That just about says it all. I'm Looking at the Netherlands as my #1 choice but I would love any other European country as well. The Netherlands appear to be fairly simple to get registered. I emailed the BNA enquiring about the process in english and a terribly broken Dutch translation. Didn't hear word one from them when all of a sudden a huge package arrived on my doorstep (in the U.S.) from the BNA advising me of the process. It appears as simple as sending in a College transcript, Curriculum Vitae (resume) and some money but I would have to recheck. The thing that scares me is the Dutch immigration rule that says that employers who employ a non-EU national must apply for that workers work visa and show that it did tried it's best to fill the position with a Dutch national but was unable to. Unless there's a huge shortage of Dutch architects out there, I find it a little hard to believe that a firm would do this. Has anyone had success in this department? Anyone tried and failed? Again, this post does not have to be Netherlands specific. Any EU country really (probably exluding UK - but if it will help the discussion go ahead and throw in the UK). It wouldn't be for about 2-3 years and let's assume I have a handle on the language by then.
BOTS
Apr 20, 05 2:07 pm
There is arecognised shortage of UK architects. A look at any of the large architectural recruitment consulatancies will bear this out.
It's worth remebering that as a rule Practices don't like recruiting through agencies long term due transfer clauses and recruitment fees. It is always preferable to contact Practices direct.
There are numerous posts on registration if you search this forum.
what i posted on another thread after someone taked about registration in greece being easy was based on the ARB [uk registration board web site] they will recognized your registration with application but
1] you must be a EEU national [passport holder]
2]it requires that you have practiced in that place a min. of 2 years [germany 4].
so if you are european, work in netherlands 2 years, and get licensed there, you could take an easy route to uk registration.
i made enquiries via e-mail in search of work in holland and UK just after 9/11 and many replied that they wouldn't support a work visa, or only accepted EU citizens.
finally went to london and things became easier once i had a UK address (many more responses to queries), but several firms did in fact have a policy of no support for work visa applications (as visas are attached to employer this means no job). With a bit of a search it proved to be more of a small hurdle than a big one and finally found a few firms willing to go through the process. In UK it meant showing proof of an EU-accessible advertisement and records of interviews with unsuitable candidates for the position. This is indeed a big pain in the ass and costs the firm money, but appears to be straightforward enough. I assume NL is more or less the same deal...
newstreamlinedmodel
Apr 20, 05 11:23 pm
I don’t know about Europe (I’m readingthis thread because I ‘m thinking the same things you are) but the US has the same clause about needing to try to find a National who cha do the job first. It doesn’t really apply to architects, or most professionals. What does some immigration official have to say about whether they could find and architect as “good†as you in the Netherlands? It’s more there to protect skilled labor.
What you should do is find out exactly what your employer has to do to get you a visa and get all the paperwork together yourself so all they have to do is sign. Then it seems like less of a pain in the ass for them. Also look for firms that already have American working there so they have experience with it. I think that the only reason foreigners have trouble here is that offices are sometimes put off by the bureaucratic hassle.
Let us all know what you come up with.
NIAM.
Apr 21, 05 8:52 am
There is hope. I know a lot of Americans living and working here. Main thing is to get a job, preferably while you're still in the US. The other thing you can do is find you a dutch girl or bloke. Amsterdam is 50% single so that should not be too hard.
cvoogt
Apr 21, 05 9:10 am
I'm Dutch/American with an American BS and M.Arch, got registered in Holland last year via BNA, took them a year to evaluate my transcripts, CV, etc. Being registered made it easier for me to find a job ... it puts local employers more at ease about hiring a foreigner. I don't have the visa issues though, being a dual citizen.
RankStranger
Apr 21, 05 12:40 pm
Thanks for the quick responses! This was along the lines of what I was looking for. The single thing would be tough - I'll have to ask my girlfriend. We always joked that all we had to do was find her a man and me a woman and we'd be set!
Newmodel: that's a good point about the paperwork, getting it all just ready to sign and emphasizing that it's ready to go seems like it would help.
NIAM: I assumed it would be easier to wait until I got there to find a job. Unless it was through someone like HOK or MDRDV or the likes I suppose. I would think that companies would be pretty skeptical of the long distance communication. You're in Amsterdam now? Are you Dutch or a foreigner?
cvoogt: I was thinking the exact same thing. If I could get registered while still here, I think that would ease some potential employers a little if not a lot. Did you submit the paperwork while in the Netherlands? As far as I can tell, they don't require you to physically be there. What did you send in? Transcript and CV? I don't know if there's anything else. Possibly IDP record? Do you think it would be okay if it was in english? I could translate it pretty easily but it could turn into a dinner menu. They seemed pretty responsive with my last inquiry - I was quite impressed.
RankStranger
Apr 21, 05 3:56 pm
This site is about the best I could find for architecture jobs: dutcharchitects.com
It's in english, but the companies seem to be targeting dutch citizens. Thought I'd share. Any one else come across this site?
5
Apr 21, 05 5:48 pm
Why don't you apply for some kind of one or two year degree granting programs in the EU (or NL) and move on from there.
newstreamlinedmodel
Apr 22, 05 1:24 am
On the getting married thing, it wouldn’t have to be with someone Dutch, just and EU citizen and I don’t think it would be hard to find someone (or two someone’s) who wanted to get a US green card. I know two German’s who paid guys to the whole process with them. It’s a bit of work with the INS here and I assume the EU people would put you through the wringer as well but if you are a decent actor and can’t find an easier way it works.
Bula
Apr 22, 05 1:46 am
brush up on your metirc and don't forget your bong.
this is a realy good site about dutch architecture I think ireland and the uk experiencing more of a building boom at the moment though and jobs are easier to come by. Saying that the netherlands has more of a "design culture" and oma,unstudio,van velsen,claus en kahn..............and coffee shops!
I am an Amsterdam original :) (without the bong btw). It is a very nice city and lately a lot of "foreign" creative offices are (re) locating to Amsterdam because of the benefits in terms of traffic jams, living expenses and overall quality of live (especially compared to London). This is mainly the case in the advertising sector.
About appying from the US, it all depends on your portfolio I guess. If you can show them some great work than they won't have a problem with helping you out. Also it gives you some inside in the Dutch job application process. You can also fly over here for the final talks.
From what I know the Dutch government has no problems with letting graduated foreigners into the country. I think you can always stay on a temp visa for like 6 to 12 months or something. This won't give you a work permit, but at least you can check out the jobmarket and visit some offices. But I have to warn you there are quite a few of unemployed architects here. But in the end in all comes down to talent.
I like five's idea of doing some degree program here. You can do that for 2 years, you get a work permit and if you have already saved some cash in the US, you'll find Holland to be relative inexpensive.
good luck
f.dantas
Apr 3, 18 11:51 am
Hey there! I know this is from 2005, crossing my fingers you will see this post and will reply! lol Any suggestions on 2 years degree programs in Amsterdam? I've been doing a lot of research and I can only find the 4 years Masters.
That just about says it all. I'm Looking at the Netherlands as my #1 choice but I would love any other European country as well. The Netherlands appear to be fairly simple to get registered. I emailed the BNA enquiring about the process in english and a terribly broken Dutch translation. Didn't hear word one from them when all of a sudden a huge package arrived on my doorstep (in the U.S.) from the BNA advising me of the process. It appears as simple as sending in a College transcript, Curriculum Vitae (resume) and some money but I would have to recheck. The thing that scares me is the Dutch immigration rule that says that employers who employ a non-EU national must apply for that workers work visa and show that it did tried it's best to fill the position with a Dutch national but was unable to. Unless there's a huge shortage of Dutch architects out there, I find it a little hard to believe that a firm would do this. Has anyone had success in this department? Anyone tried and failed? Again, this post does not have to be Netherlands specific. Any EU country really (probably exluding UK - but if it will help the discussion go ahead and throw in the UK). It wouldn't be for about 2-3 years and let's assume I have a handle on the language by then.
There is arecognised shortage of UK architects. A look at any of the large architectural recruitment consulatancies will bear this out.
Hays
SIV
It's worth remebering that as a rule Practices don't like recruiting through agencies long term due transfer clauses and recruitment fees. It is always preferable to contact Practices direct.
There are numerous posts on registration if you search this forum.
what i posted on another thread after someone taked about registration in greece being easy was based on the ARB [uk registration board web site] they will recognized your registration with application but
1] you must be a EEU national [passport holder]
2]it requires that you have practiced in that place a min. of 2 years [germany 4].
so if you are european, work in netherlands 2 years, and get licensed there, you could take an easy route to uk registration.
http://www.arb.org.uk/registration/guidance-on-registering-as-an-architect/eea-admissions-to-the-register.shtml
i made enquiries via e-mail in search of work in holland and UK just after 9/11 and many replied that they wouldn't support a work visa, or only accepted EU citizens.
finally went to london and things became easier once i had a UK address (many more responses to queries), but several firms did in fact have a policy of no support for work visa applications (as visas are attached to employer this means no job). With a bit of a search it proved to be more of a small hurdle than a big one and finally found a few firms willing to go through the process. In UK it meant showing proof of an EU-accessible advertisement and records of interviews with unsuitable candidates for the position. This is indeed a big pain in the ass and costs the firm money, but appears to be straightforward enough. I assume NL is more or less the same deal...
I don’t know about Europe (I’m readingthis thread because I ‘m thinking the same things you are) but the US has the same clause about needing to try to find a National who cha do the job first. It doesn’t really apply to architects, or most professionals. What does some immigration official have to say about whether they could find and architect as “good†as you in the Netherlands? It’s more there to protect skilled labor.
What you should do is find out exactly what your employer has to do to get you a visa and get all the paperwork together yourself so all they have to do is sign. Then it seems like less of a pain in the ass for them. Also look for firms that already have American working there so they have experience with it. I think that the only reason foreigners have trouble here is that offices are sometimes put off by the bureaucratic hassle.
Let us all know what you come up with.
There is hope. I know a lot of Americans living and working here. Main thing is to get a job, preferably while you're still in the US. The other thing you can do is find you a dutch girl or bloke. Amsterdam is 50% single so that should not be too hard.
I'm Dutch/American with an American BS and M.Arch, got registered in Holland last year via BNA, took them a year to evaluate my transcripts, CV, etc. Being registered made it easier for me to find a job ... it puts local employers more at ease about hiring a foreigner. I don't have the visa issues though, being a dual citizen.
Thanks for the quick responses! This was along the lines of what I was looking for. The single thing would be tough - I'll have to ask my girlfriend. We always joked that all we had to do was find her a man and me a woman and we'd be set!
Newmodel: that's a good point about the paperwork, getting it all just ready to sign and emphasizing that it's ready to go seems like it would help.
NIAM: I assumed it would be easier to wait until I got there to find a job. Unless it was through someone like HOK or MDRDV or the likes I suppose. I would think that companies would be pretty skeptical of the long distance communication. You're in Amsterdam now? Are you Dutch or a foreigner?
cvoogt: I was thinking the exact same thing. If I could get registered while still here, I think that would ease some potential employers a little if not a lot. Did you submit the paperwork while in the Netherlands? As far as I can tell, they don't require you to physically be there. What did you send in? Transcript and CV? I don't know if there's anything else. Possibly IDP record? Do you think it would be okay if it was in english? I could translate it pretty easily but it could turn into a dinner menu. They seemed pretty responsive with my last inquiry - I was quite impressed.
This site is about the best I could find for architecture jobs:
dutcharchitects.com
It's in english, but the companies seem to be targeting dutch citizens. Thought I'd share. Any one else come across this site?
Why don't you apply for some kind of one or two year degree granting programs in the EU (or NL) and move on from there.
On the getting married thing, it wouldn’t have to be with someone Dutch, just and EU citizen and I don’t think it would be hard to find someone (or two someone’s) who wanted to get a US green card. I know two German’s who paid guys to the whole process with them. It’s a bit of work with the INS here and I assume the EU people would put you through the wringer as well but if you are a decent actor and can’t find an easier way it works.
brush up on your metirc and don't forget your bong.
this is a realy good site about dutch architecture I think ireland and the uk experiencing more of a building boom at the moment though and jobs are easier to come by. Saying that the netherlands has more of a "design culture" and oma,unstudio,van velsen,claus en kahn..............and coffee shops!
http://www.archiseek.com/content/showthread.php?t=3925
I am an Amsterdam original :) (without the bong btw). It is a very nice city and lately a lot of "foreign" creative offices are (re) locating to Amsterdam because of the benefits in terms of traffic jams, living expenses and overall quality of live (especially compared to London). This is mainly the case in the advertising sector.
About appying from the US, it all depends on your portfolio I guess. If you can show them some great work than they won't have a problem with helping you out. Also it gives you some inside in the Dutch job application process. You can also fly over here for the final talks.
From what I know the Dutch government has no problems with letting graduated foreigners into the country. I think you can always stay on a temp visa for like 6 to 12 months or something. This won't give you a work permit, but at least you can check out the jobmarket and visit some offices. But I have to warn you there are quite a few of unemployed architects here. But in the end in all comes down to talent.
I like five's idea of doing some degree program here. You can do that for 2 years, you get a work permit and if you have already saved some cash in the US, you'll find Holland to be relative inexpensive.
good luck
Hey there! I know this is from 2005, crossing my fingers you will see this post and will reply! lol Any suggestions on 2 years degree programs in Amsterdam? I've been doing a lot of research and I can only find the 4 years Masters.