know they don't allow it without a NAAB-degree.
Looks like you could start taking the exams sooner in WA compared to ID as well. If you aren't tied to practicing architecture in a particular state, you might be able to cut some years off the process of getting an initial license.
Sep 1, 16 2:25 pm
You might be able to get some credit toward AXP from those two years via an AXP Portfolio (some restrictions apply). Since the experience is older than 5 years though that is really the only way I know of.
I read somewhere in the AXP guidelines or one of the other guidelines from NCARB that if you use AXP Portfolio route, you can not also be using the normal AXP path and also be using the AXP portfolio path (at the same time). You do one or the other.
If that's the case, my same advice applies. I'll add to it that you should look at neighboring states like Washington (who only makes you work for 5 years with a bachelor's degree). Don't bother looking at Oregon, we all know they don't allow it without a NAAB-degree.
Not so fast. New alternative path in the NCARB Certificate that replaces BEA maybe accepted as it is board rule to accept NCARB Certification. The Board rule already does accept BEA but NCARB's new rule replaces the BEA with a new alternate path in the NCARB Certification process. Therefore, it IS possible under the new NCARB Certificate path that was approved last month. Having said that, it is to be seen in actual practice if the board will approve NCARB certificate under this path. It is entirely unknown if the board will change the rules to accept that path in the years to come. Oregon licensing board's architects have been known to be sycophants to the architecture schools.
It'll probably be a decade before the OP obtains the following:
- Initial licensure
- NCARB Certification under the new alternate path.
- Oregon registration (if the board approves this new alternate path to NCARB Certification for reciprocity into Oregon). A lot can happen between now and then.
Sep 1, 16 2:47 pm
I will have to say, this talk about reciprocity into Oregon really isn't what the OP is asking for answers for in the original post.
no_form
Sep 1, 16 3:03 pm
Note: Richard Balkins, RickB-OR, RWCB_PBD, does not hold an NAAB-accredited degree or foreign equivalent. He is not a licensed architect in the United States or abroad. He is not an experienced design professional.
Sep 1, 16 3:12 pm
no_form,
You don't need to be a design professional, or licensed to read the board rules and NCARB's news.
All you need to do is read.
no_form
Sep 1, 16 3:17 pm
Note: Richard Balkins, RickB-OR, RWCB_PBD, does not hold an NAAB-accredited degree or foreign equivalent. He is not a licensed architect in the United States or abroad. He is not an experienced design professional.
Sep 1, 16 3:21 pm
no_form.
no_form
Sep 1, 16 3:30 pm
Note: Richard Balkins, RickB-OR, RWCB_PBD, does not hold an NAAB-accredited degree or foreign equivalent. He is not a licensed architect in the United States or abroad. He is not an experienced design professional.
Sep 1, 16 3:34 pm
no_form.
Non Sequitur
Sep 1, 16 4:05 pm
Note: Richard Balkins, RickB-OR, RWCB_PBD, does not hold an NAAB-accredited degree or foreign equivalent. He is not a licensed architect in the United States or abroad. He is not an experienced design professional... nor can he read good.
Sep 1, 16 4:06 pm
non sequitur.
Everyday Intern
Sep 1, 16 4:10 pm
Rick, just stop. There is no need for you to insert your situation into the thread. The OP never mentioned wanting to get a NCARB certificate so that doesn't apply. Neither does getting reciprocal licensure in Oregon. That's what you care about, not the OP (as far as we can discern from their posts). All we can discern is that they are looking for a quicker path to licensure than 8 years. I provided actual, credible information to aid them in that. You are just trying to make the thread about yourself.
(1) To become registered by reciprocity to practice architecture in Oregon, an individual must possess an active registration from another board-recognized jurisdiction, and
(a) Possess an active NCARB Certificate, or
(b) Possess documentary evidence of the following:
(A) A first professional degree in architecture from a NAAB-accredited program of architecture;
(B) Successful completion of all sections of the ARE;
(C) Completion of the NCARB IDP, or two years of consecutive and active practice in architecture in a board-recognized jurisdiction after initial registration;
(D) If an individual has not previously been examined for seismic and lateral forces knowledge through successful completion of an NCARB examination in 1965 or later, the individual must provide evidence of successfully completing the NCARB Division Structural Systems examination.
(2) All applicants for registration by reciprocity must:
(a) Complete the Reciprocity Application;
(b) Pay required fees;
(c) Provide all required documentation in section (1);
(d) Pass the Jurisprudence Exam according to 806-010-0020(6).
(3) The Board reserves the right to require an oral interview of any reciprocity applicant. Oral interviews are held on regularly scheduled Board meeting dates. If an oral interview is required, the applicant will be notified.
There's a huge difference between merely reading and comprehending.
Non Sequitur
Sep 1, 16 4:26 pm
Note: Richard Balkins, RickB-OR, RWCB_PBD, does not hold an NAAB-accredited degree or foreign equivalent. He is not a licensed architect in the United States or abroad. He is not an experienced design professional.
SpontaneousCombustion
Sep 1, 16 4:26 pm
To the original poster here are some things to keep in mind about the BEA process:
1. Historically the success rate of BEA applicants has been about 35%, and the application and portfolio review process has exceeded 1 year.
2. Until this very recent change that Rick mentioned, these applicants were all licensed professionals with a minimum of 6 to 10 years of practice after first obtaining a license in at least one state. I understand that this new system is intended to shorten and "streamline" the process - but it remains to be seen whether cutting the experience required by several years may result in an even higher percentage of applications being rejected.
3. Currently there are several states that do not accept the BEA route to certification as a means to reciprocity. They are listed on NCARB's site.
4. This number of states has grown since the announcement a couple years ago of the intended implementation of this "streamlined" BEA overhaul, and a few more states have indicated that they are likely to vote it down for reciprocity in their states but were holding off until this final roll out.
It may be a viable route for some people, in some states, but shouldn't be counted on without thorough research about the states where you intend to practice, an understanding of the timeframes, and an understanding that the rules are constantly in flux.
senjohnblutarsky
Sep 1, 16 4:40 pm
Poster would probably be better off to go for a three year masters. Log current experience in a standard IDP or whateverthehelltheycallitnow. Grad school would count towards some of the hours. 1.5-2 years out of school and you're licensed.
Sep 1, 16 4:44 pm
What does this say:
(1) To become registered by reciprocity to practice architecture in Oregon, an individual must possess an active registration from another board-recognized jurisdiction, and
When you complete this new alternative path for NCARB Certificate, are you or are you not in possession of an active NCARB Certificate and active registration from another board recognized jurisdiction?
no_form
Sep 1, 16 4:56 pm
Note: Richard Balkins, RickB-OR, RWCB_PBD, does not hold an NAAB-accredited degree or foreign equivalent. He is not a licensed architect in the United States or abroad. He is not an experienced design professional.
x-jla
Sep 1, 16 5:05 pm
The question is, why become an architect if you can become a contractor with your experience? You can do design/build and make 3x as much $ with more control over the design outcome...
Sep 1, 16 5:13 pm
jla-x,
Indeed.
x-jla
Sep 1, 16 5:51 pm
That's not to say you shouldn't study design and become a good designer...
SpontaneousCombustion
Sep 1, 16 7:41 pm
Rick so far Oregon has not made a distinction between an NCARB certificate earned by the usual NAAB-degree + experience route, and the BEA route. So for the moment either one should suffice. However, there are several states that do make a distinction between the two in their rules, and do not accept the latter. So while a BEA NCARB certificate holder does have an NCARB certificate, they do not have the type of NCARB certificate that will allow them to get reciprocity in those states. Additionally, there are some other states that will accept an NCARB certificate earned via the BEA process, but not the BEFA process.
This is another of those situations where your particular circumstances and the rules of Oregon don't automatically match the rules of others' states. In addition to the states that already differentiate between types of NCARB certificates, some states have specifically noted in board minutes that they are still evaluating this latest version of BEA/BEFA, and have not yet decided on whether to continue to accept it as equivalent to the "standard" NCARB certificate or not.
SpontaneousCombustion
Sep 1, 16 7:51 pm
Current info from NCARB:
# of states that do not accept an NCARB Certificate that was granted upon satisfaction of the requirements of the Broadly Experienced Architect program: 7.
# of states that do not accept an NCARB Certificate that was granted upon satisfaction of the requirements of the Alternative to Certification for Foreign Architects program: 10.
Before you smart asses get started, I have an AS in drafting and design and a BS in construction management. I swung a hammer for about 5 years working on large custom homes, multifamily, and production housing. I also have worked for a licensed architect for about 2 years (though this was about 8 years ago). My background also includes estimating and construction management. Currently, I am working for a large general contractor and work as a freelance architectural/structural drafter. How much of this experience do you think could be used towards getting licensed? I am in a state where you can get licensed with only 8 years of experience and no degree. I am just curious if all this experience would knock a few years off the requirements?
... probably best to ask you state's licensing board although I'm not sure swinging a hammer counts for much nor does a drafting certificate... you don't get much reliable code or building systems/assembly experience that way. Your best bet is probably the time spent in the office.
Don't you still have to write the exams thou?
In addition to asking the state licensing board, you should probably get familiar with NCARB and their website and start looking around there for how your experience will be credited in AXP (I'd start here and here, establish a record if you haven't already). I'm not sure whether the 8 years required by your state need to be in Experience Setting A, or if employment in Experience Setting O will count. You might be able to get credit for the two years you worked for a licensed architect toward the 8 total you'll need in your state. If you can get some under Setting O then you might be able to reduce the 8 substantially.
You might be able to get some credit toward AXP from those two years via an AXP Portfolio (some restrictions apply). Since the experience is older than 5 years though that is really the only way I know of.
You can't count your current freelance drafting work toward AXP, unless they've changed their stance on independent contractors vs. employees. However, you can start counting some of the work you're doing for the GC under Experience Setting O (only a certain number of hours though before you max out). Eventually, you're going to have to get a job under an architect (especially if the 8 years required by your state need to be in Setting A).
"Before you smart asses get started..." You sure know how to sweet-talk a girl, don't you? That cracked me up because it's so true.
The range of experience you describe would make you a great practitioner, though I don't know how much of it will plug specific holes in the licensing process. I agree that time spent communicating with someone knowledgeable at your state board is your best next step. Much better info there than from the smart-asses here...
Ricky Ricky Ricky.
Depending on the state... Which is it? I would assume that your as and bs would count for some since it is architecturally related and your 2 years would count and also some of the construction, I bet you could probably start taking he exams and by the time ou finished and worked for an architect a couple more years you would be good.
My guess is the OP is in Idaho based on previous threads mentioning where they were enrolled in school, and seeing that Idaho offers alternative paths to licensure with 8 years experience when you don't have a NAAB-degree.
If that's the case, my same advice applies. I'll add to it that you should look at neighboring states like Washington (who only makes you work for 5 years with a bachelor's degree). Don't bother looking at Oregon, we all know they don't allow it without a NAAB-degree.
Looks like you could start taking the exams sooner in WA compared to ID as well. If you aren't tied to practicing architecture in a particular state, you might be able to cut some years off the process of getting an initial license.
You might be able to get some credit toward AXP from those two years via an AXP Portfolio (some restrictions apply). Since the experience is older than 5 years though that is really the only way I know of.
I read somewhere in the AXP guidelines or one of the other guidelines from NCARB that if you use AXP Portfolio route, you can not also be using the normal AXP path and also be using the AXP portfolio path (at the same time). You do one or the other.
If that's the case, my same advice applies. I'll add to it that you should look at neighboring states like Washington (who only makes you work for 5 years with a bachelor's degree). Don't bother looking at Oregon, we all know they don't allow it without a NAAB-degree.
Not so fast. New alternative path in the NCARB Certificate that replaces BEA maybe accepted as it is board rule to accept NCARB Certification. The Board rule already does accept BEA but NCARB's new rule replaces the BEA with a new alternate path in the NCARB Certification process. Therefore, it IS possible under the new NCARB Certificate path that was approved last month. Having said that, it is to be seen in actual practice if the board will approve NCARB certificate under this path. It is entirely unknown if the board will change the rules to accept that path in the years to come. Oregon licensing board's architects have been known to be sycophants to the architecture schools.
It'll probably be a decade before the OP obtains the following:
- Initial licensure
- NCARB Certification under the new alternate path.
- Oregon registration (if the board approves this new alternate path to NCARB Certification for reciprocity into Oregon). A lot can happen between now and then.
I will have to say, this talk about reciprocity into Oregon really isn't what the OP is asking for answers for in the original post.
Note: Richard Balkins, RickB-OR, RWCB_PBD, does not hold an NAAB-accredited degree or foreign equivalent. He is not a licensed architect in the United States or abroad. He is not an experienced design professional.
no_form,
You don't need to be a design professional, or licensed to read the board rules and NCARB's news.
All you need to do is read.
Note: Richard Balkins, RickB-OR, RWCB_PBD, does not hold an NAAB-accredited degree or foreign equivalent. He is not a licensed architect in the United States or abroad. He is not an experienced design professional.
no_form.
Note: Richard Balkins, RickB-OR, RWCB_PBD, does not hold an NAAB-accredited degree or foreign equivalent. He is not a licensed architect in the United States or abroad. He is not an experienced design professional.
no_form.
Note: Richard Balkins, RickB-OR, RWCB_PBD, does not hold an NAAB-accredited degree or foreign equivalent. He is not a licensed architect in the United States or abroad. He is not an experienced design professional... nor can he read good.
non sequitur.
Rick, just stop. There is no need for you to insert your situation into the thread. The OP never mentioned wanting to get a NCARB certificate so that doesn't apply. Neither does getting reciprocal licensure in Oregon. That's what you care about, not the OP (as far as we can discern from their posts). All we can discern is that they are looking for a quicker path to licensure than 8 years. I provided actual, credible information to aid them in that. You are just trying to make the thread about yourself.
http://arcweb.sos.state.or.us/pages/rules/oars_800/oar_806/806_010.html
OAR 806-010-0035
Registration by Reciprocity
(1) To become registered by reciprocity to practice architecture in Oregon, an individual must possess an active registration from another board-recognized jurisdiction, and
(a) Possess an active NCARB Certificate, or
(b) Possess documentary evidence of the following:
(A) A first professional degree in architecture from a NAAB-accredited program of architecture;
(B) Successful completion of all sections of the ARE;
(C) Completion of the NCARB IDP, or two years of consecutive and active practice in architecture in a board-recognized jurisdiction after initial registration;
(D) If an individual has not previously been examined for seismic and lateral forces knowledge through successful completion of an NCARB examination in 1965 or later, the individual must provide evidence of successfully completing the NCARB Division Structural Systems examination.
(2) All applicants for registration by reciprocity must:
(a) Complete the Reciprocity Application;
(b) Pay required fees;
(c) Provide all required documentation in section (1);
(d) Pass the Jurisprudence Exam according to 806-010-0020(6).
(3) The Board reserves the right to require an oral interview of any reciprocity applicant. Oral interviews are held on regularly scheduled Board meeting dates. If an oral interview is required, the applicant will be notified.
http://www.ncarb.org/~/media/Files/PDF/Guidelines/EDU_Guidelines.pdf
and
http://www.ncarb.org/News-and-Events/News/2016/June-Education-Certificate.aspx
Read!
There's a huge difference between merely reading and comprehending.
Note: Richard Balkins, RickB-OR, RWCB_PBD, does not hold an NAAB-accredited degree or foreign equivalent. He is not a licensed architect in the United States or abroad. He is not an experienced design professional.
To the original poster here are some things to keep in mind about the BEA process:
1. Historically the success rate of BEA applicants has been about 35%, and the application and portfolio review process has exceeded 1 year.
2. Until this very recent change that Rick mentioned, these applicants were all licensed professionals with a minimum of 6 to 10 years of practice after first obtaining a license in at least one state. I understand that this new system is intended to shorten and "streamline" the process - but it remains to be seen whether cutting the experience required by several years may result in an even higher percentage of applications being rejected.
3. Currently there are several states that do not accept the BEA route to certification as a means to reciprocity. They are listed on NCARB's site.
4. This number of states has grown since the announcement a couple years ago of the intended implementation of this "streamlined" BEA overhaul, and a few more states have indicated that they are likely to vote it down for reciprocity in their states but were holding off until this final roll out.
It may be a viable route for some people, in some states, but shouldn't be counted on without thorough research about the states where you intend to practice, an understanding of the timeframes, and an understanding that the rules are constantly in flux.
Poster would probably be better off to go for a three year masters. Log current experience in a standard IDP or whateverthehelltheycallitnow. Grad school would count towards some of the hours. 1.5-2 years out of school and you're licensed.
What does this say:
(1) To become registered by reciprocity to practice architecture in Oregon, an individual must possess an active registration from another board-recognized jurisdiction, and
(a) Possess an active NCARB Certificate, or
and now read: http://www.ncarb.org/News-and-Events/News/2016/June-Education-Certificate.aspx
Now answer this question:
When you complete this new alternative path for NCARB Certificate, are you or are you not in possession of an active NCARB Certificate and active registration from another board recognized jurisdiction?
Note: Richard Balkins, RickB-OR, RWCB_PBD, does not hold an NAAB-accredited degree or foreign equivalent. He is not a licensed architect in the United States or abroad. He is not an experienced design professional.
The question is, why become an architect if you can become a contractor with your experience? You can do design/build and make 3x as much $ with more control over the design outcome...
jla-x,
Indeed.
That's not to say you shouldn't study design and become a good designer...
Rick so far Oregon has not made a distinction between an NCARB certificate earned by the usual NAAB-degree + experience route, and the BEA route. So for the moment either one should suffice. However, there are several states that do make a distinction between the two in their rules, and do not accept the latter. So while a BEA NCARB certificate holder does have an NCARB certificate, they do not have the type of NCARB certificate that will allow them to get reciprocity in those states. Additionally, there are some other states that will accept an NCARB certificate earned via the BEA process, but not the BEFA process.
This is another of those situations where your particular circumstances and the rules of Oregon don't automatically match the rules of others' states. In addition to the states that already differentiate between types of NCARB certificates, some states have specifically noted in board minutes that they are still evaluating this latest version of BEA/BEFA, and have not yet decided on whether to continue to accept it as equivalent to the "standard" NCARB certificate or not.
Current info from NCARB:
# of states that do not accept an NCARB Certificate that was granted upon satisfaction of the requirements of the Broadly Experienced Architect program: 7.
# of states that do not accept an NCARB Certificate that was granted upon satisfaction of the requirements of the Alternative to Certification for Foreign Architects program: 10.
I expect we will see these numbers increase.