Does anyone else feel like we are back in the recession of 2009, or maybe the moments when everything stopped in 2008 before we realized the car was already over the cliff?
I'm a mid career architect, 12 years of experience, 8 of which is post-licensure. I remember the great recession of 2009 like it was yesterday, I spent 9 months unemployed and wondered often if I should leave this profession.
I was laid off in March when my office closed our commercial division, letting 30 of us go in one day. I had only been there 8 months, and it wasn't the best fit, so during that time and for the 3-4 months prior to getting the job I had been actively on the job market. In the grand total, I've now been on the job market for over 15 months, working the network and applying on the jobs boards.
Sure, during that time there were a couple of almost jobs, interviews and negotiations that didn't get to a place that worked for me or for them. But the last one of those was in December, while I was still employed. I haven't found a good solid lead for someone in the 10-15 range of experience in almost 7 months. I see a ton of jobs for the 0-6 range, but after that the boards are almost empty.
I was talking with a colleague tonight who is in the 35+ years of experience range who is also unemployed and has been for almost as long as I have been. They were noticing the same thing.
What do you all see out there? Is this just a statistical anomaly, a blip? Or are we already over a cliff, but we just don't know it?
Wilma Buttfit
Jun 29, 17 11:31 am
Beware the impact you might have by starting an expression with "Shades of"
Spencer Lepler
Jun 30, 17 3:58 am
What do you mean?
Wilma Buttfit
Jun 30, 17 11:15 am
There is a recent piece of pop culture that starts with "Shades of" that pops to mind. No biggie. Good luck.
chigurh
Jun 30, 17 1:54 pm
this post screams masochist
chigurh
Jun 30, 17 1:55 pm
50 shades of unemployed in the best market in years
eeayeeayo
Jun 29, 17 11:37 am
My office just hired back people who were laid off about a year ago. We're crazy-busy and others seem to be in the same boat. It's hard to know what will happen at any given moment - but a lot of our clients seem to be playing frantic catch-up on all the projects that were deferred back in that recession, and don't show signs of stopping any time soon. Public projects in particular are booming because all that "deferred maintenance" is now resulting in advanced decrepitude of existing facilities.
It sounds like your layoff was part of a major shift of focus for that particular firm, so may not be indicative of a major crisis in the field, but who knows.
I just read an article about the paradox of the long-term unemployed - how there's lots of hiring happening but if it's detectable that you've been out of work for more than a few months there can be a stigma - based on ideas that you might be behind on skill development and/or a difficult-fit personality. The recommendations were to add recent skill acquisitions to your resume and make it clear that you've been using your down-time to improve yourself, and when asked about recent past employment avoid phrases like "not a good fit".
spencerlepler
Jun 30, 17 3:43 am
*deleted*
spencerlepler
Jun 30, 17 3:43 am
*deleted*
Spencer Lepler
Jun 30, 17 3:49 am
Sorry, tried to reply on my phone and it kept logging in incorrectly and double posting.
What I was going to say was that I appreciate the advice, but I'm not really looking for feedback on job hunting, but more on how other people see the current market compared to what I am seeing in Northern Virginia.
And by "not a good fit," I was trying to avoid having to discuss that on the third day of work I was told not to mention my husband in response to anyone talking about their wives, because senior management was "very conservative" and would likely fire me.
Flatfish
Jun 30, 17 10:24 am
It's a mixed bag here (northeast). I know of layoffs in the past year at two local firms, but the refugees from those situations have been scooped up quickly, and the competition for them seems healthy. I'm not seeing a slow-down in rfps or calls from prospective clients.
thisisnotmyname
Jun 30, 17 11:30 am
You may consider relocating. In the south and west, I see a lot of advertised positions for people at your experience level.
The gist of what most of the places around here are looking for in a mid-level hire is someone who can oversee the production of CD sets in Revit.
tduds
Jun 30, 17 11:57 am
My old company collapsed about 10 months ago, laying off all 30+ designers. As far as I know, 100% of us have found new employment.
So, no I think things are going very well and if you're having trouble it's either 1) a regional quirk, 2) a poorly run firm, or 3) you.
archinine
Jun 30, 17 12:52 pm
Layoffs during a boom that I know of tend to be one of two things. If it's a smaller studio the loss of a big project or client (to another firm or a dried up gov endeavor) can decimate the ranks. Those I know who have experienced this have rebounded rather quickly but have less experience than OP (CAD monkeys to lowest tier project architects). If it's a big office it's usually due to the chief officers/partners having little real business training and failing to hire proper financial consultants to aid in their yearly planning/hiring strategies.
To the OP, from what I've read the market post recession has left the entire industry with deflated salaries. Employers have been slower to hire even when they need help (sharing the fear of posters here of a soon to be bust) and are less willing to take on mid career staff if they can get away with intermediates filling the gap.
The places I've seen looking for help in your experience range tend to be large corporate firms, primarily in the education and healthcare sectors. This makes sense as those are fairly specialized and more inelsatic in the market (comparatively).
Have you considered asking former employers for letters of recommendation? This may help to rebuff any doubts prospective employers have about your work gaps or reasons for layoffs. Though in this industry it should be expected there are ups and downs, I know one person who used this tool and found it highly effective when submitting applications.
Also best of luck out there.
Spencer Lepler
Jun 30, 17 8:34 pm
Thanks for the advice. The letters of recommendation isn't something I've heard before. Thankfully, I'm pretty well involved in my local and state AIA boards and have a decent network. I've managed to get my foot in the door for a lot of places just to have lunch, but it usually comes back to - "We want to hire, and in your range, but we we're waiting on federal contracts to come to fruition that were awarded a few years ago and have been put on hold." A big part of that is that the big firms DC/NOVA/PV area are really federal contracting focused.
Flatfish
Jun 30, 17 1:24 pm
The layoffs in the 2 local firms here have both been because the firms stretched themselves to take on very large projects compared to what they'd previously been doing, and hired new production staff to make those happen. Once the production phases were complete they didn't immediately have other huge projects in the pipeline so they cut back to at or near their previous sizes.
The situation with the OP's previous firm doesn't seem like it's his fault in any way, or due to economic shifts either. It sounds like the ownership decided to change their target market. It should be a pretty easy one to explain in interviews, with an answer that doesn't instill any doubt about the candidate.
Most of the positions currently or recently listed on my AIA chapter's site are for mid-career to senior people. Maybe a change of scenery would help the OP.
Spencer Lepler
Jun 30, 17 8:31 pm
If you don't mind me asking, which AIA site is that? The DC/NOVA/PV area is really more flooded with calls for jobs in the 0-6 range than the 10+
l b
Jul 1, 17 6:49 pm
I agree with what other posters have said about being super busy so it seems a downturn might be around the corner before too long, but the market is certainly not down right now. I am currently self employed with 10 years of experience, and have recently had unsolicited offers of employment from 2 firms. My friends that graduated at the same time are in high demand as well (one is in DC area and insanely busy), leading me to think that the 10 year experience range is in high demand in the southeast.
Because of the recession- and people leaving the profession or going back to school- there seems to be a lack of available people with the experience range you have.
Not that you asked, but I took a peak at your portfolio, and I would suggest removing everything you did during school. Showing academic work with 10 years of experience feels inappropriate unless it is a line of research or theory you are still actively pursuing. I also second David Curtis' on graphics refinement. The project titles are larger than any actual image. 2d graphic skills are expected to produce a legible set of CD's. I think it is perfectly acceptable when you have 5+ years of experience to simply and clearly show large scale photographs or renderings of work and a set of CD's you've done yourself or led a project team on, and avoid the highly stylized graphics characteristic of so many academic portfolios.
will galloway
Jul 1, 17 8:49 pm
Dont know about the market, but I agree about the portfolio needing some reworking. There is a bit of a mismatch between the CV and the portfolio. If buildings are completed I would not include any renderings. Elevations or plans may make sense (I wouldnt include them but that is me) but they should not obscure the images of built projects the way you have done. It is kind of strange but I cant really see the built work properly in many of the pages you put together. I am not sure why this is the case but for me it reads as though you dont like any of the stuff you have done. In which case I recommend that you place the photos and plans more simply and emphasize the work as built objects. If plans dont fit dont include them.
The kitchen fit out also reads as strange, as it is a big scale jump from the kind of work I imagine you would be aiming for. With all the work you have done over more than 10 years I guess you have a lot of projects to choose from and can make a powerful portfolio showing what you built, where, what the problems were if that was important etc. Follow that with a set of CDs if you like, as the post above suggests. That would be a lot more impressive and match the CV better.
Does anyone else feel like we are back in the recession of 2009, or maybe the moments when everything stopped in 2008 before we realized the car was already over the cliff?
I'm a mid career architect, 12 years of experience, 8 of which is post-licensure. I remember the great recession of 2009 like it was yesterday, I spent 9 months unemployed and wondered often if I should leave this profession.
I was laid off in March when my office closed our commercial division, letting 30 of us go in one day. I had only been there 8 months, and it wasn't the best fit, so during that time and for the 3-4 months prior to getting the job I had been actively on the job market. In the grand total, I've now been on the job market for over 15 months, working the network and applying on the jobs boards.
Sure, during that time there were a couple of almost jobs, interviews and negotiations that didn't get to a place that worked for me or for them. But the last one of those was in December, while I was still employed. I haven't found a good solid lead for someone in the 10-15 range of experience in almost 7 months. I see a ton of jobs for the 0-6 range, but after that the boards are almost empty.
I was talking with a colleague tonight who is in the 35+ years of experience range who is also unemployed and has been for almost as long as I have been. They were noticing the same thing.
What do you all see out there? Is this just a statistical anomaly, a blip? Or are we already over a cliff, but we just don't know it?
Beware the impact you might have by starting an expression with "Shades of"
What do you mean?
There is a recent piece of pop culture that starts with "Shades of" that pops to mind. No biggie. Good luck.
this post screams masochist
50 shades of unemployed in the best market in years
My office just hired back people who were laid off about a year ago. We're crazy-busy and others seem to be in the same boat. It's hard to know what will happen at any given moment - but a lot of our clients seem to be playing frantic catch-up on all the projects that were deferred back in that recession, and don't show signs of stopping any time soon. Public projects in particular are booming because all that "deferred maintenance" is now resulting in advanced decrepitude of existing facilities.
It sounds like your layoff was part of a major shift of focus for that particular firm, so may not be indicative of a major crisis in the field, but who knows.
I just read an article about the paradox of the long-term unemployed - how there's lots of hiring happening but if it's detectable that you've been out of work for more than a few months there can be a stigma - based on ideas that you might be behind on skill development and/or a difficult-fit personality. The recommendations were to add recent skill acquisitions to your resume and make it clear that you've been using your down-time to improve yourself, and when asked about recent past employment avoid phrases like "not a good fit".
*deleted*
*deleted*
Sorry, tried to reply on my phone and it kept logging in incorrectly and double posting.
What I was going to say was that I appreciate the advice, but I'm not really looking for feedback on job hunting, but more on how other people see the current market compared to what I am seeing in Northern Virginia.
And by "not a good fit," I was trying to avoid having to discuss that on the third day of work I was told not to mention my husband in response to anyone talking about their wives, because senior management was "very conservative" and would likely fire me.
It's a mixed bag here (northeast). I know of layoffs in the past year at two local firms, but the refugees from those situations have been scooped up quickly, and the competition for them seems healthy. I'm not seeing a slow-down in rfps or calls from prospective clients.
You may consider relocating. In the south and west, I see a lot of advertised positions for people at your experience level.
The gist of what most of the places around here are looking for in a mid-level hire is someone who can oversee the production of CD sets in Revit.
My old company collapsed about 10 months ago, laying off all 30+ designers. As far as I know, 100% of us have found new employment.
So, no I think things are going very well and if you're having trouble it's either 1) a regional quirk, 2) a poorly run firm, or 3) you.
Layoffs during a boom that I know of tend to be one of two things. If it's a smaller studio the loss of a big project or client (to another firm or a dried up gov endeavor) can decimate the ranks. Those I know who have experienced this have rebounded rather quickly but have less experience than OP (CAD monkeys to lowest tier project architects). If it's a big office it's usually due to the chief officers/partners having little real business training and failing to hire proper financial consultants to aid in their yearly planning/hiring strategies.
To the OP, from what I've read the market post recession has left the entire industry with deflated salaries. Employers have been slower to hire even when they need help (sharing the fear of posters here of a soon to be bust) and are less willing to take on mid career staff if they can get away with intermediates filling the gap.
The places I've seen looking for help in your experience range tend to be large corporate firms, primarily in the education and healthcare sectors. This makes sense as those are fairly specialized and more inelsatic in the market (comparatively).
Have you considered asking former employers for letters of recommendation? This may help to rebuff any doubts prospective employers have about your work gaps or reasons for layoffs. Though in this industry it should be expected there are ups and downs, I know one person who used this tool and found it highly effective when submitting applications.
Also best of luck out there.
Thanks for the advice. The letters of recommendation isn't something I've heard before. Thankfully, I'm pretty well involved in my local and state AIA boards and have a decent network. I've managed to get my foot in the door for a lot of places just to have lunch, but it usually comes back to - "We want to hire, and in your range, but we we're waiting on federal contracts to come to fruition that were awarded a few years ago and have been put on hold." A big part of that is that the big firms DC/NOVA/PV area are really federal contracting focused.
The layoffs in the 2 local firms here have both been because the firms stretched themselves to take on very large projects compared to what they'd previously been doing, and hired new production staff to make those happen. Once the production phases were complete they didn't immediately have other huge projects in the pipeline so they cut back to at or near their previous sizes.
The situation with the OP's previous firm doesn't seem like it's his fault in any way, or due to economic shifts either. It sounds like the ownership decided to change their target market. It should be a pretty easy one to explain in interviews, with an answer that doesn't instill any doubt about the candidate.
Most of the positions currently or recently listed on my AIA chapter's site are for mid-career to senior people. Maybe a change of scenery would help the OP.
If you don't mind me asking, which AIA site is that? The DC/NOVA/PV area is really more flooded with calls for jobs in the 0-6 range than the 10+
I agree with what other posters have said about being super busy so it seems a downturn might be around the corner before too long, but the market is certainly not down right now. I am currently self employed with 10 years of experience, and have recently had unsolicited offers of employment from 2 firms. My friends that graduated at the same time are in high demand as well (one is in DC area and insanely busy), leading me to think that the 10 year experience range is in high demand in the southeast.
Because of the recession- and people leaving the profession or going back to school- there seems to be a lack of available people with the experience range you have.
Not that you asked, but I took a peak at your portfolio, and I would suggest removing everything you did during school. Showing academic work with 10 years of experience feels inappropriate unless it is a line of research or theory you are still actively pursuing. I also second David Curtis' on graphics refinement. The project titles are larger than any actual image. 2d graphic skills are expected to produce a legible set of CD's. I think it is perfectly acceptable when you have 5+ years of experience to simply and clearly show large scale photographs or renderings of work and a set of CD's you've done yourself or led a project team on, and avoid the highly stylized graphics characteristic of so many academic portfolios.
Dont know about the market, but I agree about the portfolio needing some reworking. There is a bit of a mismatch between the CV and the portfolio. If buildings are completed I would not include any renderings. Elevations or plans may make sense (I wouldnt include them but that is me) but they should not obscure the images of built projects the way you have done. It is kind of strange but I cant really see the built work properly in many of the pages you put together. I am not sure why this is the case but for me it reads as though you dont like any of the stuff you have done. In which case I recommend that you place the photos and plans more simply and emphasize the work as built objects. If plans dont fit dont include them.
The kitchen fit out also reads as strange, as it is a big scale jump from the kind of work I imagine you would be aiming for. With all the work you have done over more than 10 years I guess you have a lot of projects to choose from and can make a powerful portfolio showing what you built, where, what the problems were if that was important etc. Follow that with a set of CDs if you like, as the post above suggests. That would be a lot more impressive and match the CV better.
Hope you get work soon.