Looking for some advice or perspective on working with clients and keeping stress and anxiety under control. Have been dealing with a few difficult clients that make mountains out of molehills and have tempers. It's having a debilitating impact on my attitude and happiness throughout the day. I'm probably too sensitive.
I also have some other genuinely kind and understanding clients but just one rotten apple or negative interaction can spoil the day for me. How do you manage and shrug off instances where a client is being an a-hole to you or demonstrating a lack of regard for your efforts?
Also, at what point do you just cut ties for reasons like this? The projects are moving forward... I'm keeping things on track and manging them well in my opinion but the vibe isn't great and I just don't like the clients on a personal level. I have a termination for convenience clause in my contract but I'm afraid to exercise it for various reasons; and of course it would majorly incense the client(s) and not reflect great on my reputation. Do you usually just push through projects like this and sharpen your radar on the next opportunity and get better at screening? Is there a breaking point for you? I'm working in the residential and small commercial space as a sole prop.
proto
Oct 3, 23 2:30 pm
exactly how toxic is it?
is it work you intend to keep going after?
is this project valuable to you beyond the fee?
kjpn
Oct 4, 23 2:19 pm
It's probably not that toxic to a seasoned business owner who has had lots of similar experiences, but as a newer guy, when you put yourself out there and try to help people and just get attitude in response it's demoralizing. Yes, it's in the wheelhouse of work I want and could be in the portfolio, but it's not a 'dream' project. One of the clients does want to do a second, larger project but I'm writing that potential collaboration off based on the current experience.
proto
Oct 5, 23 9:14 am
That sounds healthy to just not work with this client again. Honor your current commitments and then just quietly ignore them beyond the contracted work. There are better people out there in the world
to work with.
Immigrant Developer
Oct 3, 23 4:05 pm
All projects will come to an end. Just push forward, finish and who knows you might more work from them with a better attitude. The next day will be better.
b3tadine[sutures]
Oct 3, 23 7:26 pm
Look, you are the one responsible for setting the terms of this relationship and no one else. Draw the line now, have the hard conversation now, if they don't agree to the terms amend the contract, or drop them. Your sanity and wellness is not worth this bullshit.
kjpn
Oct 4, 23 2:04 pm
How do you go about getting contract amendments during a project?
bowling_ball
Oct 4, 23 8:06 pm
@b3 That's really easy to say if you don't depend on the work to pay your bills. For most of us though, it's a negotiation
bowling_ball
Oct 4, 23 8:07 pm
Sorry, didn't mean to imply that you don't work for money like we all do, I'm just pointing out that not being able to pay bills brings its own stresses
bennyc
Oct 3, 23 7:39 pm
I learned long ago that if there is any stress on the project, I make sure the clients are the one carrying it, not me. To be able to do that, you need to maintain your professionalism, document all work, billing, etc, and have a solid contract.
kjpn
Oct 4, 23 2:05 pm
I love what you're saying here
reallynotmyname
Oct 3, 23 9:59 pm
When clients are rude, condescending, or otherwise unprofessional to you, try to first talk it out with the person and then terminate them if things don't improve.
I used to think we could eventually win over difficult types by working really hard and delivering a good product, but sometimes people are just assholes and walking away is the best solution. The probability is high such people would never have provided a good reference or become a repeat client anyway.
As a sole proprietor in residential small commercial, The OP is in a sector of the market where a lot of the clients either don't know how, or just choose not to, behave in a professional manner with their architect.
kjpn
Oct 4, 23 2:17 pm
Thanks that makes sense... yea I've not really noticed any increase in respect or appreciation when I've made greater efforts for this type of client either. Have you ever been taken to court after terminating a client? Not for any kind of professional negligence but because they claim they didn't 'get' what they were 'owed'? I bill on an hourly/time basis so I always get paid during the process rather than after achieving any specific milestone, like a permit approval. And because clients have to 'start over' in some shape or form with another architect there is a lot of sunk time and cost usually associated with them switching. One of my difficult clients is a lawyer so I am extra hesitant about that.
proto
Oct 5, 23 9:09 am
If it’s any consolation, lawyers don’t usually know how architecture/construction works…but I feel you on the nerves with them sometimes
kjpn
Oct 4, 23 2:16 pm
Mistype
small
Oct 5, 23 1:21 am
Life is too short to work for terrible clients--a bad project can be months or years spent where your time and sanity could have been devoted to other more meaningful projects. Staying on for the sake of staying on is not worth it in my opinion. Your reputation is better served working for clients you enjoy. Look to your contract and see if there is an out and justification for you to terminate (i.e. failure to pay, etc.). Stress and anxiety should not be normal.
I recently walked away from a client because of failure to pay and their thorough misunderstanding of the terms of the contract. It was causing a lot of stress and anxiety and severing ties was the best thing I've done and I haven't looked back since.
Looking for some advice or perspective on working with clients and keeping stress and anxiety under control. Have been dealing with a few difficult clients that make mountains out of molehills and have tempers. It's having a debilitating impact on my attitude and happiness throughout the day. I'm probably too sensitive.
I also have some other genuinely kind and understanding clients but just one rotten apple or negative interaction can spoil the day for me. How do you manage and shrug off instances where a client is being an a-hole to you or demonstrating a lack of regard for your efforts?
Also, at what point do you just cut ties for reasons like this? The projects are moving forward... I'm keeping things on track and manging them well in my opinion but the vibe isn't great and I just don't like the clients on a personal level. I have a termination for convenience clause in my contract but I'm afraid to exercise it for various reasons; and of course it would majorly incense the client(s) and not reflect great on my reputation. Do you usually just push through projects like this and sharpen your radar on the next opportunity and get better at screening? Is there a breaking point for you? I'm working in the residential and small commercial space as a sole prop.
exactly how toxic is it?
is it work you intend to keep going after?
is this project valuable to you beyond the fee?
It's probably not that toxic to a seasoned business owner who has had lots of similar experiences, but as a newer guy, when you put yourself out there and try to help people and just get attitude in response it's demoralizing. Yes, it's in the wheelhouse of work I want and could be in the portfolio, but it's not a 'dream' project. One of the clients does want to do a second, larger project but I'm writing that potential collaboration off based on the current experience.
That sounds healthy to just not work with this client again. Honor your current commitments and then just quietly ignore them beyond the contracted work. There are better people out there in the world
to work with.
All projects will come to an end. Just push forward, finish and who knows you might more work from them with a better attitude. The next day will be better.
Look, you are the one responsible for setting the terms of this relationship and no one else. Draw the line now, have the hard conversation now, if they don't agree to the terms amend the contract, or drop them. Your sanity and wellness is not worth this bullshit.
How do you go about getting contract amendments during a project?
@b3 That's really easy to say if you don't depend on the work to pay your bills. For most of us though, it's a negotiation
Sorry, didn't mean to imply that you don't work for money like we all do, I'm just pointing out that not being able to pay bills brings its own stresses
I learned long ago that if there is any stress on the project, I make sure the clients are the one carrying it, not me. To be able to do that, you need to maintain your professionalism, document all work, billing, etc, and have a solid contract.
I love what you're saying here
When clients are rude, condescending, or otherwise unprofessional to you, try to first talk it out with the person and then terminate them if things don't improve.
I used to think we could eventually win over difficult types by working really hard and delivering a good product, but sometimes people are just assholes and walking away is the best solution. The probability is high such people would never have provided a good reference or become a repeat client anyway.
As a sole proprietor in residential small commercial, The OP is in a sector of the market where a lot of the clients either don't know how, or just choose not to, behave in a professional manner with their architect.
Thanks that makes sense... yea I've not really noticed any increase in respect or appreciation when I've made greater efforts for this type of client either. Have you ever been taken to court after terminating a client? Not for any kind of professional negligence but because they claim they didn't 'get' what they were 'owed'? I bill on an hourly/time basis so I always get paid during the process rather than after achieving any specific milestone, like a permit approval. And because clients have to 'start over' in some shape or form with another architect there is a lot of sunk time and cost usually associated with them switching. One of my difficult clients is a lawyer so I am extra hesitant about that.
If it’s any consolation, lawyers don’t usually know how architecture/construction works…but I feel you on the nerves with them sometimes
Mistype
Life is too short to work for terrible clients--a bad project can be months or years spent where your time and sanity could have been devoted to other more meaningful projects. Staying on for the sake of staying on is not worth it in my opinion. Your reputation is better served working for clients you enjoy. Look to your contract and see if there is an out and justification for you to terminate (i.e. failure to pay, etc.). Stress and anxiety should not be normal.
I recently walked away from a client because of failure to pay and their thorough misunderstanding of the terms of the contract. It was causing a lot of stress and anxiety and severing ties was the best thing I've done and I haven't looked back since.