Yeah, well, you know, that's just like, uh, your opinion, man.

its all down to what you make of your education. where do you want to be and what type of design work are you interested in?

as for firms, the most significant being KieranTimberlake, where the 2 principals are Penn alumni. the most significant projects from them were the cellophane house displayed at MOMA in 2008 and the more recently announced US embassy in London.

Ali Rahim, Cecil Balmond, Kieran + timberlake, that lady from SOM, etc. arent big names? I'd like to know who you consider 'big'.

This thread is ranked as the number one most annoying archinect thread about grad school.

you also have winka dubbeldam, enrique norten, and marion weiss.

alumni: eugene kohn from KPF

you'll find find penn alumni in all the big firms across the country.

i dont know why anyone would think this is an annoying thread. its a legitimate question, especially since both are really great schools, and actually pretty similar (in my eyes). the reality is that ivy vs state status DOES matter, whether you want to admit it or not.

i've been speaking to a lot of people recently to get input about where i should go myself, and i was speaking to a architecutre critic/writer a few days ago who said he hands down believes that ucla is the best program in socal. that said, if you want to work in socal, ucla is a great place to graduate from. and its obviously cheap(er). but i think the penn name and network will help you pretty much forever and wherever you are. like tuff said, youll find penn alum all over the country. and to get to the snooty ivy part of it, it doesnt matter if you're "ivy" material or not....when you graduate from those schools, you can join their clubs, which have extension and reciprocal clubs across the WORLD, and just being at those clubs is enough of a network to either get you clients or jobs. its a serious consideration.

i was at penn yesterday and i was actually really impressed by the school. i like the layout of the department and the studios, and everyone was extremely nice. the students were all helpful, the studio environment was nurturing and not stressful, and the shop was nice. the cat at the shop said that to use the laser cutters and what not is not a big deal, no huge waiting lists or anything. and a student said the crits are actually HELPFUL and not destructive. she also said that its lax enough that they will go get burgers and beer the night before a review and still be ok. plus, penn is just simply beautiful.

im from LA and am not blown away by the facilities at UCLA. its a nice school and a great program, but i need a good studio environment, and theres just kinda sucks...no personality. my favorite part of ucla is the faculty, and i was excited by the prospect of studying with mayne and what not, but i had a conversation a few weeks ago with an architect who got his second degree at ucla, and he basically said, mayne is a great guy, great architect and a great critic, but as a professor, not so much. to get a good grade, you basically gotta design like he would. he knew a guy who went through a morphosis book, basically took the concepts for his mayne studio, mayne loved it and gave him an A....lame. so i dont know, all food for thought. this was long....

@ jive, are you post-prof (m.archII)?

nope, first prof, m.arch I, no background.

sorry , I don't mean to be a dick..I just mess with people who think rankings matter.

A career in Architecture takes courage and stamina and audacity...not rankings and status...get over it.

Generally speaking most schools at this level are relatively the same if you are a hard working student, imho. ..and remember having the opportunity to go to school for three years in this economy is way better than working shitty jobs or worse not finding one...so be happy you get to go at all...

I am at UCLA , if you have questions let me know..but all your pros and cons are vague assumptions on your part.

p.s. don't look at the UCLA website if you want to know about our work.....the site is not a reflection of what really happens here.

ah perfect, so chime in on ucla! how do you feel about the studio environment? and the faculty...

but youre right, arch schools seems to be about stamina without a doubt, and these schools really are about the same as far as quality of the school, students and faculty, rankings dont mean shit.

The studios are a little decrepit, I know...but the campus is beautiful.

see...
http://www.archinect.com/forum/threads.php?id=92997_0_42_0_C

...as for the Faculty...I think they have been very good...I have written on here before..with people like Roberge and Payne, Denari, Sotomaa, Lavin, Predock.....I have absolutely no complaints...its all cutting edge...

....if you want to know about some of the Theoretical currents happening here....check out...http://www.amazon.com/Log-17-Cynthia-Davidson-editor/dp/0981553451

Penn is a distinguished school so I don't fthink that "con" valid. If you're looking that the alumni list, SCI-Arc hasn't put anyone out on the level of GSAPP, Princeton etc. however I understand that it is still on par with the aforementioned. Alumni wise, Cornell is probably behind Sci-Arc and not sure about Yale. (Just knocking out all the Ivy's.)