I'm a high school senior in the US, and I'm nearing the point in my life where I'll have to choose which college to spend the next 4/5 years of my life in.
Anyway, so far I've heard back from UIC, UIUC, SAIC, Cal Poly SLO, IIT, and USC. The reason I've narrowed it down to IIT and USC is that both schools have offered me a full ride - that is, IIT offered me their Crown Scholarship, and I recently interviewed at USC, and from what I heard my chances for getting the full scholarship are pretty good. (For reference, I've also applied to Pratt, Columbia, Rice, WUSTL, Cornell, Cooper Union, and RISD, but I'm not counting on much from any of those. There's also the issue with IIT demanding that I commit by April 1 if I want the scholarship.)
I've heard that IIT is more practical whereas USC is more conceptual, but does attending IIT really constrict your creativity? I also grew up in Chicago and never bothered to get a driver's license because I can get anywhere using public transportation, and whenever I visit LA I feel like it might be difficult to get anywhere without a car (although the students at USC assured me otherwise). On the other hand, visiting LA and experiencing sunny weather in the 80s in February almost made me cry when I came back home to sub-freezing snow flurries... Then again, I had kind of a bad (but hilarious) first impression of USC's studios - apparently they were fumigating part of the building, so all the cockroaches kept scuttling out of the vents & cracks in the wall while we were there...
So assuming it would cost about the same to attend both schools, which would better prepare me for a career as an architect & possibly open up more opportunities at more firms? Since only one student gets the Crown Scholarship at IIT every year, would that make it easier to land internships while I'm at school?
Any input would be appreciated!
Josh Mings
Feb 28, 16 7:38 pm
Well, do you want to stay in Chicago after you graduate? If so I'd recommend IIT since it is very connected with the architecture community here.
On the other side, I left the Midwest for school, only to return (somewhat, I'm from Indiana) and highly recommend it.
In a nutshell do what feels right for you. You get out of school what you put into it. School name can help you get a foot in the door, but it's what you personally bring that will get you a job.
Driko
Feb 28, 16 9:43 pm
Between the two i would say usc. I know IIT is ranked higher for their 5yr program but the campus is pretty depressing and as cool as it sounds to have studio in a meis building I bet it gets really cluttered and cold there during the winter. I feel USC has a better school reputation and I have a few friends there now that seem to be doing exciting work.
Leandro Llorente
Feb 29, 16 12:22 am
I think you're deciding between two good schools so there is no right or wrong if you decide on whichever.
But if you have a chance to NOT to proceed with Architecture, please do not.
ivorykeyboard
Mar 1, 16 10:39 am
I got into USC and IIT as well, I didnt end up going to either, but my impression from now living in Chicago is that IIT is definitely up and coming. They are hiring some solid faculty. Qingyun Ma is a great dean, but I think USC peaked several years back. IIT isnt as mies/modernist heavy as people think they are. also, I wouldn't trust any school that says you will get a full ride unless you get an explicit offer stating that. a full ride is HUGE... I graduated with no debt because of a large scholarship - I highly recommend the no debt route. it makes for a much better life.
bundy
Mar 1, 16 5:38 pm
Take the scholarship money but get out of Architecture. It will not exist as viable profession ten years from now. I say this in all sincerity. Get an MBA or one of the development program degrees because they will be far more beneficial.
ivorykeyboard
Mar 1, 16 8:01 pm
^ Why are you here?
midlander
Mar 2, 16 12:20 am
Creativity is what you make of the resources at hand. It's a manifestation of your personality and not really something a school feeds to you, though some will sell you on the idea that they can do that. Some people flourish in very open-ended environments - others need a more rigorously structured program as a foundation for creative growth.
I graduated from IIT back when Trump was just an angry man with a TV show, and I didn't find it nearly so rigorously technical as people still believe. At the time I couldn't tell whether it was a good program, but a few years into my career I find myself well-prepared for what I want to do. I've moved around a bit since then, and run into more IIT alumni than I would have expected, many doing quite well.
I've never met or worked with anyone from USC, so no comment on that. Maybe LA is so nice no one ever leaves?
Anyway, I think if you focus in school and make sure to learn useful skills, either school will give you opportunities as an architect. Be aware that studying architecture probably limits your opportunities more than most majors, so only do so if you're strongly convinced it's what you will want to do.
bundy
Mar 2, 16 9:43 am
ivorykeyboard, I am here because someone asked a question about education and the profession, seeking guidance on a public forum. I've been a practitioner for 40 years and a firm owner most of those. The one constant has been the shifting responsibility from architect to project manager / owner / owner's rep. The owner has always controlled the purse strings but used to deffer to the architect but today owners are far more sophisticated and frankly do a good job at doing what they set out to do, be it retail, commercial or housing. All schools, not just IIT or USC, are at odds with the very industry they are a part of and have been for 30 years. The building industry has moved on without them. You dont have to listen to me but listen to Midlander when they say, "Be aware that studying architecture probably limits your opportunities more than most majors, so only do so if you're strongly convinced it's what you will want to do". The degree in architecture is ultimately not very valuable to anyone anymore. I'm still getting resumes every single day, from grads and experienced managers which tells me the "recovery" in architecture is way over estimated. It hurts but its the truth, its the new english major. You'd be far more dangerous as an engineer with an MBA, a true double double threat that could very well own an architecture firm as well as command control your own process.
ivorykeyboard
Mar 2, 16 10:33 am
All schools, not just IIT or USC, are at odds with the very industry they are a part of and have been for 30 years.
Agree. This is getting better at some universities though - see Cal Poly, MIT.
"Be aware that studying architecture probably limits your opportunities more than most majors, so only do so if you're strongly convinced it's what you will want to do"
Disagree. I know architecture majors who have gone on to become software engineers, lawyers, and strategists. If you can excel as a designer, you will have a critical mind in whatever field you pursue.
You'd be far more dangerous as an engineer with an MBA, a true double double threat that could very well own an architecture firm as well as command control your own process.
MBAs are bullshit and overrated these days, maybe not when you were in graduate school. It's much more worthwhile to create a startup in Silicon Valley and fall flat on your face than pay 65k a year for B-school+1. Most of my finance colleagues say that experience at a solid financial institution trumps paper.
legopiece
Mar 4, 16 5:20 am
Go to california and get wild and crazy!
nesquik
Mar 10, 16 10:19 pm
Thanks for the input, everyone!
I am a little confused, though. I've been scrolling through the forum and I can't help but notice that an awful lot of Archinect users seem to be trying their best to convince everyone to stay out of architecture... What's up with that?
Driko
Mar 11, 16 2:39 pm
@NESQUIK
1) money: its hard to make a good amount. The unemployment rate is higher than average in architecture. the job outlook (growth) went from 15% for 2010-2014 to 7% for 2014 to 2024 and the current number for jobs for the title architect are 112,600 and the growth number is 7,800. So take a look at how many people graduate a year with a B.Arch or an M.Arch. If you dont want to be a licensed architect then dont get a professional degree and stick with a B.S. in Architecture or some related field. you will either save one year of your undergraduate tuition or avoid grad school tuition rates.
2) you don't really design. Its long hours of details and making schedules. You don't really work with a team to tackle a problem until you have more than a few years experience given that you can either get a promotion or a new job. Schools always push the flashy side of architecture (the design, the research, the theory) but the reality is people want a building to be as cost effective as possible. yes there is some design to make it aesthetic but count the number for buildings in any city that are notable works of architecture vs the number of "poor design" buildings.
3) Work/life balance. You will hear something along the lines in architecture school where they will say the people in this profession are passionate about what we do/ architecture is your life so going to work doesn't feel like work, the "do what you love" kind of bs. While you are away at work your friends in college will be at parties and picking up hobbies. They will then graduate making much more than you will working better hours with better benefits.
Architecture offices more often than not are not ideal work environments. I hear some a good and pay well but i left the profession and opted out of grad school when taking finances in to consideration. I like to come back to this website to see what has changed in architecture and follow it because i put it behind me as a hobby and i think most people who warn other have done the same.
I would say though some of my friends are still in the field and they say they like it. One of my friends is a BIM manager at Adrian Smith and hes making a good living for his age but he is the BIM manager and not an architect. so there are things that are enjoyable in architecture and there are other things you can do with an Arch degree.
Hi, Archinect!
I'm a high school senior in the US, and I'm nearing the point in my life where I'll have to choose which college to spend the next 4/5 years of my life in.
Anyway, so far I've heard back from UIC, UIUC, SAIC, Cal Poly SLO, IIT, and USC. The reason I've narrowed it down to IIT and USC is that both schools have offered me a full ride - that is, IIT offered me their Crown Scholarship, and I recently interviewed at USC, and from what I heard my chances for getting the full scholarship are pretty good. (For reference, I've also applied to Pratt, Columbia, Rice, WUSTL, Cornell, Cooper Union, and RISD, but I'm not counting on much from any of those. There's also the issue with IIT demanding that I commit by April 1 if I want the scholarship.)
I've heard that IIT is more practical whereas USC is more conceptual, but does attending IIT really constrict your creativity? I also grew up in Chicago and never bothered to get a driver's license because I can get anywhere using public transportation, and whenever I visit LA I feel like it might be difficult to get anywhere without a car (although the students at USC assured me otherwise). On the other hand, visiting LA and experiencing sunny weather in the 80s in February almost made me cry when I came back home to sub-freezing snow flurries... Then again, I had kind of a bad (but hilarious) first impression of USC's studios - apparently they were fumigating part of the building, so all the cockroaches kept scuttling out of the vents & cracks in the wall while we were there...
So assuming it would cost about the same to attend both schools, which would better prepare me for a career as an architect & possibly open up more opportunities at more firms? Since only one student gets the Crown Scholarship at IIT every year, would that make it easier to land internships while I'm at school?
Any input would be appreciated!
Well, do you want to stay in Chicago after you graduate? If so I'd recommend IIT since it is very connected with the architecture community here.
On the other side, I left the Midwest for school, only to return (somewhat, I'm from Indiana) and highly recommend it.
In a nutshell do what feels right for you. You get out of school what you put into it. School name can help you get a foot in the door, but it's what you personally bring that will get you a job.
Between the two i would say usc. I know IIT is ranked higher for their 5yr program but the campus is pretty depressing and as cool as it sounds to have studio in a meis building I bet it gets really cluttered and cold there during the winter. I feel USC has a better school reputation and I have a few friends there now that seem to be doing exciting work.
I think you're deciding between two good schools so there is no right or wrong if you decide on whichever.
But if you have a chance to NOT to proceed with Architecture, please do not.
I got into USC and IIT as well, I didnt end up going to either, but my impression from now living in Chicago is that IIT is definitely up and coming. They are hiring some solid faculty. Qingyun Ma is a great dean, but I think USC peaked several years back. IIT isnt as mies/modernist heavy as people think they are. also, I wouldn't trust any school that says you will get a full ride unless you get an explicit offer stating that. a full ride is HUGE... I graduated with no debt because of a large scholarship - I highly recommend the no debt route. it makes for a much better life.
Take the scholarship money but get out of Architecture. It will not exist as viable profession ten years from now. I say this in all sincerity. Get an MBA or one of the development program degrees because they will be far more beneficial.
^ Why are you here?
Creativity is what you make of the resources at hand. It's a manifestation of your personality and not really something a school feeds to you, though some will sell you on the idea that they can do that. Some people flourish in very open-ended environments - others need a more rigorously structured program as a foundation for creative growth.
I graduated from IIT back when Trump was just an angry man with a TV show, and I didn't find it nearly so rigorously technical as people still believe. At the time I couldn't tell whether it was a good program, but a few years into my career I find myself well-prepared for what I want to do. I've moved around a bit since then, and run into more IIT alumni than I would have expected, many doing quite well.
I've never met or worked with anyone from USC, so no comment on that. Maybe LA is so nice no one ever leaves?
Anyway, I think if you focus in school and make sure to learn useful skills, either school will give you opportunities as an architect. Be aware that studying architecture probably limits your opportunities more than most majors, so only do so if you're strongly convinced it's what you will want to do.
ivorykeyboard, I am here because someone asked a question about education and the profession, seeking guidance on a public forum. I've been a practitioner for 40 years and a firm owner most of those. The one constant has been the shifting responsibility from architect to project manager / owner / owner's rep. The owner has always controlled the purse strings but used to deffer to the architect but today owners are far more sophisticated and frankly do a good job at doing what they set out to do, be it retail, commercial or housing. All schools, not just IIT or USC, are at odds with the very industry they are a part of and have been for 30 years. The building industry has moved on without them. You dont have to listen to me but listen to Midlander when they say, "Be aware that studying architecture probably limits your opportunities more than most majors, so only do so if you're strongly convinced it's what you will want to do". The degree in architecture is ultimately not very valuable to anyone anymore. I'm still getting resumes every single day, from grads and experienced managers which tells me the "recovery" in architecture is way over estimated. It hurts but its the truth, its the new english major. You'd be far more dangerous as an engineer with an MBA, a true double double threat that could very well own an architecture firm as well as command control your own process.
All schools, not just IIT or USC, are at odds with the very industry they are a part of and have been for 30 years.
Agree. This is getting better at some universities though - see Cal Poly, MIT.
"Be aware that studying architecture probably limits your opportunities more than most majors, so only do so if you're strongly convinced it's what you will want to do"
Disagree. I know architecture majors who have gone on to become software engineers, lawyers, and strategists. If you can excel as a designer, you will have a critical mind in whatever field you pursue.
You'd be far more dangerous as an engineer with an MBA, a true double double threat that could very well own an architecture firm as well as command control your own process.
MBAs are bullshit and overrated these days, maybe not when you were in graduate school. It's much more worthwhile to create a startup in Silicon Valley and fall flat on your face than pay 65k a year for B-school+1. Most of my finance colleagues say that experience at a solid financial institution trumps paper.
Go to california and get wild and crazy!
Thanks for the input, everyone!
I am a little confused, though. I've been scrolling through the forum and I can't help but notice that an awful lot of Archinect users seem to be trying their best to convince everyone to stay out of architecture... What's up with that?
@NESQUIK
1) money: its hard to make a good amount. The unemployment rate is higher than average in architecture. the job outlook (growth) went from 15% for 2010-2014 to 7% for 2014 to 2024 and the current number for jobs for the title architect are 112,600 and the growth number is 7,800. So take a look at how many people graduate a year with a B.Arch or an M.Arch. If you dont want to be a licensed architect then dont get a professional degree and stick with a B.S. in Architecture or some related field. you will either save one year of your undergraduate tuition or avoid grad school tuition rates.
2) you don't really design. Its long hours of details and making schedules. You don't really work with a team to tackle a problem until you have more than a few years experience given that you can either get a promotion or a new job. Schools always push the flashy side of architecture (the design, the research, the theory) but the reality is people want a building to be as cost effective as possible. yes there is some design to make it aesthetic but count the number for buildings in any city that are notable works of architecture vs the number of "poor design" buildings.
3) Work/life balance. You will hear something along the lines in architecture school where they will say the people in this profession are passionate about what we do/ architecture is your life so going to work doesn't feel like work, the "do what you love" kind of bs. While you are away at work your friends in college will be at parties and picking up hobbies. They will then graduate making much more than you will working better hours with better benefits.
Architecture offices more often than not are not ideal work environments. I hear some a good and pay well but i left the profession and opted out of grad school when taking finances in to consideration. I like to come back to this website to see what has changed in architecture and follow it because i put it behind me as a hobby and i think most people who warn other have done the same.
I would say though some of my friends are still in the field and they say they like it. One of my friends is a BIM manager at Adrian Smith and hes making a good living for his age but he is the BIM manager and not an architect. so there are things that are enjoyable in architecture and there are other things you can do with an Arch degree.