I currently am in the Architecture Program at Arizona State University and recently became aware that my program here is not an accredited program. I know that an accredited degree is necessary in order to become a licensed architect and want to transfer to a school with an accredited undergraduate program; the problem is that Colorado, where I am able to receive resident tuition, does not offer an accredited program in architecture. Another part of the issue is that I am concerned that I will not receive enough merit money to attend an out of state school as transfer students do not receive as much money as a freshman applicant will. Is there a way i would be able to receive in in state tuition in another state as some sort of reciprocal program due to Colorado not offering an accredited architecture program? Or be able to transfer to University of Arizona in Tucson into their accredited undergraduate architecture program for a similar cost? Are there other states that have reasonable prices for out of state tuition if that is not a thing? (reasonable price being around $30,000 which is more than I pay now but about what I would be paying to attend CU) I currently have a healthy scholarship at ASU giving me $14,500/year. If nothing else I will be transferring to the University of Colorado at Boulder to receive an Environmental design degree (my credits will all be transferrable for credit) and plan to receive a masters of architecture from there. Any help and advice is appreciated, I feel like I am stuck right now and am kicking myself for not doing more research about my program before coming to Arizona State University as I feel that I am stuck in a hole.
g.thomas.z
Apr 3, 17 2:49 am
Most Colorado residents attend CU Boulder for the Environmental Design degree (4-years, non-accredited), and then attend CU Denver for the Master of Architecture (2-years, accredited). However, the CU Denver program is somewhat unstable and actually lost its accredited status a few years back, before recently regaining it. To be quite honest, I've never been overly impressed with their program.
Instead of doing taking that route, I used the WUE exchange program to attend Montana State University. This was cheaper than in-state tuition would have been at CU Boulder, as Montana schools tend to keep their rates low in order to attract out-of-state students. I finished with a 5-year accredited Masters, went to an incredible for school in a beautiful part of the country, and have a portfolio that I would proudly put up against anyone's-- even the Ivy league schools.
How many years in are you at ASU? In the end it will depend on how many credits you can transfer over. Look into MSU. It's a great school and it's affordable. DM me if you have questions.
asteavpack
Apr 3, 17 3:51 pm
Yes, this matches my research of CU Denver and want to avoid CU Denver at all costs. Montana State sounds like it would be a great option with an accredited 5 year masters. What would you think about going to CU Boulder for their Environmental Design degree and trying to graduate from that program in 3 years and doing a 3 year masters program if I am unable to transfer into an accredited program at a school such as Montana State? Trying to have as many options as possible.
archanonymous
Apr 3, 17 8:31 am
the 4 + 2 is really the only option for in-state colorado schools.
Also, don't listen to the poster above - you need an accredited degree.
asteavpack
Apr 3, 17 4:05 pm
I am aware of the differnt paths towards a licensure but feel that from what I have learned an accredited degree is very beneficial. I mostly want to know what an accredited degree will offer that a non-accredited program will not.
tduds
Apr 5, 17 8:08 pm
"Need" and "should get" are similar but not identical.
You "should get" an accredited degree.
Dangermouse
Apr 3, 17 12:32 pm
if you'd like to stay in the rocky mountain west, i'd recommend getting residency in montana. montana state has a 4 year b.a. and a 3 semester masters program that is well respected in the region, if your goal is to stay on the west coast. in-state is 9k/year, and out of state is 24k.
i cannot speak to CU denver's program, but recent accreditation loss is a major red flag, imho.
asteavpack
Apr 3, 17 3:54 pm
Wow that is actually extremely affordable even for the out of state costs if I am unable to receive the in state price as part of the Western Undergraduate Exchange program. I assume housing would be pretty affordable in Montana State as well. MSU looks like it could be the best option for me as I continue to receive more responses.
Dangermouse
Apr 3, 17 5:07 pm
a room in bozeman will run about 500 dollars, and a single bedroom apt. will be about 1k. the rental market is a clusterfuck and supply is far below demand, so if you decide to move plan accordingly and start looking early. otherwise, living expenses are cheap, skiing is great and trout are abundant.
mightyaa
Apr 3, 17 3:11 pm
Ignore Rick... Yes, you can technically get your license locally by working under a architect as he suggest... but that license is not like NCARB and may not be recognized anywhere else.
Look up "Midwest Student Exchange Program (MSEP)" and "Western Undergraduate Exchange"... these are two different multi-state programs that essentially get you tuition out of state for no more than 150% of in-state tuition. Example is since you are a CO resident, you could have been on this program for your ASU degree. Also keep in mind ASU does have, like CU a accredited masters program.
asteavpack
Apr 3, 17 4:00 pm
I am aware of the WUE program but unfortunately it is not offered on the main campus at ASU and additionally not offered for architecture. WUE is somewhat misleading as it is mostly offered for less popular degree programs. Luckily I earned healthy scholarships from ASU that actually make it more affordable than my in state options and even more due to high housing costs. Not sure I would qualify for MSEP as a Colorado resident, but I will look into it. I am not completely opposed to attending a non WUE school if it is accredited as it would help even out the total costs of schooling if it can reduce the years in a masters program.
mightyaa
Apr 4, 17 12:58 pm
I went to OSU, my sister did KSU and their 5 year programs. Just fyi; You still get charged graduate level out of state tuition for that 5th year and for most, it still takes 6 years.
asteavpack
Apr 3, 17 4:10 pm
I am planning to apply as a transfer student to the accredited bachelors programs at the University of Oregon, North Carolina State, and the then the program at Montana State which sounds like it is 5 year accredited masters track.
curtkram
Apr 3, 17 10:01 pm
you're not going to want to read rick's posts. sorry you weren't warned earlier (thanks mighty for helping with that though)
why are you set against the 4+2 path?
curtkram
Apr 4, 17 7:43 am
have you gotten your license through experience yet rick? you sure you understand how the process works? i know for certain how a 4+2 program works, because that's the degree path i took. didn't have to make any guesses or assumptions, just showed up and walked out with a couple degrees.
mightyaa
Apr 4, 17 12:55 pm
Agreed. Rick, there is "technically possible" and reality. I know of only a handful who have successfully become licensed without an accredited degree. For those, that is all ancient history that happened in the early '80's and involved lawsuits and became Colorado "X" licenses. Since then, I know of no one who's successfully navigated the route you suggested. I do know of a few who got licensed in a different country and became architects here, but even then, most still had massive red tape to go through and it took years. I know how the 5 year program works and the 4+2.
kjdt
Apr 4, 17 2:41 pm
Rick, there may be people out there who don't know about all the alternatives. However, the main reasons more people don't do the alternatives aren't that they don't know about them. They are: 1. the alternatives limit future mobility. Some states don't accept some alternate routes. This is still true even with alternate ways to become NCARB certified. I have several colleagues who are very sad now, 10 to 20 years into their careers, that they severely limited their options by the choices they made about their educations when they were 19. The state in which we do most of our projects does not accept alternate routes. 2. It limits employability and can make it tough to even get a foot in some doors. You yourself stated just a few days ago that the reason that you haven't been able to find a singe job in a firm near you in the past decade is that they all want people with B.Archs or M.Archs. 3. Alternate routes usually take longer, and that can limit lifetime earnings. That is a different equation for each person, because it needs to be balanced against lost earnings while in school, as well as against tuition, but staying an unlicensed intern (or whatever it's called these days) for longer usually means staying at lower salaries for longer - which means you hit your "prime earning years" later, which means you spend fewer years in them.
kjdt
Apr 4, 17 2:50 pm
Some may not be informed. I think most of us were in fact very well informed and chose, with a healthy amount of deliberation, to take the route that gave us the most long-term flexibility. I know that in my undergrad program (4 year non-professional architecture major) we were all given a handout during registration in our sophomore years (the year that we entered our majors) specifically explaining all routes to licensing, including: no degree; 4+2 M.Arch track; 4 only, followed by experience; B.Arch; etc. Maybe I can find it and scan it for you, to illustrate that it absolutely is not a "secret".
You're not a good advertisement for alternate routes. They've gotten you stuck for more than a decade now. You can't get experience because you don't have the prerequisite education - that illustrates one of the limitations of those routes.
kjdt
Apr 4, 17 6:58 pm
A lot of architecture schools do have the information about various licensing paths right on their websites. As for informing students in their freshman years: isn't that a little ridiculous? Most students haven't chosen majors by that point - so are you expecting the universities to inform students of every possible licensing path for every possible career path? i.e. the schools are supposed to give students a book that lays out all licensing options for everything from architects to pharmacists to mortuary cosmetologists? It's up to students to research the careers they're considering - and there's no shortage of information for prospective architects. Everyplace from the AIA to NCARB to the state boards has all of the options - as do various "so you want to be an architect" books. Besides which, the OP already stated he's aware of the various paths. There is not big conspiracy to keep this information secret - it's just that most people recognize that the alternate routes aren't the best routes for establishing the best long-term flexibility, employability, and career trajectory.
You're a good example of the potential wasted earning years associated with alternative routes. You've frittered away over 15 years in which you could have been establishing a career, if only you'd been able to get a job. At this point there's no practical reason that anybody would want to partner with you, so the only way you're going to get any experience is as an entry-level drafter at age 37 or whatever.
mightyaa
Apr 4, 17 8:26 pm
Disclaimer; totally from memory and I'm unsure how much is urban legend versus fact.
The lawsuit I was referring to goes back to when CU Boulder had a accredited degree, then lost it. A whole group of graduates and those who were deep in the program suddenly found themselves with a worthless degree. To add insult, at that time there was no accredited degree available from any college in CO. So these students got very active politically very fast, found someone to sponsor a lawsuit and won against the State and the licensing board. If memory serves me right, they also had to add back in the experience route to achieve eligibility to take the ARE (which had been stripped in favor of only accepting NCARB certifications).
mightyaa
Apr 4, 17 8:31 pm
Oh... I also think it went pretty high up in the courts and has something to do with why most States still allow something like 10 years of experience being equivalent. Basically part of it I think had to do with a for-profit corporation (NCARB) being a monopoly having lone authority to decide who can practice and who cannot; generally not allowed by most State constitutions. So the experience thing is a governmental recourse so they can just point to alternate routes. It's probably also why NCARB has other methods; So States can say they provide other ways to become licensed and still maintain some sort national standard.
kjdt
Apr 4, 17 9:06 pm
Rick I have taught in several B.Arch programs. Most of them don't even admit students into the architecture major until the end of their freshman year. They have a little "meet the majors" program, where students visit different departments over the course of a couple weeks, and at the end they decide which major to select - or if it's competitive then which ones to apply to. The way it works is that they do the regular first year foundation courses, and in the spring of freshman year they submit a departmental application. In some programs it's a pretty sure thing that anybody who wants to be in the major gets in, while in others it's competitive - basically like another application process once you're already in the university - and there are limited spots. There may be some 5-year programs that admit students directly into a studio sequence in their freshman year, but all of those with which I'm familiar just advise students on what typical liberal arts type coursework to take in their freshman year to target the major - for architecture the recommendations are typically for writing/composition, math and/or science courses, a freehand drawing or life drawing course, philosophy, art history, etc. There are many professions that have alternative routes to licensing. In some states it's still possible to become an attorney by apprenticing and passing the bar - with no higher education. In some states one can become a licensed psychotherapist by training with another licensed psychotherapist - no degree required. All one needs to do is a little research. But it can't possibly fall upon universities to tell every student every possible licensing route for every profession!
curtkram
Apr 4, 17 9:08 pm
you know they send me an email every time someone replies to this......
kjdt
Apr 4, 17 9:14 pm
You can turn that off. The link to turn off notifications is in all those emails that they send you....
kjdt
Apr 4, 17 9:41 pm
Rick, I'm a faculty member in 2 B.Arch programs right now. I've taught in several others, and have been on admissions committees numerous times. I'm telling you from experience how this works in several schools. You can "doubt that" all you want, but it won't make you right. UO is one school - it has its processes, but those are not the same at every school. As for what you personally could do or want to do or whatever: part of your problem is all those years spent trying to pursue alternatives. You'd be eligible for grants and scholarships if you hadn't spent 10 years futzing around in community college earning Cs. You'd be eligible for loans if you hadn't used up all your years of eligibility without graduating. Think about it: all those architecture students you knew at UO graduated long ago, got jobs in the industry, and some are now licensed. Where have your alternatives gotten you other than in debt? Have you managed to find anyone who wants to partner with you? Have you managed to turn up any projects in Finland? Have you finished and sold any of the stock plans you said you were working on? Have you done anything at all? Hopefully prospective students who read these threads will see you as a good reason not to be you.
kjdt
Apr 5, 17 10:36 am
You're never going to do any of that. You're always "getting things together to [insert latest plan here]" but you never actually do anything ever.
Beepbeep
Apr 4, 17 11:03 am
Kansas or K-state one of those has a 5 year masters degree.
The grad program at CU Denver is getting much better and the design build program is rocking.
asteavpack
Apr 5, 17 3:04 pm
I am trying to do whatever I can to get into a 4 year accredited bachelors program and if that doesn't pan out I will continue on to a masters program right from an unaccredited bachelors degree. If I am able to get into an accredited four year program probably still go for a masters degree but the four year accredited programs give me the most flexibility and options after undergraduate studies. I just really wish I was more aware of this when choosing schools because I had been admitted into accredited programs while deciding on a university last year.
Fivescore
Apr 5, 17 4:51 pm
When you say your current program isn't accredited, you mean NAAB-accredited professional degree, correct? That is the case with ALL 4-year undergrad architecture majors - they're all "4" components of "4+2" paths, or in a handful of schools they're part of a "4+1" path, but they are not accredited professional degrees on their own. NAAB does not accredit non-professional 4-year undergrad degree programs on their own - they only accredit professional degree programs (first-professional B.Arch or M.Arch programs).
I thought from your first post that what you were trying to do was transfer to a 5-year accredited B.Arch program. But in your most recent post you're saying you're looking for another 4-year program? In that case I'm not understanding what's wrong with your current program, as compared to another 4-year program elsewhere. Can you elaborate?
asteavpack
Apr 6, 17 3:10 pm
Yes, I got mixed up but I am seeking out an accredited B. Arch program, my current program is a 4 year program and I feel that I should go to an accredited undergraduate program so I have that safety net of having an accredited degree. This would allow me to pursue a masters program if I would like to and if a masters in architecture is not in the cards due to finances or any other number of reasons I will already have an accredited degree to go directly into the industry.
Mr_Wiggin
Apr 5, 17 4:52 pm
The accredited bachelor's was a white buffalo degree when I started my architecture education back in 2008, hard to come by, and a crap-shoot once you get in. As education in the US is now a business, and students are to be milked for all they can, school's have dumped their 4-year professional degrees, and only given current students in those programs fairly narrow timelines to complete their degrees, or roll things into the Master's track. As an FYI, the 5-year master's is just code for taking 2 summer semesters, effectively knocking a year of real-time out of the program, but still taking on the same load/economic burden. Don't get to wrapped up in getting things done as fast as possible, architecture education will burn you out if you haven't discovered that already, it's best to take your time.
asteavpack
Apr 6, 17 3:13 pm
Yes, that is another factor I am taking into account by going for an accredited B. Arch program I do not want to be burned out at the end of my undergraduate program with an unaccredited degree and not have the motivation to pursue a masters degree.
I currently am in the Architecture Program at Arizona State University and recently became aware that my program here is not an accredited program. I know that an accredited degree is necessary in order to become a licensed architect and want to transfer to a school with an accredited undergraduate program; the problem is that Colorado, where I am able to receive resident tuition, does not offer an accredited program in architecture. Another part of the issue is that I am concerned that I will not receive enough merit money to attend an out of state school as transfer students do not receive as much money as a freshman applicant will. Is there a way i would be able to receive in in state tuition in another state as some sort of reciprocal program due to Colorado not offering an accredited architecture program? Or be able to transfer to University of Arizona in Tucson into their accredited undergraduate architecture program for a similar cost? Are there other states that have reasonable prices for out of state tuition if that is not a thing? (reasonable price being around $30,000 which is more than I pay now but about what I would be paying to attend CU) I currently have a healthy scholarship at ASU giving me $14,500/year. If nothing else I will be transferring to the University of Colorado at Boulder to receive an Environmental design degree (my credits will all be transferrable for credit) and plan to receive a masters of architecture from there. Any help and advice is appreciated, I feel like I am stuck right now and am kicking myself for not doing more research about my program before coming to Arizona State University as I feel that I am stuck in a hole.
Most Colorado residents attend CU Boulder for the Environmental Design degree (4-years, non-accredited), and then attend CU Denver for the Master of Architecture (2-years, accredited). However, the CU Denver program is somewhat unstable and actually lost its accredited status a few years back, before recently regaining it. To be quite honest, I've never been overly impressed with their program.
Instead of doing taking that route, I used the WUE exchange program to attend Montana State University. This was cheaper than in-state tuition would have been at CU Boulder, as Montana schools tend to keep their rates low in order to attract out-of-state students. I finished with a 5-year accredited Masters, went to an incredible for school in a beautiful part of the country, and have a portfolio that I would proudly put up against anyone's-- even the Ivy league schools.
How many years in are you at ASU? In the end it will depend on how many credits you can transfer over. Look into MSU. It's a great school and it's affordable. DM me if you have questions.
Yes, this matches my research of CU Denver and want to avoid CU Denver at all costs. Montana State sounds like it would be a great option with an accredited 5 year masters. What would you think about going to CU Boulder for their Environmental Design degree and trying to graduate from that program in 3 years and doing a 3 year masters program if I am unable to transfer into an accredited program at a school such as Montana State? Trying to have as many options as possible.
the 4 + 2 is really the only option for in-state colorado schools.
Also, don't listen to the poster above - you need an accredited degree.
I am aware of the differnt paths towards a licensure but feel that from what I have learned an accredited degree is very beneficial. I mostly want to know what an accredited degree will offer that a non-accredited program will not.
"Need" and "should get" are similar but not identical.
You "should get" an accredited degree.
if you'd like to stay in the rocky mountain west, i'd recommend getting residency in montana. montana state has a 4 year b.a. and a 3 semester masters program that is well respected in the region, if your goal is to stay on the west coast. in-state is 9k/year, and out of state is 24k.
i cannot speak to CU denver's program, but recent accreditation loss is a major red flag, imho.
Wow that is actually extremely affordable even for the out of state costs if I am unable to receive the in state price as part of the Western Undergraduate Exchange program. I assume housing would be pretty affordable in Montana State as well. MSU looks like it could be the best option for me as I continue to receive more responses.
a room in bozeman will run about 500 dollars, and a single bedroom apt. will be about 1k. the rental market is a clusterfuck and supply is far below demand, so if you decide to move plan accordingly and start looking early. otherwise, living expenses are cheap, skiing is great and trout are abundant.
Ignore Rick... Yes, you can technically get your license locally by working under a architect as he suggest... but that license is not like NCARB and may not be recognized anywhere else.
Look up "Midwest Student Exchange Program (MSEP)" and "Western Undergraduate Exchange"... these are two different multi-state programs that essentially get you tuition out of state for no more than 150% of in-state tuition. Example is since you are a CO resident, you could have been on this program for your ASU degree. Also keep in mind ASU does have, like CU a accredited masters program.
I am aware of the WUE program but unfortunately it is not offered on the main campus at ASU and additionally not offered for architecture. WUE is somewhat misleading as it is mostly offered for less popular degree programs. Luckily I earned healthy scholarships from ASU that actually make it more affordable than my in state options and even more due to high housing costs. Not sure I would qualify for MSEP as a Colorado resident, but I will look into it. I am not completely opposed to attending a non WUE school if it is accredited as it would help even out the total costs of schooling if it can reduce the years in a masters program.
I went to OSU, my sister did KSU and their 5 year programs. Just fyi; You still get charged graduate level out of state tuition for that 5th year and for most, it still takes 6 years.
I am planning to apply as a transfer student to the accredited bachelors programs at the University of Oregon, North Carolina State, and the then the program at Montana State which sounds like it is 5 year accredited masters track.
you're not going to want to read rick's posts. sorry you weren't warned earlier (thanks mighty for helping with that though)
why are you set against the 4+2 path?
have you gotten your license through experience yet rick? you sure you understand how the process works? i know for certain how a 4+2 program works, because that's the degree path i took. didn't have to make any guesses or assumptions, just showed up and walked out with a couple degrees.
Agreed. Rick, there is "technically possible" and reality. I know of only a handful who have successfully become licensed without an accredited degree. For those, that is all ancient history that happened in the early '80's and involved lawsuits and became Colorado "X" licenses. Since then, I know of no one who's successfully navigated the route you suggested. I do know of a few who got licensed in a different country and became architects here, but even then, most still had massive red tape to go through and it took years. I know how the 5 year program works and the 4+2.
Rick, there may be people out there who don't know about all the alternatives. However, the main reasons more people don't do the alternatives aren't that they don't know about them. They are: 1. the alternatives limit future mobility. Some states don't accept some alternate routes. This is still true even with alternate ways to become NCARB certified. I have several colleagues who are very sad now, 10 to 20 years into their careers, that they severely limited their options by the choices they made about their educations when they were 19. The state in which we do most of our projects does not accept alternate routes. 2. It limits employability and can make it tough to even get a foot in some doors. You yourself stated just a few days ago that the reason that you haven't been able to find a singe job in a firm near you in the past decade is that they all want people with B.Archs or M.Archs. 3. Alternate routes usually take longer, and that can limit lifetime earnings. That is a different equation for each person, because it needs to be balanced against lost earnings while in school, as well as against tuition, but staying an unlicensed intern (or whatever it's called these days) for longer usually means staying at lower salaries for longer - which means you hit your "prime earning years" later, which means you spend fewer years in them.
Some may not be informed. I think most of us were in fact very well informed and chose, with a healthy amount of deliberation, to take the route that gave us the most long-term flexibility. I know that in my undergrad program (4 year non-professional architecture major) we were all given a handout during registration in our sophomore years (the year that we entered our majors) specifically explaining all routes to licensing, including: no degree; 4+2 M.Arch track; 4 only, followed by experience; B.Arch; etc. Maybe I can find it and scan it for you, to illustrate that it absolutely is not a "secret".
You're not a good advertisement for alternate routes. They've gotten you stuck for more than a decade now. You can't get experience because you don't have the prerequisite education - that illustrates one of the limitations of those routes.
A lot of architecture schools do have the information about various licensing paths right on their websites. As for informing students in their freshman years: isn't that a little ridiculous? Most students haven't chosen majors by that point - so are you expecting the universities to inform students of every possible licensing path for every possible career path? i.e. the schools are supposed to give students a book that lays out all licensing options for everything from architects to pharmacists to mortuary cosmetologists? It's up to students to research the careers they're considering - and there's no shortage of information for prospective architects. Everyplace from the AIA to NCARB to the state boards has all of the options - as do various "so you want to be an architect" books. Besides which, the OP already stated he's aware of the various paths. There is not big conspiracy to keep this information secret - it's just that most people recognize that the alternate routes aren't the best routes for establishing the best long-term flexibility, employability, and career trajectory.
You're a good example of the potential wasted earning years associated with alternative routes. You've frittered away over 15 years in which you could have been establishing a career, if only you'd been able to get a job. At this point there's no practical reason that anybody would want to partner with you, so the only way you're going to get any experience is as an entry-level drafter at age 37 or whatever.
Disclaimer; totally from memory and I'm unsure how much is urban legend versus fact. The lawsuit I was referring to goes back to when CU Boulder had a accredited degree, then lost it. A whole group of graduates and those who were deep in the program suddenly found themselves with a worthless degree. To add insult, at that time there was no accredited degree available from any college in CO. So these students got very active politically very fast, found someone to sponsor a lawsuit and won against the State and the licensing board. If memory serves me right, they also had to add back in the experience route to achieve eligibility to take the ARE (which had been stripped in favor of only accepting NCARB certifications).
Oh... I also think it went pretty high up in the courts and has something to do with why most States still allow something like 10 years of experience being equivalent. Basically part of it I think had to do with a for-profit corporation (NCARB) being a monopoly having lone authority to decide who can practice and who cannot; generally not allowed by most State constitutions. So the experience thing is a governmental recourse so they can just point to alternate routes. It's probably also why NCARB has other methods; So States can say they provide other ways to become licensed and still maintain some sort national standard.
Rick I have taught in several B.Arch programs. Most of them don't even admit students into the architecture major until the end of their freshman year. They have a little "meet the majors" program, where students visit different departments over the course of a couple weeks, and at the end they decide which major to select - or if it's competitive then which ones to apply to. The way it works is that they do the regular first year foundation courses, and in the spring of freshman year they submit a departmental application. In some programs it's a pretty sure thing that anybody who wants to be in the major gets in, while in others it's competitive - basically like another application process once you're already in the university - and there are limited spots. There may be some 5-year programs that admit students directly into a studio sequence in their freshman year, but all of those with which I'm familiar just advise students on what typical liberal arts type coursework to take in their freshman year to target the major - for architecture the recommendations are typically for writing/composition, math and/or science courses, a freehand drawing or life drawing course, philosophy, art history, etc. There are many professions that have alternative routes to licensing. In some states it's still possible to become an attorney by apprenticing and passing the bar - with no higher education. In some states one can become a licensed psychotherapist by training with another licensed psychotherapist - no degree required. All one needs to do is a little research. But it can't possibly fall upon universities to tell every student every possible licensing route for every profession!
you know they send me an email every time someone replies to this......
You can turn that off. The link to turn off notifications is in all those emails that they send you....
Rick, I'm a faculty member in 2 B.Arch programs right now. I've taught in several others, and have been on admissions committees numerous times. I'm telling you from experience how this works in several schools. You can "doubt that" all you want, but it won't make you right. UO is one school - it has its processes, but those are not the same at every school. As for what you personally could do or want to do or whatever: part of your problem is all those years spent trying to pursue alternatives. You'd be eligible for grants and scholarships if you hadn't spent 10 years futzing around in community college earning Cs. You'd be eligible for loans if you hadn't used up all your years of eligibility without graduating. Think about it: all those architecture students you knew at UO graduated long ago, got jobs in the industry, and some are now licensed. Where have your alternatives gotten you other than in debt? Have you managed to find anyone who wants to partner with you? Have you managed to turn up any projects in Finland? Have you finished and sold any of the stock plans you said you were working on? Have you done anything at all? Hopefully prospective students who read these threads will see you as a good reason not to be you.
You're never going to do any of that. You're always "getting things together to [insert latest plan here]" but you never actually do anything ever.
Kansas or K-state one of those has a 5 year masters degree.
The grad program at CU Denver is getting much better and the design build program is rocking.
I am trying to do whatever I can to get into a 4 year accredited bachelors program and if that doesn't pan out I will continue on to a masters program right from an unaccredited bachelors degree. If I am able to get into an accredited four year program probably still go for a masters degree but the four year accredited programs give me the most flexibility and options after undergraduate studies. I just really wish I was more aware of this when choosing schools because I had been admitted into accredited programs while deciding on a university last year.
When you say your current program isn't accredited, you mean NAAB-accredited professional degree, correct? That is the case with ALL 4-year undergrad architecture majors - they're all "4" components of "4+2" paths, or in a handful of schools they're part of a "4+1" path, but they are not accredited professional degrees on their own. NAAB does not accredit non-professional 4-year undergrad degree programs on their own - they only accredit professional degree programs (first-professional B.Arch or M.Arch programs).
I thought from your first post that what you were trying to do was transfer to a 5-year accredited B.Arch program. But in your most recent post you're saying you're looking for another 4-year program? In that case I'm not understanding what's wrong with your current program, as compared to another 4-year program elsewhere. Can you elaborate?
Yes, I got mixed up but I am seeking out an accredited B. Arch program, my current program is a 4 year program and I feel that I should go to an accredited undergraduate program so I have that safety net of having an accredited degree. This would allow me to pursue a masters program if I would like to and if a masters in architecture is not in the cards due to finances or any other number of reasons I will already have an accredited degree to go directly into the industry.
The accredited bachelor's was a white buffalo degree when I started my architecture education back in 2008, hard to come by, and a crap-shoot once you get in. As education in the US is now a business, and students are to be milked for all they can, school's have dumped their 4-year professional degrees, and only given current students in those programs fairly narrow timelines to complete their degrees, or roll things into the Master's track. As an FYI, the 5-year master's is just code for taking 2 summer semesters, effectively knocking a year of real-time out of the program, but still taking on the same load/economic burden. Don't get to wrapped up in getting things done as fast as possible, architecture education will burn you out if you haven't discovered that already, it's best to take your time.
Yes, that is another factor I am taking into account by going for an accredited B. Arch program I do not want to be burned out at the end of my undergraduate program with an unaccredited degree and not have the motivation to pursue a masters degree.