how do I get better at this? I feel obligated to take on everything, even if it’s not the kind of work I’m trying to focus on, or if it seems like it’s going to be a pain in the ass project.
SneakyPete
Jun 23, 21 11:42 am
Tell them you're too busy to provide them the quality of service you feel is necessary to do a good job.
Chad Miller
Jun 23, 21 1:06 pm
Show them your post history here. That will reduce the amount of work that will come your way. Problem solved.
x-jla
Jun 23, 21 1:13 pm
Dick. lol
Chad Miller
Jun 23, 21 1:56 pm
.
Miles Jaffe
Jun 23, 21 1:11 pm
Raise your prices.
RJ87
Jun 23, 21 1:54 pm
I'd agree with Miles. If it's not something you're particularly interested in just price it accordingly, then if they still want to continue it's suddenly worth your time. That said our office has certain things that we just have no interest in dealing with a particular set of client & just tell them that it's not what we do.
Chad Miller
Jun 23, 21 1:58 pm
We do the same. Often we're asked to do single family residential work and we simply explain that we don't do that type of work. We recommend several other architects in town that could help them out.
RJ87
Jun 23, 21 2:05 pm
I get asked about doing homes on a regular basis & have a ready made list of recommended firms on file that I just copy paste into the same email. I know some people make a good living off of them, but it sounds like a nightmare dealing with residential clients & problems. Particularly at a lower price point.
RJ87
Jun 23, 21 2:05 pm
That said, a higher price point client sounds awful as well.
Wood Guy
Jun 24, 21 2:08 pm
I felt the same last fall--good jobs just kept coming in, and I didn't have a good system for scheduling them. After working nearly non-stop for months I have learned my lessons:
1. I will pay attention to red flags and avoid clients who will likely be difficult, no matter how much money they have or how cool their project is. Life is too short to deal with jerks. 2. I know how many productive hours I have available in a week and before taking on a job I will estimate when I can get to it. I am telling potential clients that I am booking for late 2022. That sends most people away, and the ones who stay are more likely to be committed to me. 3. I will raise my rates again, and/or switch to fixed fees on projects that I think I can make money on.
randomised
Jun 24, 21 3:22 pm
I’m a little disappointed here, you as the most avid and active supporter of capitalism on this forum should have figured this one out x-jla ;-)
Just hire someone to churn out these kinds of jobs for you but still collect the clients’ cheque...
Chad Miller
Jun 24, 21 3:59 pm
That would mean x-jla would have to actually pay someone a living wage. We all know he's only a minimum wage guy.
randomised
Jun 24, 21 4:05 pm
I think he’d pay handsomely, even if only to prove you wrong!
Chad Miller
Jun 24, 21 4:10 pm
Shhhhh . . . don't tell him that.
x-jla
Jun 24, 21 4:13 pm
Random, I have a hard time saying no to people. It’s a curse. For example, I hired a nanny, and ended up becoming her free cab service, mover, and pick family up from airport guy. In this case it’s not about the money, because I have a full plate at a certain point, it’s about being able to turn down the projects that I’m not excited about to make room for ones I am. Until now I’ve been a first come first serve type of guy, but demand is high rn, and I’m starting to think I can be more choosy
x-jla
Jun 24, 21 4:15 pm
Part of it is not wanting to come off as a snob and part is the scarcity mentality from being broke most of my life lol
Chad Miller
Jun 24, 21 4:23 pm
Shhhh . . . .
rcz1001
Jun 24, 21 5:12 pm
It comes down to how you say no and the tone of your voice and body language. You could say, at this time we are currently swamped with projects and it may be a while before we are ready. You aren't necessarily saying outright the word 'no' but it is inferred that at this moment in time, you can't do the project. It's not about being mean or anything. Additionally, if it is an inquiry on Houzz or something, you could simply not even reply. However, you can choose the manner accordingly. It's a little bit of an art form.
randomised
Jun 25, 21 3:17 am
x-jla, you don’t understand capitalism? Let your new employee do the projects you don’t want to do and use that freed time to do the nice projects yourself, nobrainer really...
rcz1001
Jun 25, 21 3:22 am
If you are referring to the nanny, are you serious with that suggestion randomised?
rcz1001
Jun 25, 21 3:25 am
The suggestion I made is actually something that does work. If you don't want the project, then either you kindly decline it or you don't respond to initial inquiry. Either way will communicate that you are not interested. I would likely approach it with a polite declining of the project like how I suggested... a little "wordsmithing" may be needed.
randomised
Jun 25, 21 12:49 pm
Sigh...I suggested an employee to do the projects that bring in money but are not interesting enough to waste your own time on...a nanny could work too if she can do landscape architecture as well and look after the kids...
rcz1001
Jun 25, 21 1:30 pm
It did appear that you were suggesting the nanny that was mentioned by x-jla a little earlier. I agree with you that he could hire an employee to work on the projects that bring in money but not interesting enough for x-jla to do. If I recall, x-jla is a landscape designer or is he a landscape architect. Not sure offhand. While I am primarily a building designer, I could do landscape design as well but it isn't my primary business activity. However, I'm not local enough to x-jla (IIRC) for doing landscape design work for him in his local area. It isn't something you should do purely from remote. Visiting the project site and getting a sense of the place and so forth are important factors to consider among others.
tduds
Jun 25, 21 3:25 pm
lol @ Rick taking "I don't know how to say no" extremely literally.
randomised
Jun 26, 21 2:32 am
It’s all good Rick, sometimes I forget it’s you...
rcz1001
Jun 26, 21 3:58 am
Anyway, thank you for clarifying what you meant.
midlander
Jun 25, 21 4:13 pm
do you actually have a problem? this just seems like a humblebrag.
i've been so busy i have to turn away work for 5 years now. but i work in a large office and the people asking me to do more work are colleagues, so that's a different problem.
x-jla
Jun 25, 21 4:46 pm
I’m talking specifically about repeat client/s (developers) who sometimes send good shit, and other times shit show projects. Or in one case a shit show referral from a past good client.
x-jla
Jun 25, 21 4:46 pm
I’m not talking about houzz inquiries or random leads.
x-jla
Jun 25, 21 4:49 pm
Most of my work comes from referrals, repeat clients, and architects who I know personally. Random leads that I don’t want I’ll usually just refer out to friends.
midlander
Jun 25, 21 4:56 pm
i see that makes more sense then. i think you just have to be honest and tell them you'd like to take the work but you're fully booked for the foreseeable future. the reasonable clients will understand and decide to wait or find someone else.
x-jla
Jun 25, 21 5:19 pm
But I’m 100% serious that this is my number one anxiety rn. I’m getting a lot of these and don’t want to create bad blood with old clients or repeat clients. I feel like they expect me to take the crappy ones once in a while if I want to get the good ones…maybe I’m being too paranoid
Wood Guy
Jun 25, 21 5:34 pm
Is there a reason you would not hire to expand your capacity to take on these additional projects?
x-jla
Jun 25, 21 5:47 pm
No reason, and it’s definitely a long term solution I’m going to do eventually, but these are kind of immediate things and I would need time to hire, set up the work space, etc. I’m also design/build, so it’s not just design staff, but I’d need to expand my build capacity too. I’m pretty conservative with the speed I grow, and I’m more craft motivated than money motivated…and don’t want to create an overhead that’s so big that I feel compelled to sacrifice quality for quantity to pay the bills.
rcz1001
Jun 25, 21 7:46 pm
These trends do have to be steady so when you you get the staffing to meet the workload, the trend doesn't reverse the other way and you run out of clients.
how do I get better at this? I feel obligated to take on everything, even if it’s not the kind of work I’m trying to focus on, or if it seems like it’s going to be a pain in the ass project.
Tell them you're too busy to provide them the quality of service you feel is necessary to do a good job.
Show them your post history here. That will reduce the amount of work that will come your way. Problem solved.
Dick. lol
.
Raise your prices.
I'd agree with Miles. If it's not something you're particularly interested in just price it accordingly, then if they still want to continue it's suddenly worth your time. That said our office has certain things that we just have no interest in dealing with a particular set of client & just tell them that it's not what we do.
We do the same. Often we're asked to do single family residential work and we simply explain that we don't do that type of work. We recommend several other architects in town that could help them out.
I get asked about doing homes on a regular basis & have a ready made list of recommended firms on file that I just copy paste into the same email. I know some people make a good living off of them, but it sounds like a nightmare dealing with residential clients & problems. Particularly at a lower price point.
That said, a higher price point client sounds awful as well.
I felt the same last fall--good jobs just kept coming in, and I didn't have a good system for scheduling them. After working nearly non-stop for months I have learned my lessons:
1. I will pay attention to red flags and avoid clients who will likely be difficult, no matter how much money they have or how cool their project is. Life is too short to deal with jerks.
2. I know how many productive hours I have available in a week and before taking on a job I will estimate when I can get to it. I am telling potential clients that I am booking for late 2022. That sends most people away, and the ones who stay are more likely to be committed to me.
3. I will raise my rates again, and/or switch to fixed fees on projects that I think I can make money on.
I’m a little disappointed here, you as the most avid and active supporter of capitalism on this forum should have figured this one out x-jla ;-)
Just hire someone to churn out these kinds of jobs for you but still collect the clients’ cheque...
That would mean x-jla would have to actually pay someone a living wage. We all know he's only a minimum wage guy.
I think he’d pay handsomely, even if only to prove you wrong!
Shhhhh . . . don't tell him that.
Random, I have a hard time saying no to people. It’s a curse. For example, I hired a nanny, and ended up becoming her free cab service, mover, and pick family up from airport guy. In this case it’s not about the money, because I have a full plate at a certain point, it’s about being able to turn down the projects that I’m not excited about to make room for ones I am. Until now I’ve been a first come first serve type of guy, but demand is high rn, and I’m starting to think I can be more choosy
Part of it is not wanting to come off as a snob and part is the scarcity mentality from being broke most of my life lol
Shhhh . . . .
It comes down to how you say no and the tone of your voice and body language. You could say, at this time we are currently swamped with projects and it may be a while before we are ready. You aren't necessarily saying outright the word 'no' but it is inferred that at this moment in time, you can't do the project. It's not about being mean or anything. Additionally, if it is an inquiry on Houzz or something, you could simply not even reply. However, you can choose the manner accordingly. It's a little bit of an art form.
x-jla, you don’t understand capitalism? Let your new employee do the projects you don’t want to do and use that freed time to do the nice projects yourself, nobrainer really...
If you are referring to the nanny, are you serious with that suggestion randomised?
The suggestion I made is actually something that does work. If you don't want the project, then either you kindly decline it or you don't respond to initial inquiry. Either way will communicate that you are not interested. I would likely approach it with a polite declining of the project like how I suggested... a little "wordsmithing" may be needed.
Sigh...I suggested an employee to do the projects that bring in money but are not interesting enough to waste your own time on...a nanny could work too if she can do landscape architecture as well and look after the kids...
It did appear that you were suggesting the nanny that was mentioned by x-jla a little earlier. I agree with you that he could hire an employee to work on the projects that bring in money but not interesting enough for x-jla to do. If I recall, x-jla is a landscape designer or is he a landscape architect. Not sure offhand. While I am primarily a building designer, I could do landscape design as well but it isn't my primary business activity. However, I'm not local enough to x-jla (IIRC) for doing landscape design work for him in his local area. It isn't something you should do purely from remote. Visiting the project site and getting a sense of the place and so forth are important factors to consider among others.
lol @ Rick taking "I don't know how to say no" extremely literally.
It’s all good Rick, sometimes I forget it’s you...
Anyway, thank you for clarifying what you meant.
do you actually have a problem? this just seems like a humblebrag.
i've been so busy i have to turn away work for 5 years now. but i work in a large office and the people asking me to do more work are colleagues, so that's a different problem.
I’m talking specifically about repeat client/s (developers) who sometimes send good shit, and other times shit show projects. Or in one case a shit show referral from a past good client.
I’m not talking about houzz inquiries or random leads.
Most of my work comes from referrals, repeat clients, and architects who I know personally. Random leads that I don’t want I’ll usually just refer out to friends.
i see that makes more sense then. i think you just have to be honest and tell them you'd like to take the work but you're fully booked for the foreseeable future. the reasonable clients will understand and decide to wait or find someone else.
But I’m 100% serious that this is my number one anxiety rn. I’m getting a lot of these and don’t want to create bad blood with old clients or repeat clients. I feel like they expect me to take the crappy ones once in a while if I want to get the good ones…maybe I’m being too paranoid
Is there a reason you would not hire to expand your capacity to take on these additional projects?
No reason, and it’s definitely a long term solution I’m going to do eventually, but these are kind of immediate things and I would need time to hire, set up the work space, etc. I’m also design/build, so it’s not just design staff, but I’d need to expand my build capacity too. I’m pretty conservative with the speed I grow, and I’m more craft motivated than money motivated…and don’t want to create an overhead that’s so big that I feel compelled to sacrifice quality for quantity to pay the bills.
These trends do have to be steady so when you you get the staffing to meet the workload, the trend doesn't reverse the other way and you run out of clients.