Yeah, but how much did SOM make? 3%? Was it hourly?
med.
Jan 4, 10 2:07 pm
Not enough to keep all their staff employed apparently.
I hear they're down to about 250 these days.
A W
Jan 4, 10 2:36 pm
What do partners make there?
$1 million?
$2 million?
pmarch
Jan 4, 10 2:38 pm
Not hourly. Lump sum based on construction cost- and on a project this size I would guess its closer to 2% for full service.
poop876
Jan 4, 10 3:05 pm
Enough for Adrian Smith to start his own firm and say suck it SOM.
TED
Jan 4, 10 3:46 pm
Hey, I heard that kerwin was asked to leave the house! Amen, brother!
Distant Unicorn
Jan 4, 10 3:55 pm
2%? Oh mna, I've seen planning firms makes more than that.
poop876
Jan 4, 10 4:14 pm
Yeah, I'm not sure about Tom...but SOM is known for renewing itself at partnership level, so I wouldn't be surprised.
harold
Jan 4, 10 4:24 pm
The lawyers working on that project made about 12%. But then again, that is why they are rich and we are poor.
A W
Jan 4, 10 4:28 pm
Who were the attorneys?
chicagoarchitect
Jan 4, 10 4:32 pm
Kerwin left before Christmas...he was project manager for failed Olympics bid. Two lessons here: Mayor Daley is never at fault, even when he is; there is always a fall guy, preferably out-sourced. And, SOM eats its young.
vado retro
Jan 4, 10 5:23 pm
how much did those dudes from bangladesh rake in on that project? did theyeven get paid?
Those Bengali dudes should become home inspectors!
poop876
Jan 4, 10 6:59 pm
What was going on there was slavery in modern times, but we all turned the other way. These workers were bussed in and bussed out to their workers camps which were usually outside Dubai, and they were not allowed to make contact with any expats to let them know what is really going on. They slept with 10 other people in a dorm size room and were denied basic human rights. Their passports were usually taken away and they could not go back home. It is very sad. We were given 10,000/month apartments, paid no taxes, got our transportation paid and enjoyed the most luxurious life styles.
I'm going to dig out some of the interview that were conducted there and it will make you puke....
Im waiting for the 'Dubai evangelists', the couple of whom we have on archinect to come onto this thread and stop all the badmouthing about Dubai.
Distant Unicorn
Jan 5, 10 2:49 am
Que Fondue and "we all hate Arabs and muslims because we're white infidel invaders incapable of empathy."
Pot calling... Is kettle there? Is he black?
Distant Unicorn
Jan 5, 10 3:28 am
Distant Unicorn
Jan 5, 10 3:31 am
Distant Unicorn
Jan 5, 10 3:39 am
Distant Unicorn
Jan 5, 10 3:43 am
Distant Unicorn
Jan 5, 10 3:45 am
Distant Unicorn
Jan 5, 10 3:51 am
Distant Unicorn
Jan 5, 10 3:52 am
Distant Unicorn
Jan 5, 10 3:55 am
poop876
Jan 5, 10 5:55 am
Orochi, these are fucking hilarious!!!
chatter of clouds
Jan 5, 10 5:55 am
funny that that building, although way higher than everything else in dubai, doesn't look like "the tallest building in the world". it reminds me of that woody allen movie where he sees his mother's face in the sky...initimitabely recognizable yet scalelessly virtual. i haven't been in the vertical superlative though i've been to its neighbouring horizontal superlative, emaar's dubai mall. the kinokuniya bookstore there is great.
d-arch
Jan 5, 10 11:30 am
Harold, where did you get that 12% legal fee figure from?
Emilio
Jan 5, 10 1:43 pm
What looks large from a distance,
Close up ain't never that big.
chatter of clouds
Jan 6, 10 4:20 am
fanciful tall towers looks like perfume bottles from Brobdingnag dropped into Lilliputia.
rethinkit
Jan 6, 10 3:09 pm
I use to work at SOM - now I am out on streets of SF - after 13 months of looking for work - now it's " you don't have any recent experience" I guess I can go back to school and repeat my M.Arch education and then try finding a job in 2015 or whenever
Distant Unicorn
Jan 6, 10 3:17 pm
I use to be an art director for a "big" local publishing company (4 years experience) but I apparently don't have enough experience to be a secretary at an arch firm.
A W
Jan 6, 10 6:16 pm
Are both you guys unemployed?
Ouch!
It's a crazy time. SF is so expensive. When rent was $1500 a month, I lasted about 1 month and then got outta there. It's a pretty town but it's small and way over-priced.
roobqt
Jan 6, 10 8:13 pm
reverk - are you even getting interviews to where that statement is being said to you?
I've been out of full time employ for almost 2 years. Since then, I've had some contract work, almost full-time stuff (that never lasted), and some of my own work. In that time I lost my house, and had to move out of Southern California (lived there for 20+ years).
Being told "you don't have recent experience" is what I fear most - something none of us have control over and, as you all know, extremely frustrating.
It's very unfair that employers are using that line; many of us who have been unable to re-enter the profession due to no work.
Any comments/thoughts, anyone?
Justin Ather Maud
Jan 7, 10 1:49 pm
I think it's just their way of saying "we don't have a job for someone with your experience." They could get creative and come up with something better, but that might take some effort.
roobqt
Jan 7, 10 1:57 pm
Yes, and we wouldn't want anyone to make an EFFORT, right? lol...
Seriously, I hope that employers don't hold 'us' accountable for not having 'recent' work experience. It's not like I decided to run away to the Keys, and drink Lemon Drops poolside... sheez...
distant
Jan 7, 10 4:19 pm
"It's very unfair that employers are using that line; many of us who have been unable to re-enter the profession due to no work."
I don't mean to be unkind, but what does fairness have to do with this? When any employer has an opening, that employer naturally will hire the best available person, with the best available experience, at the best available price, to fill that vacant position. That's Economics 101.
Similarly, just a short 24-30 months back, any competent employment candidate wanting to make a move probably had 3-4 jobs offers to choose from -- those candidates were not bashful about playing one employer against another in order to sweeten their own deal. Would you have been sympathetic to those employers if they cried "unfair" ? I don't think so.
roobqt
Jan 7, 10 5:02 pm
Well, of course - the fair is at the fairgrounds... I know. My point was that for someone who's been unemployed for several months in this recession is not looked at in the same way, than to someone lucky enough to still have a job - they have a leg up.... why does a few months make any difference?
So, someone with more years experience but has been unemployed for 7 months is looked over by someone with less years experience but has a job?
That is what I'm saying isn't fair. But, of course, it doesn't mean they won't do it. My intention was not to come across as whining... just that it wasn't fair.
distant
Jan 7, 10 6:10 pm
Personally, I think you would be better served if you took the energy you're directing at "unfair" employers and figure out how to position yourself to be competitive in a difficult labor market.
Clearly, you're not the only person facing this difficulty. In many ways, this isn't much different from the challenge faced by all employment candidates all the time -- i.e. how do you convey your true capabilities within the limitations of a resume, portfolio and interview. Those who solve that equation will be the ones hired first as the economy strengthens
If you divert the energy you're using to be angry and invest it in figuring out a strategy to convey what you really can contribute to a firm, I think your chances for success will be greatly increased.
Good luck.
roobqt
Jan 7, 10 6:16 pm
Oh, I am - this 'energy' spent was the amount needed to think and type the word 'unfair.' You are right, and if I sounded whiny, I take it back. Just venting...
So the next time someone decides to build the next world's tallest, beware!
chatter of clouds
Jan 11, 10 2:46 pm
interesting link Milwaukee08.
as a counterpoint to that, a major reason why pharaohs used to build their own versions of skyscrapers, pyramids, was to afford "employment" to their subjects and therefore help sustain the economic system. but the difference is the pharaohs didn't need to borrow.
roobqt
Jan 11, 10 4:13 pm
hhhmmm... I thought that the pyramids were built by slaves - as the Burj, probably lured by the same 'carrot' that Cairo was paved in gold (or, in the case of Egyptians, that ascension into heaven was guaranteed by working on the pharaoh temples).
Seems we never learn from history. the Burj is our modern day sphinx.
Architect's fee on the Burj Dubai?
$1.5 billion in construction.
Does anyone know what the boys down the Santa Fe Building received for their services?
Now it's called Burj Khalifa.
Yeah, but how much did SOM make? 3%? Was it hourly?
Not enough to keep all their staff employed apparently.
I hear they're down to about 250 these days.
What do partners make there?
$1 million?
$2 million?
Not hourly. Lump sum based on construction cost- and on a project this size I would guess its closer to 2% for full service.
Enough for Adrian Smith to start his own firm and say suck it SOM.
Hey, I heard that kerwin was asked to leave the house! Amen, brother!
2%? Oh mna, I've seen planning firms makes more than that.
Yeah, I'm not sure about Tom...but SOM is known for renewing itself at partnership level, so I wouldn't be surprised.
The lawyers working on that project made about 12%. But then again, that is why they are rich and we are poor.
Who were the attorneys?
Kerwin left before Christmas...he was project manager for failed Olympics bid. Two lessons here: Mayor Daley is never at fault, even when he is; there is always a fall guy, preferably out-sourced. And, SOM eats its young.
how much did those dudes from bangladesh rake in on that project? did theyeven get paid?
vado:
$106-250/month, per this report from 2006. And that was during the boom times.....
Those Bengali dudes should become home inspectors!
What was going on there was slavery in modern times, but we all turned the other way. These workers were bussed in and bussed out to their workers camps which were usually outside Dubai, and they were not allowed to make contact with any expats to let them know what is really going on. They slept with 10 other people in a dorm size room and were denied basic human rights. Their passports were usually taken away and they could not go back home. It is very sad. We were given 10,000/month apartments, paid no taxes, got our transportation paid and enjoyed the most luxurious life styles.
I'm going to dig out some of the interview that were conducted there and it will make you puke....
oh here it is....
http://www.independent.co.uk/opinion/commentators/johann-hari/the-dark-side-of-dubai-1664368.html
Im waiting for the 'Dubai evangelists', the couple of whom we have on archinect to come onto this thread and stop all the badmouthing about Dubai.
Que Fondue and "we all hate Arabs and muslims because we're white infidel invaders incapable of empathy."
Pot calling... Is kettle there? Is he black?
Orochi, these are fucking hilarious!!!
funny that that building, although way higher than everything else in dubai, doesn't look like "the tallest building in the world". it reminds me of that woody allen movie where he sees his mother's face in the sky...initimitabely recognizable yet scalelessly virtual. i haven't been in the vertical superlative though i've been to its neighbouring horizontal superlative, emaar's dubai mall. the kinokuniya bookstore there is great.
Harold, where did you get that 12% legal fee figure from?
Close up ain't never that big.
fanciful tall towers looks like perfume bottles from Brobdingnag dropped into Lilliputia.
I use to work at SOM - now I am out on streets of SF - after 13 months of looking for work - now it's " you don't have any recent experience" I guess I can go back to school and repeat my M.Arch education and then try finding a job in 2015 or whenever
I use to be an art director for a "big" local publishing company (4 years experience) but I apparently don't have enough experience to be a secretary at an arch firm.
Are both you guys unemployed?
Ouch!
It's a crazy time. SF is so expensive. When rent was $1500 a month, I lasted about 1 month and then got outta there. It's a pretty town but it's small and way over-priced.
reverk - are you even getting interviews to where that statement is being said to you?
I've been out of full time employ for almost 2 years. Since then, I've had some contract work, almost full-time stuff (that never lasted), and some of my own work. In that time I lost my house, and had to move out of Southern California (lived there for 20+ years).
Being told "you don't have recent experience" is what I fear most - something none of us have control over and, as you all know, extremely frustrating.
It's very unfair that employers are using that line; many of us who have been unable to re-enter the profession due to no work.
Any comments/thoughts, anyone?
I think it's just their way of saying "we don't have a job for someone with your experience." They could get creative and come up with something better, but that might take some effort.
Yes, and we wouldn't want anyone to make an EFFORT, right? lol...
Seriously, I hope that employers don't hold 'us' accountable for not having 'recent' work experience. It's not like I decided to run away to the Keys, and drink Lemon Drops poolside... sheez...
I don't mean to be unkind, but what does fairness have to do with this? When any employer has an opening, that employer naturally will hire the best available person, with the best available experience, at the best available price, to fill that vacant position. That's Economics 101.
Similarly, just a short 24-30 months back, any competent employment candidate wanting to make a move probably had 3-4 jobs offers to choose from -- those candidates were not bashful about playing one employer against another in order to sweeten their own deal. Would you have been sympathetic to those employers if they cried "unfair" ? I don't think so.
Well, of course - the fair is at the fairgrounds... I know. My point was that for someone who's been unemployed for several months in this recession is not looked at in the same way, than to someone lucky enough to still have a job - they have a leg up.... why does a few months make any difference?
So, someone with more years experience but has been unemployed for 7 months is looked over by someone with less years experience but has a job?
That is what I'm saying isn't fair. But, of course, it doesn't mean they won't do it. My intention was not to come across as whining... just that it wasn't fair.
Personally, I think you would be better served if you took the energy you're directing at "unfair" employers and figure out how to position yourself to be competitive in a difficult labor market.
Clearly, you're not the only person facing this difficulty. In many ways, this isn't much different from the challenge faced by all employment candidates all the time -- i.e. how do you convey your true capabilities within the limitations of a resume, portfolio and interview. Those who solve that equation will be the ones hired first as the economy strengthens
If you divert the energy you're using to be angry and invest it in figuring out a strategy to convey what you really can contribute to a firm, I think your chances for success will be greatly increased.
Good luck.
Oh, I am - this 'energy' spent was the amount needed to think and type the word 'unfair.' You are right, and if I sounded whiny, I take it back. Just venting...
So the next time someone decides to build the next world's tallest, beware!
interesting link Milwaukee08.
as a counterpoint to that, a major reason why pharaohs used to build their own versions of skyscrapers, pyramids, was to afford "employment" to their subjects and therefore help sustain the economic system. but the difference is the pharaohs didn't need to borrow.
hhhmmm... I thought that the pyramids were built by slaves - as the Burj, probably lured by the same 'carrot' that Cairo was paved in gold (or, in the case of Egyptians, that ascension into heaven was guaranteed by working on the pharaoh temples).
Seems we never learn from history. the Burj is our modern day sphinx.
Yea... I just saw that on the news tonite!!! lol... my bad! I guess I take that whole 'slave' thing back...
Still....
Yes. $1.5 billion dollar. But, name of the building is Burj Khalifa. You can find burj khalifa financial output, birth history and more details here - https://www.uaecentral.com/burj-khalifa-the-emperor-of-architecture/
$5 a square foot.