Hey guys, I just received offers from both the AA and Cornell AAP for undergrad architecture and am struggling to make a decision between the two.
I understand Cornell is an ivy and has name recognition but it is a 5 year course for a BArch in the middle of nowhere. Compared to the AA being 3 years for a BA in central London (followed by 2 years elsewhere for RIBA part 2).
If anyone can give some insight on their times at either Cornell or the AA it would be much appreciated!
Non Sequitur
Mar 29, 24 5:45 pm
it does not matter, take the cheapest option.
graphemic
Mar 29, 24 7:35 pm
I don't understand RIBA rules, but if the equivalent is a BA in the US then I'd strongly recommend against it.
The Bachelors of Architecture allows you to proceed towards licensure. A Bachelors of Arts in Architecture requires more education. The key difference IMO is that going through two separate architecture degree programs is costly and exhausting. It's not necessary to spend so much time in studio unless you're doing something very specific.
Personally, I got a BA in something else entirely then got an MArch, a path that worked great for me. The BA students in my (MArch) cohort were jaded and tired. The BArch colleagues I've worked with have more experience than anyone and had a thorough education.
Unfortunately, you're kind of comparing apples to oranges. They're two different degrees in two different continents with two different futures. Both are going to be great, so don't sweat it.
luvu
Mar 30, 24 9:27 am
Uk system aren’t necessarily a two separate degrees . It’s a 5-yrs formal training that is broken into two parts . Traditionally , Part I students would take ‘year -out ‘ to gain some practical experience before commencing part 2( i took 2 yrs off myself). For those who choose not to pursue further study , the exit point after 3 years is very handy. So both Cornell and AA route would still require 5 years of training for registration. One thing that should be kept in mind though is that the UK system is very focused and specialised in the area of study which might not be the case in the US system where liberal Arts / Stem subjects are part of the Architecture curriculum.
msparchitect
Mar 29, 24 7:36 pm
where do you want to live ultimately? I know people with American degrees in England and English degrees in America, but it sure is easier to have the degree from the nation you intend to be an actual architect in... if you want to be a licensed architect. England and America are in the process of making this even easier. But still.
Both great programs. Those are different degree programs though. So also depends on what you want to do afterwards (which is hard to predict now of course).
catastrophenow
Mar 29, 24 10:03 pm
Ultimately I think I would work internationally in London and Hong Kong but settle in New Zealand after some work experience in larger cities. London is a better fit culturally (considering my academic background at a British school). But I’ve been told that the alumni network at Cornell is very strong and when it comes to finding jobs in the field, a lot of doors are opened.
watermelonsunday
Mar 29, 24 11:17 pm
considering that you want to work in london after graduation, AA would seem a better fit. the majority of employers will know of or have even taught at the AA, so the network is there.
i currently work with quite a few ivy league and AA/UCL grads in HK so you’d have no problem finding a job here!
justavisual
Mar 30, 24 6:29 am
cornell helps if you want to work in NYC, not much elsewhere.
catastrophenow
Mar 30, 24 12:02 am
Another of my concerns is that the AA isn’t considered a “university” but rather a specialised school - would it be more beneficial to get a BArch degree from Cornell first before moving overseas? Or is the AA BA degree recognised? It’s just the name reach of Cornell is significantly stronger compared to the AA internationally.
justavisual
Mar 30, 24 6:31 am
You can always do the 5 year Barch at Cornell and then a master at AA. I know a lot of people who did that. Also know that there are semesters in NYC and Rome so you're not in Ithaca all the time anyway. But if you dont want to work in the USA then a degree there isnt so handy.
catastrophenow
Mar 30, 24 6:56 am
Regarding the degree awarded at the AA after 3 years, from word of mouth apparently the degree will be awarded from an “open university” - can someone fact check this? (I’ve tried looking into it but to no avail) - here’s the link that says that the AA can hand out degrees: https://www.dezeen.com/2019/10/08/architectural-association-aa-award/amp/
If someone could clarify this because I’m not too sure how an “open university” would appear on a CV when applying to other universities for a MArch programme.
watermelonsunday
Mar 30, 24 8:23 am
i don’t know about the awarded degree part, but AA is accredited by ARB and RIBA, meaning if you further pursue the part 2 and 3, you can become
an architect in the UK. it would not be a problem when applying to other universities or pursuing an MArch.
luvu
Mar 30, 24 9:45 am
@Cat, The AA has the power to award their own degree as per the article as evidence in the introduction of BA which is awarded after the completion of Intermediate school. This was not the case pre -2019 ish
catastrophenow
Mar 30, 24 5:27 pm
Is the AA approach design centric? And if so, do they also cover structural concepts? - Cornell has quite a sizeable chunk of structural work (which I am concerned about).
PS. Thanks to everyone for replying! Everything has been super insightful!
reallynotmyname
Mar 30, 24 6:48 pm
6 hours (2 semesters) of structures and 6 more for materials & methods is pretty standard in any USA 5-year curriculum. How rigorous the classes are varies greatly from program to program. I can't comment on Cornell in that regard.
watermelonsunday
Mar 31, 24 2:04 am
You should check out their student work on instagram to get a gauge of what each school’s focus is. I would say AA is more experimental and conceptual.
catastrophenow
Mar 31, 24 1:56 am
Would I be missing out on much if I attended uni in London instead? As an EU national I want to go to London for the ease of travel in and around the EU. But I’ve been told that I should go to Cornell just because it’s an ivy. Is the ivy experience and diploma something I should place heavy weight on?
Janosh
Mar 31, 24 4:35 pm
No. The "Ivy" reputation doesn't mean an enormous amount of its own except with respect to places (primarily the NE US) in which Cornell has a strong alumni network. Both are strong and rigorous programs that will reward someone who is aligned with their respective philosophies and puts in the work (this is true of lots of schools). But at the end of the day nothing is more important than going to a school that you are personally aligned with (they are very different) and how much debt you graduate with. The latter will probably have more impact on your post-graduation life and options than any other decision you will make in the course of your career.
justavisual
Mar 31, 24 3:38 am
Its two totally different experiences. Ithaca is a small town but surrounded by really nice nature, the campus is huge and the ability to meet people in other majors is there. They have their own cinema, concerts, have sports, etc etc.... AA is small, but its in a global city where you can meet endless amounts of people not affiliated with the AA. Both are hardcore programs, which take up most of your free time. Both are long and a lot of people drop out. The Ivy undergrad has gotten me nothing extra in Europe. It does have more standing in the USA obviously (esp east coast). You can also consider doing the BArch in USA and a (cheap!) MSc in Europe - thats what I did. Worked out well for me.
catastrophenow
Mar 31, 24 6:22 am
Just out of curiosity, where did you sit your undergrad as well as your MSc? - I was considering Delft but thought it might be easier to apply to from the London rather than the US.
justavisual
Mar 31, 24 10:50 am
Cornell and then Delft
justavisual
Mar 31, 24 10:48 am
.
catastrophenow
Mar 31, 24 7:04 pm
Just as a more 'admin' thing - how feasible is it to transfer schools during the degree? - i.e. start at Cornell, and if it isn't the right environment for me then transfer to London?
Can credits be transferred or will I have to resit the degree from the beginning?
justavisual
Apr 1, 24 1:16 pm
I tried it, Cornell to AA. They didnt want to play along w the credits.
Immigrant Developer
Apr 1, 24 4:45 pm
DOES LOCATION EVEN MATTER YOULL BE IN STUDIO ANYWAY.
GO FOR CORNELL FOR MORE POSSIBILITIES IN AMERICA AND BEYOND.
Hey guys, I just received offers from both the AA and Cornell AAP for undergrad architecture and am struggling to make a decision between the two.
I understand Cornell is an ivy and has name recognition but it is a 5 year course for a BArch in the middle of nowhere. Compared to the AA being 3 years for a BA in central London (followed by 2 years elsewhere for RIBA part 2).
If anyone can give some insight on their times at either Cornell or the AA it would be much appreciated!
it does not matter, take the cheapest option.
I don't understand RIBA rules, but if the equivalent is a BA in the US then I'd strongly recommend against it.
The Bachelors of Architecture allows you to proceed towards licensure. A Bachelors of Arts in Architecture requires more education. The key difference IMO is that going through two separate architecture degree programs is costly and exhausting. It's not necessary to spend so much time in studio unless you're doing something very specific.
Personally, I got a BA in something else entirely then got an MArch, a path that worked great for me. The BA students in my (MArch) cohort were jaded and tired. The BArch colleagues I've worked with have more experience than anyone and had a thorough education.
Unfortunately, you're kind of comparing apples to oranges. They're two different degrees in two different continents with two different futures. Both are going to be great, so don't sweat it.
Uk system aren’t necessarily a two separate degrees . It’s a 5-yrs formal training that is broken into two parts . Traditionally , Part I students would take ‘year -out ‘ to gain some practical experience before commencing part 2( i took 2 yrs off myself). For those who choose not to pursue further study , the exit point after 3 years is very handy. So both Cornell and AA route would still require 5 years of training for registration. One thing that should be kept in mind though is that the UK system is very focused and specialised in the area of study which might not be the case in the US system where liberal Arts / Stem subjects are part of the Architecture curriculum.
where do you want to live ultimately? I know people with American degrees in England and English degrees in America, but it sure is easier to have the degree from the nation you intend to be an actual architect in... if you want to be a licensed architect. England and America are in the process of making this even easier. But still.
Both great programs. Those are different degree programs though. So also depends on what you want to do afterwards (which is hard to predict now of course).
Ultimately I think I would work internationally in London and Hong Kong but settle in New Zealand after some work experience in larger cities. London is a better fit culturally (considering my academic background at a British school). But I’ve been told that the alumni network at Cornell is very strong and when it comes to finding jobs in the field, a lot of doors are opened.
considering that you want to work in london after graduation, AA would seem a better fit. the majority of employers will know of or have even taught at the AA, so the network is there.
i currently work with quite a few ivy league and AA/UCL grads in HK so you’d have no problem finding a job here!
cornell helps if you want to work in NYC, not much elsewhere.
Another of my concerns is that the AA isn’t considered a “university” but rather a specialised school - would it be more beneficial to get a BArch degree from Cornell first before moving overseas? Or is the AA BA degree recognised? It’s just the name reach of Cornell is significantly stronger compared to the AA internationally.
You can always do the 5 year Barch at Cornell and then a master at AA. I know a lot of people who did that. Also know that there are semesters in NYC and Rome so you're not in Ithaca all the time anyway. But if you dont want to work in the USA then a degree there isnt so handy.
Regarding the degree awarded at the AA after 3 years, from word of mouth apparently the degree will be awarded from an “open university” - can someone fact check this? (I’ve tried looking into it but to no avail) - here’s the link that says that the AA can hand out degrees: https://www.dezeen.com/2019/10/08/architectural-association-aa-award/amp/
If someone could clarify this because I’m not too sure how an “open university” would appear on a CV when applying to other universities for a MArch programme.
i don’t know about the awarded degree part, but AA is accredited by ARB and RIBA, meaning if you further pursue the part 2 and 3, you can become
an architect in the UK. it would not be a problem when applying to other universities or pursuing an MArch.
@Cat, The AA has the power to award their own degree as per the article as evidence in the introduction of BA which is awarded after the completion of Intermediate school. This was not the case pre -2019 ish
Is the AA approach design centric? And if so, do they also cover structural concepts? - Cornell has quite a sizeable chunk of structural work (which I am concerned about).
PS. Thanks to everyone for replying! Everything has been super insightful!
6 hours (2 semesters) of structures and 6 more for materials & methods is pretty standard in any USA 5-year curriculum. How rigorous the classes are varies greatly from program to program. I can't comment on Cornell in that regard.
You should check out their student work on instagram to get a gauge of what each school’s focus is. I would say AA is more experimental and conceptual.
Would I be missing out on much if I attended uni in London instead? As an EU national I want to go to London for the ease of travel in and around the EU. But I’ve been told that I should go to Cornell just because it’s an ivy. Is the ivy experience and diploma something I should place heavy weight on?
No. The "Ivy" reputation doesn't mean an enormous amount of its own except with respect to places (primarily the NE US) in which Cornell has a strong alumni network. Both are strong and rigorous programs that will reward someone who is aligned with their respective philosophies and puts in the work (this is true of lots of schools). But at the end of the day nothing is more important than going to a school that you are personally aligned with (they are very different) and how much debt you graduate with. The latter will probably have more impact on your post-graduation life and options than any other decision you will make in the course of your career.
Its two totally different experiences. Ithaca is a small town but surrounded by really nice nature, the campus is huge and the ability to meet people in other majors is there. They have their own cinema, concerts, have sports, etc etc.... AA is small, but its in a global city where you can meet endless amounts of people not affiliated with the AA. Both are hardcore programs, which take up most of your free time. Both are long and a lot of people drop out. The Ivy undergrad has gotten me nothing extra in Europe. It does have more standing in the USA obviously (esp east coast). You can also consider doing the BArch in USA and a (cheap!) MSc in Europe - thats what I did. Worked out well for me.
Just out of curiosity, where did you sit your undergrad as well as your MSc? - I was considering Delft but thought it might be easier to apply to from the London rather than the US.
Cornell and then Delft
.
Just as a more 'admin' thing - how feasible is it to transfer schools during the degree? - i.e. start at Cornell, and if it isn't the right environment for me then transfer to London?
Can credits be transferred or will I have to resit the degree from the beginning?
I tried it, Cornell to AA. They didnt want to play along w the credits.
DOES LOCATION EVEN MATTER YOULL BE IN STUDIO ANYWAY.
GO FOR CORNELL FOR MORE POSSIBILITIES IN AMERICA AND BEYOND.