So im going to be interviewing with a developer because i want to be the point person to provide all design direction/planning. I know he'll probably ask what are some of my ideas, but im not sure how to approach it without giving away too much free information for him to run with it without hiring me.
citizen
Nov 5, 17 11:42 pm
What kind of information are you afraid of letting slip out that he could run with and cut you out of the picture?
won and done williams
Nov 6, 17 10:44 am
You're trying to sell yourself and your ideas. Hold nothing back.
And then convince him that you are the one to execute it.
Ideas are a dime a dozen. The ability to deliver is rare.
s=r*(theta)
Nov 6, 17 11:08 am
Do exactly what they do, dangle the carrot!
chigurh
Nov 6, 17 11:19 am
oh jesus...get the hell over your ego sir, like an hour discussion with a developer is going to give them the key to great design. Won and done is totally right.
Wilma Buttfit
Nov 6, 17 9:37 pm
Send him a bill afterwards.
Miles Jaffe
Nov 6, 17 10:27 pm
+++
Wilma Buttfit
Nov 7, 17 8:45 am
$25,000 should be enough to cover all ideas.
jcarch
Nov 7, 17 10:30 am
In the spirit of won and done william's advice:
A few years ago, a developer approached me. He had an architect, but was unhappy with him. He showed me plans, saying "I don't want to change anything, I just want to switch architects." The building was a piece of sh*t. Ugly, poorly laid out, and violating zoning/code in a couple of places too.
I grabbed a roll of trace, and in 5 minutes showed him how he could move 300 s.f. from common spaces (which he can't sell) into the apartments. At $1,000 a foot (although with that design, I can't imagine him getting that price), I made him $300,000. I also told him that the design was worthless, and that I would be happy to work with him, but only if we started from scratch.
He could have walked out of my office, straight to his architect, and told them to make the changes I had sketched out. Instead he went straight to his architect and fired him. The re-designed building is just about done, turned out great, and I suspect will bring in other clients as soon as it hits the market. And we're about to start design on a 2nd building with that same client.
Anyone who says "send them a bill," "don't get into specifics," etc. Has zero idea what they're talking about. Are there developers who are unethical? Absolutely! But they're not that hard to identify. Should you design the building for them for free? No way! But you need to demonstrate - with specifics, not generalities - to them that their multi-million dollar investment will be safe in your hands, and that you will make them more money than the other guys they're talking to. Does it suck that they make $2M on a project that we're paid $100K on? Yes! But if you don't like it or can't make it work for you, either put together the capital to develop a project yourself, or change to another profession.
citizen
Nov 7, 17 11:44 am
Excellent post on every level. Hell, even I want to hire you!
Wilma Buttfit
Nov 7, 17 12:00 pm
The send them a bill comment was trying to be funny. I guess it doesn't read...
jcarch
Nov 7, 17 6:49 pm
Genius! You're gonna make me blush! Anyway, we all appreciate your proving my point so thoroughly David.
jcarch
Nov 7, 17 7:10 pm
David, when you find yourself in a hole, it's usually best to stop digging, but hey, you do you.
jcarch
Nov 7, 17 11:23 pm
David, as a great man once said "son, fat, drunk, and stupid is no way to go through life." In your case, I have no idea about the first of these, and a growing suspicion about the second. But I think everyone who's read your posts on this thread would all agree that you've really nailed the third one. Keep up the good work!
citizen
Nov 8, 17 11:37 am
^ But pretty spot-on.
JLC-1
Nov 7, 17 10:32 am
this is juicy, kind makes you evaluate who you hate more, developers or lawyers?
Freely share your ideas at the first meeting; verbal only, take any sketches you make with you when you leave.
After that, do absolutely no more work until you have a signed contract and a retainer fee paid up front. And know that a letter of intent is worthless.
In my area, a lot of developers will steal SD packages by getting you to perform and deliver work "while they finalize the contract".
So im going to be interviewing with a developer because i want to be the point person to provide all design direction/planning. I know he'll probably ask what are some of my ideas, but im not sure how to approach it without giving away too much free information for him to run with it without hiring me.
What kind of information are you afraid of letting slip out that he could run with and cut you out of the picture?
You're trying to sell yourself and your ideas. Hold nothing back.
And then convince him that you are the one to execute it.
Ideas are a dime a dozen. The ability to deliver is rare.
Do exactly what they do, dangle the carrot!
oh jesus...get the hell over your ego sir, like an hour discussion with a developer is going to give them the key to great design. Won and done is totally right.
Send him a bill afterwards.
+++
$25,000 should be enough to cover all ideas.
In the spirit of won and done william's advice:
A few years ago, a developer approached me. He had an architect, but was unhappy with him. He showed me plans, saying "I don't want to change anything, I just want to switch architects." The building was a piece of sh*t. Ugly, poorly laid out, and violating zoning/code in a couple of places too.
I grabbed a roll of trace, and in 5 minutes showed him how he could move 300 s.f. from common spaces (which he can't sell) into the apartments. At $1,000 a foot (although with that design, I can't imagine him getting that price), I made him $300,000. I also told him that the design was worthless, and that I would be happy to work with him, but only if we started from scratch.
He could have walked out of my office, straight to his architect, and told them to make the changes I had sketched out. Instead he went straight to his architect and fired him. The re-designed building is just about done, turned out great, and I suspect will bring in other clients as soon as it hits the market. And we're about to start design on a 2nd building with that same client.
Anyone who says "send them a bill," "don't get into specifics," etc. Has zero idea what they're talking about. Are there developers who are unethical? Absolutely! But they're not that hard to identify. Should you design the building for them for free? No way! But you need to demonstrate - with specifics, not generalities - to them that their multi-million dollar investment will be safe in your hands, and that you will make them more money than the other guys they're talking to. Does it suck that they make $2M on a project that we're paid $100K on? Yes! But if you don't like it or can't make it work for you, either put together the capital to develop a project yourself, or change to another profession.
Excellent post on every level. Hell, even I want to hire you!
The send them a bill comment was trying to be funny. I guess it doesn't read...
Genius! You're gonna make me blush! Anyway, we all appreciate your proving my point so thoroughly David.
David, when you find yourself in a hole, it's usually best to stop digging, but hey, you do you.
David, as a great man once said "son, fat, drunk, and stupid is no way to go through life." In your case, I have no idea about the first of these, and a growing suspicion about the second. But I think everyone who's read your posts on this thread would all agree that you've really nailed the third one. Keep up the good work!
^ But pretty spot-on.
this is juicy, kind makes you evaluate who you hate more, developers or lawyers?
http://www.aspendailynews.com/...
Freely share your ideas at the first meeting; verbal only, take any sketches you make with you when you leave.
After that, do absolutely no more work until you have a signed contract and a retainer fee paid up front. And know that a letter of intent is worthless.
In my area, a lot of developers will steal SD packages by getting you to perform and deliver work "while they finalize the contract".