So he isn't new at this. He runs a successful small business and does a lot of real estate on the side. He is looking to buy a property for around 600k and to build for 600k in the central New Jersey area. It just so happens that I am looking to apply to architecture m.arch programs and just starting working on my portfolio (only a college sophomore). I am good with software like Sketchup, Rhino, Maxwell Rending Suite and any Adobe software. I have good intuition regarding aesthetics. I will definitely work with him and write on my resume that I co-managed a real estate project - but what can I do for my portfolio? Can I observe the surrounding buildings, find some related floor plans, design and render my own version on Sketchup and pass it off to a licensed architect? Then I could put both the renderings and an ACTUAL FRIKKEN BUILDING THAT I DESIGNED in my portfolio. Or am I thinking over my head here?
MinimalCrazy
May 17, 16 1:14 am
Since you are technically the client, I wonder if you can just co-design with the architect. How are New Jersey building laws? Do you even need an architect for your building size? You couls hire an engineer to sign off and be the sole designser if you are as good as you say. Personally I think It would be cool if you put some sketches of your initial design thought process, then figured out how to build it in details, then have photos of you either building a portion or prototype of the building. Also explaining your thought process of spatial organization amd material selection. Not sure how much materials, etc cost in NJ but around my hometown it takes at least 1mil to get the materials and build an interesting house.
x-jla
May 17, 16 1:25 am
You can design whatever you want. Not sure how nj state laws work, but typically residential does not require an architect. It may require an engineer for certain things. If it does require an architect you may still be able to do the conceptual design and pass it off to an architect for DD, CD... Since your Dads money is on the line though, you shouldn't play around if you do not have the experience! unless he's super rich and dosent care.
archKash
May 17, 16 1:38 am
So since I am new at this, I would definitely be working with an architect. My father told me that on his last project, he copied a floor plan from a building down the street and altered it to his likings and then gave that to an architect to adjust, guide and approve.
JeromeS
May 17, 16 7:27 am
NJ requires an architect for everything, except a homeowner may draw plans for his OWN single family residence.
shellarchitect
May 17, 16 8:57 am
do yo have an undergrad in architecture? Either way I think its a great way to find out how much you don't know about architecture.
You'll want to find a pretty patient architect, as they may see this as a pain in the ass project.
Non Sequitur
May 17, 16 9:10 am
Shuellmi... that's what I'm thinking.
Who would bother to baby-sit a client's kid.
Wilma Buttfit
May 17, 16 9:13 am
non sequitur, what was it like coming out of your mama's womb already an architect? Nobody ever taught you anything? I'm sure someone changed your diapers a time or two.
Non Sequitur
May 17, 16 9:20 am
^I'm just basing this on the OP's previous thread.
I don't think an experienced architect would agree to that type of working relationship.
curtkram
May 17, 16 9:30 am
i think it happens all the time
babysitting a client's kid is different than teaching someone younger. in the teacher-student relationship, it's clear that the teacher is in control. in the teacher-client's kid relationship, if the teacher tries to teach soemthing, the client's kid can just say 'i'm going to do what i want and i'll tell my dad on you.' huge pain in the ass, but then sometimes that's what you have to do to build a relationship and get paid and all that.
Non Sequitur
May 17, 16 9:36 am
perhaps another reason I stay away from residential.
no_form
May 17, 16 10:30 am
"I have good intuition regarding aesthetics."
"he copied a floor plan from a building down the street and altered it to his likings and then gave that to an architect to adjust, guide and approve."
Architects are such pain in the ass. I already have great taste! and the darn gubmint just says I need a stamped drawing because they like to take people's money away!
shellarchitect
May 17, 16 10:46 am
don't know what you dont know, this could be a very good learning experience. not sure how much it helps in terms of grad. applications. Even if you do come up with a sweet ass design (unlikely since you've never done this before) you are still working with an architect and the reviewers will discount accordingly.
accesskb
May 17, 16 11:10 am
some people have it easy.. here I wished my dad would atleast help me with my tuition xD
archKash
May 17, 16 12:04 pm
Ok so Non Sequitur, Shuellmi and curtkram - you are saying that if you were in the same position as me and were looking for resume building opportunities with a hands-on experience you wouldn't do it out of the goodness of your heart? You would feel so bad for the architect for having to work with a client and listen to his design ideas? Obviously he will have the final word and I will take any suggestions he has. But from what I can tell - the client chooses the design and works with the architect over the building. If both my father and an architect say my design sucks- then it sucks. Another point - I hear so many architects complain that architecture programs fall short in teaching hands-on, real-world applications. Wouldn't this be a perfect experience for the experience?
shellarchitect
May 17, 16 12:21 pm
It sounds like you dad has worked with at least one architect before. If so, that existing relationship could make a big difference.
I've never done sfr before, the whole process sounds like a pain to me, lots of hand holding, client disagreements, and opinion changes seem likely. Maybe someone accustomed to that process would see your help as something they are used to.
i also think you should start designing now, regardless of if something happens with an architect.
x-jla
May 17, 16 12:27 pm
If I were you I would absolutely do it. I'm just advising you to know your limits and to be careful since your dads investment is on the line. Also, an architect is required for sfr in NJ? That's crazy! wonder if housing quality is better in nj...my guess is not.
Non Sequitur
May 17, 16 12:34 pm
ArchK, your earlier statements such as this: "he copied a floor plan from a building down the street and altered it to his likings and then gave that to an architect to adjust, guide and approve." Give me cause for concern.
I would need to be fairly-well compensated if I was even in such a situation and honestly, unless there is a significant repeat work attached to the job, I don't see the incentive form the licensed professional's point of view.
There was a time when I was still green and working in a office in-between my studio classes where developers would come in asking for their drawings to be fixed. Every single time if was because they had asked inexperienced students first. Great learning op for me, expensive lesson for the developer.
archKash
May 17, 16 12:43 pm
But thats why you need an architect to adjust, guide and approve. Im not handing my design off to a construction company.
Zbig
May 17, 16 12:45 pm
Normally a client does not design. The architect designs. Sometimes the client's rep is an architect who works for a developer. So we have to make sure that the rep understands that his role is of a client and not an architect. To have a client's rep who is an aspiring architect is a recipe for disaster.
In my opinion, the best way to proceed is to have archKash as a very involved client's rep. He can work together with the architect on the design giving ideas and approvals. But the architect should hold the "pencil".
Non Sequitur
May 17, 16 12:55 pm
"But thats why you need an architect to adjust, guide and approve."
That's why I refer to your situation as baby-sitting. Chances are you'll find someone who takes your father's money and rubber stamps whatever you give them but I would not accept such a misinformed client.
curtkram
May 17, 16 2:02 pm
archKash i think this is a great opportunity for you, and if i were you i would take it. i think it's kind of a horrible opportunity for the architect, and if i were the architect i would lean towards running away from the opportunity. but as with the other posters, i don't work with sfr and have other options open to me.
MinimalCrazy
May 17, 16 8:42 pm
ArchKash, dont worry, an architect will babysit you as long as you have the money to make it worth his/her while. If your dad has sufficient funds then you will be able to have as much involvement as you want.
BulgarBlogger
May 17, 16 9:07 pm
I would never do such a project. Also- schools don't care so much about what you designed or did not design... They want to see your ability to think academically through various types of respresentation
x-jla
May 17, 16 9:24 pm
^ why not?
archKash
May 17, 16 10:16 pm
This is getting harsh. Im not ashamed for asking a question. I have high hopes with architecture and will do what it takes for my portfolio and experience.
no_form
May 17, 16 11:00 pm
archKa$h. So maybe you're some spoiled rich kid. Who cares. Give us the bird and do your project. You'll be fine and it is indeed good experience. Haters am I right?!
archKash
May 17, 16 11:16 pm
Ha ill pass on the bird but some good advise strangely formulated. Basically its good for me, bad for an architect. These forums get heated fast but if a stranger is answering a random question - it must come from a good place. Done. Thanks. Go back to improving our world.
archiwutm8
May 18, 16 3:53 am
"Normally a client does not design. The architect designs" Bullshit.
shellarchitect
May 18, 16 8:21 am
this is pretty mild, normally far worse
Non Sequitur
May 18, 16 8:24 am
yeah, comments here are all pretty damn constructive. Nobody tell Balkarioleschi.
So he isn't new at this. He runs a successful small business and does a lot of real estate on the side. He is looking to buy a property for around 600k and to build for 600k in the central New Jersey area. It just so happens that I am looking to apply to architecture m.arch programs and just starting working on my portfolio (only a college sophomore). I am good with software like Sketchup, Rhino, Maxwell Rending Suite and any Adobe software. I have good intuition regarding aesthetics. I will definitely work with him and write on my resume that I co-managed a real estate project - but what can I do for my portfolio? Can I observe the surrounding buildings, find some related floor plans, design and render my own version on Sketchup and pass it off to a licensed architect? Then I could put both the renderings and an ACTUAL FRIKKEN BUILDING THAT I DESIGNED in my portfolio. Or am I thinking over my head here?
Since you are technically the client, I wonder if you can just co-design with the architect. How are New Jersey building laws? Do you even need an architect for your building size? You couls hire an engineer to sign off and be the sole designser if you are as good as you say. Personally I think It would be cool if you put some sketches of your initial design thought process, then figured out how to build it in details, then have photos of you either building a portion or prototype of the building. Also explaining your thought process of spatial organization amd material selection. Not sure how much materials, etc cost in NJ but around my hometown it takes at least 1mil to get the materials and build an interesting house.
You can design whatever you want. Not sure how nj state laws work, but typically residential does not require an architect. It may require an engineer for certain things. If it does require an architect you may still be able to do the conceptual design and pass it off to an architect for DD, CD... Since your Dads money is on the line though, you shouldn't play around if you do not have the experience! unless he's super rich and dosent care.
So since I am new at this, I would definitely be working with an architect. My father told me that on his last project, he copied a floor plan from a building down the street and altered it to his likings and then gave that to an architect to adjust, guide and approve.
NJ requires an architect for everything, except a homeowner may draw plans for his OWN single family residence.
do yo have an undergrad in architecture? Either way I think its a great way to find out how much you don't know about architecture.
You'll want to find a pretty patient architect, as they may see this as a pain in the ass project.
Shuellmi... that's what I'm thinking.
Who would bother to baby-sit a client's kid.
non sequitur, what was it like coming out of your mama's womb already an architect? Nobody ever taught you anything? I'm sure someone changed your diapers a time or two.
^I'm just basing this on the OP's previous thread.
I don't think an experienced architect would agree to that type of working relationship.
i think it happens all the time
babysitting a client's kid is different than teaching someone younger. in the teacher-student relationship, it's clear that the teacher is in control. in the teacher-client's kid relationship, if the teacher tries to teach soemthing, the client's kid can just say 'i'm going to do what i want and i'll tell my dad on you.' huge pain in the ass, but then sometimes that's what you have to do to build a relationship and get paid and all that.
perhaps another reason I stay away from residential.
"I have good intuition regarding aesthetics."
"he copied a floor plan from a building down the street and altered it to his likings and then gave that to an architect to adjust, guide and approve."
Architects are such pain in the ass. I already have great taste! and the darn gubmint just says I need a stamped drawing because they like to take people's money away!
don't know what you dont know, this could be a very good learning experience. not sure how much it helps in terms of grad. applications. Even if you do come up with a sweet ass design (unlikely since you've never done this before) you are still working with an architect and the reviewers will discount accordingly.
some people have it easy.. here I wished my dad would atleast help me with my tuition xD
Ok so Non Sequitur, Shuellmi and curtkram - you are saying that if you were in the same position as me and were looking for resume building opportunities with a hands-on experience you wouldn't do it out of the goodness of your heart? You would feel so bad for the architect for having to work with a client and listen to his design ideas? Obviously he will have the final word and I will take any suggestions he has. But from what I can tell - the client chooses the design and works with the architect over the building. If both my father and an architect say my design sucks- then it sucks. Another point - I hear so many architects complain that architecture programs fall short in teaching hands-on, real-world applications. Wouldn't this be a perfect experience for the experience?
It sounds like you dad has worked with at least one architect before. If so, that existing relationship could make a big difference.
I've never done sfr before, the whole process sounds like a pain to me, lots of hand holding, client disagreements, and opinion changes seem likely. Maybe someone accustomed to that process would see your help as something they are used to.
i also think you should start designing now, regardless of if something happens with an architect.
If I were you I would absolutely do it. I'm just advising you to know your limits and to be careful since your dads investment is on the line. Also, an architect is required for sfr in NJ? That's crazy! wonder if housing quality is better in nj...my guess is not.
ArchK, your earlier statements such as this: "he copied a floor plan from a building down the street and altered it to his likings and then gave that to an architect to adjust, guide and approve." Give me cause for concern.
I would need to be fairly-well compensated if I was even in such a situation and honestly, unless there is a significant repeat work attached to the job, I don't see the incentive form the licensed professional's point of view.
There was a time when I was still green and working in a office in-between my studio classes where developers would come in asking for their drawings to be fixed. Every single time if was because they had asked inexperienced students first. Great learning op for me, expensive lesson for the developer.
But thats why you need an architect to adjust, guide and approve. Im not handing my design off to a construction company.
Normally a client does not design. The architect designs. Sometimes the client's rep is an architect who works for a developer. So we have to make sure that the rep understands that his role is of a client and not an architect. To have a client's rep who is an aspiring architect is a recipe for disaster.
In my opinion, the best way to proceed is to have archKash as a very involved client's rep. He can work together with the architect on the design giving ideas and approvals. But the architect should hold the "pencil".
"But thats why you need an architect to adjust, guide and approve."
That's why I refer to your situation as baby-sitting. Chances are you'll find someone who takes your father's money and rubber stamps whatever you give them but I would not accept such a misinformed client.
archKash i think this is a great opportunity for you, and if i were you i would take it. i think it's kind of a horrible opportunity for the architect, and if i were the architect i would lean towards running away from the opportunity. but as with the other posters, i don't work with sfr and have other options open to me.
ArchKash, dont worry, an architect will babysit you as long as you have the money to make it worth his/her while. If your dad has sufficient funds then you will be able to have as much involvement as you want.
I would never do such a project. Also- schools don't care so much about what you designed or did not design... They want to see your ability to think academically through various types of respresentation
^ why not?
This is getting harsh. Im not ashamed for asking a question. I have high hopes with architecture and will do what it takes for my portfolio and experience.
archKa$h. So maybe you're some spoiled rich kid. Who cares. Give us the bird and do your project. You'll be fine and it is indeed good experience. Haters am I right?!
Ha ill pass on the bird but some good advise strangely formulated. Basically its good for me, bad for an architect. These forums get heated fast but if a stranger is answering a random question - it must come from a good place. Done. Thanks. Go back to improving our world.
"Normally a client does not design. The architect designs" Bullshit.
this is pretty mild, normally far worse
yeah, comments here are all pretty damn constructive. Nobody tell Balkarioleschi.