Aguacate,

If we assume your source (professor w. 15 years of admissions experience) is given a 90% accurarcy value and what you have said is not a rumor (since the first post on this thread supposes "mythical" dimensions to said criteria); then those those applicants who do not meet all the requirements should be disqualified automatically.

If your source has a conflicting view with the majority of admissions panels for top ten schools in 2010 (things might have changed such as admissions panel profiles in the last 15 years and unofficial changes in attitudes towards GPA, GRE scores, etc.), then what you say does not hold any water.

Can't be 100% sure.

Are rejection letters sent out before acceptance letters?

How will we know if we are disqualified automatically?

hey Agua, thanks for the inside info! but it's made me quite depressed that they wont appreciated my scrapbook of mr. miffles.

Top Ten Reasons for Applying to Graduate School in 2010:

10. You messed up in undergrad
9. Your job sucks
8. You are unemployed
7. You couldn't get into medical school
6. You like the cachet of having the degree on your resume
5. You want people to overrate you just because
4. You like to follow in the footsteps of your professors, even though you have no idea what you'll be doing in grad school
3. You're an elitist and this proves you're better than everyone else
2. Your friend is applying
1. You took the 'stay in school' tv ads to the next level

hw10 is right, about admissions fluctuating greatly from year to year based on the different priorities of each committee member, but I think the basic fact of having a filter for applicants is generally accurate. Think about it, would a ~8 person committee bother to peruse 1000+ files? There is at least one competitive program employing this common method this year... but since this school views files digitally, it's actually easier to pass portfolios around and have more professors' eyes see them before the decision rounds. Hope that helps.

zoon, I can't pretend to be an authority on any of this. I'm sorry... but you know, crappiness is all relative, and you've probably done better than you think. We all get stuck in our heads a little and worry about things that may not matter, in the end. I cannot say for sure what the cutoffs are, but MAMBO is right, the very competitive programs do appear to have unofficial numbers. From what I've seen on these threads and from what I know about my friends who were successful applicants, you should be fine in general if you're around a 3.0 GPA and 500 on each GRE section.

Though, wasn't there a girl from China who got into the GSD with a 280 verbal? Ergo, a strong portfolio can definitely cover a multitude of other academic sins, and since we cannot read the admission committee's collective mind... there's nothing productive we can do about it now. Who knows, maybe the photos of Mr. Miffles did charm the pants off everyone! :p I hear drinking can help to pass the time; the first thing I did after mailing my last submission package was to scarf down a shameful amount of cheese and cheap red wine...

I do wish the schools were a bit more transparent about their process though. The GSAPP was great about stating the 450 verbal minimum, and even though it might have dissuaded otherwise strong applicants... it saved people from wasting time and money. Does anyone else feel a little nauseous just looking at bank statements after paying for application fees, scores, transcripts, rush printing and overnighting?

Done. My wallet is substantially lighter now but I feel confident it will be worth it. I am extremely uncomfortable with the lack of control I have now, but I have to live with it.

Good luck to everyone, may we all be granted admission.

Waiting for two months... it really makes me uneasy. I'm working on design for a competition, but can't really concentrate on it.

Aguacate,

Your references of a initial weed out by a schools general admissions committee is incorrect. Generally, the only time a general admissions committee even exists is mainly (not exclusively) at public universities. Having been through grad school and having direct conversations with friends / professors on the committees, your entire application package arrives and sits within the grad school...you should see the registrars office around application deadlines, it looks like the post office back of house...the universities central admissions department will simple hold on to your file and wait for either a recommendation to accept or reject and applicant. At that point they will run you background to make sure you aren't a felon or something like that...

In the case of people with a background in arch. you portfolio is hands down the weight carrying item, followed by your personal statement. It's really only in the case where a committee is getting down to the last number of people they want to admit where they will compare GRE's and letters of recommendation.

Overall it really a subjective process and sometimes you have to get lucky that the professor who picks up your portfolio likes it, because from what I've learned, on average only a couple professors look at a given portfolio, and sometimes a grad student member on the committee....you have to remember that this is extra curricular for them, they are still teaching their classes and/or running departments and/or running a practice, and/or meeting the needs of their family.

Oh, and the GSD and the other Ivys do call you when you get accepted.

And a bit of advice for those of you who wind up on a wait list to your top choice, don't be a nuisance but get in touch with the director of the admissions committee, send them an email that you appreciate being in the upper ranks of people the considered and let them know that you are still very interested in their program and to please consider you if a space becomes available. Showing initiative can go a long way at that point. I know it worked for a couple of friends at mine back when we were all applying.

Good luck all.

tagalong:
"When",
as in "around the same time",
or as in "at the same time as other notifications, i.e. significantly after actual acceptance"
?

A lot of schools wont even get into their hard core looking through applicants until spring break, hence, why most people start finding out in mid to late march.

In my case the calls came before the acceptance stuff in the mail. But it was still in March.

"Because of the unpredictable weather patterns, the Doldrums became notorious with sailors because this region's periods of deadly calm could trap ships for days or weeks on end as they waited for enough wind to power their sails."

Buck up sailors, it's going to be a long couple of months if we continue to speculate on what may or may not be going on with our apps. They're in, it's out of our hands now, what are people going to do in the meantime? Anyone working on anything cool?

Thank you tagalong, I'm so glad to be proven wrong! I guess what I was told was mostly about the specific process for one program. Apologies for scaring everyone. Good luck all, I'll check back in a couple months... this thread is getting hopelessly addictive and it's time to put it behind me for the moment.

I'm looking at the stats and the admissions rate is about 10% for most Ivies... If the program admits 80, that's 720 applicants who don't get admitted. It's safe to say the odds are against us; for every admit there are nine rejections.

If you applied, I'm guessing you knew that you risked being rejected and your chances of getting in was about 10%.

I hope I get in.

Applying to Ivies takes some courage; you're up against daunting odds and you put yourself (and your reputation) on the line. No Guts, No Glory... Best of luck.

This is my second year applying. I was waitlisted at a couple places last year and then didn't end up getting in. Is anyone else on here not going through their first attempt at applications? I feel more prepared this year but am still nervous about the outcome as I've heard that the applicant number has increased from last year. Good luck to everyone on their applications.

stitch,
I didn't apply last year, but I did apply two years ago. That was the first year out of my undergraduate architecture degree. I applied to yale, gsd, uva, and princeton. Was rejected from all. I went back and looked at my application and felt that I applied with a sense of entitlement/cockiness. I had a phenominal recommendation from one of the world's leading theorists. I thought my design work was untouchable. I was in the top 5 of my graduating class. There was no way they wouldnt accept me. None of that mattered. There's something beyond all that. You need to apply with passion, and if you dont, I think they can sense that.

This year I applied to 12, yes 12, schools. They were all schools I am really interested in and none did I apply to for "the name". Unfortunatley, alot of my motive for the first go around was "name brand". The only repeat was GSD, but that was only because they make it easy to reapply. I actually dont like GSD's program and am the least excited about it. With all that said, I am very nervous that I will not get into any of my schools, or only my safety (Maryland). But I feel I at least apporched this round with much more of a nuanced/responsible eye. But it was a painfully expensive, time consuming, and agonizing experience. I dont know if I can do it again. Hopefully I just get into one non "safety". I have my fingers crossed for MIT or Rice.

goodluck!

Here's a mystery for you all...

I got an email from USC stating that someone had mistakenly faxed them a letter of Rec, instead of UCLA.

I've just contacted both of my recommenders, and both insist they sent theirs to the proper place! And the person at USC said they they threw away the faxes after they'd notified me.

What to do?

--

About the length discussion- honestly, I think quality is apparent early on. Hirano's portfolio's wonderful for its breathing space... nothing felt cramped. If they only manage to look at 20 pages out of the 150, versus 20 out of 20 from somebody else's, I think they'll still see what a remarkable student he is.

villain until i read your last comment , i was happy with my applications.

why? my main point was don't waste your time/money if you're not passionate about it. I lacked full passion my first go around, and I feel that showed and hurt me in my apps. as long as your heart's in it, you should be fine

The Villain- what attracts you to Rice? I applied there, too, along with GSAPP and UCLA.

I have a number of classmates that went there and absolutely love it, along with getting lots of fellowship money. it also segways well from the theory-heavy undergrad education I had. I like the size. I like Sarah Whiting. I'm interested in Houston as a sort of "regulation-free" built environment. It just has a really nice feel to it.

I also applied to ucla and gsapp

Villain,

I feel the same way as you about my applications last year. I feel that I wasn't fully dedicated to my applications as I was still finishing my undergraduate thesis while compiling my grad school portfolio. I feel more confident about my work this time around but I don't wanna get ahead of myself and assume that I will make it on that factor alone.

Hi All,

I've been a reader and non-contributor to this thread for a long time. I am nearing the end of this grueling process and now that I feel like I can breathe, I want to wish everyone the best of luck!

Hey everyone,

I have been doing my homework and reading up on the thread and there's some great info here. Just a few comments....

Just finished my 3 year M. Arch degree (so if anyone has needs advice or has general questions I might be able to help)

I've actually applied to several urban design programs (GSAPP, GSD, Berkeley) mainly because my projects have been headed in that direction, and I am passionate about the urban dynamic and how it will be rapidly evolving....but also because it's times are tough out there.

Aguacate, and tagalong

thanks for the insight into what these places are doing while we sweat.

I agree that your work and SOI needs to exude passion. I chose to visit only Columbia and had a great experience. I spoke with Richard Plunz, the director of the program and asked as many questions as I could because I wanted them to know how interested and excited I was.

Berkeley is a total pain with the 12 page 1 sided porfolio and 2 different sets of applications!

anyway....just thought I'd chime in. carry on.

apparently most schools haven't started looking at their apps yet

i'm expecting them to start sometime next month

Villain,

Damn you! Maryland is my top choice! Hey, remember way bank when I said, "damn you"? I didn't mean it.

Seriously though, I thought your post was well said. Good luck to you at your top choices. I'm wondering if you'd mind sharing your SOP with me? I'd like to see what another applicant wrote about the program I'm most interested in.

Also, anyone on here reading the negative and positive thread on gradcafe? Pretty funny. During the app process my confidence about whether I'll get in or not seemed to vary every week; One week I would feel like I'm definitely getting in and the next week I would feel like I'm definitely not getting in. Now that my apps are submitted it seems to change hourly. This is going to be a long six to nine weeks.

back, not bank. Damn it.

ha! "safety" is the wrong word to use for any of these schools. it's just easier to say that instead of "program I'm not as interested in but can get instate/is near family/etc.". Maryland's a fine program, just has a traditionalism I'm not all that into. plus I can't stand the DC area much longer.

it's probably my worst SOP, but if you email me I'll send it to you.

Hello all,

I'll be applying this winter to

-Helsinki University of Technology (now Aalto University)
-Royal Danish Academy of Fine Arts
-T.U. Delft

Just wondering if anyone has useful (or not) information about the key differences between the programs at these schools/ If anyone has attended I would be curious to know what sort of experiences they had both for application process and studying?

feels good to be done with the applications nightmare, time to chill!
my school list for post professional programs:

ysoa
gsd
rice (option 3)
upenn

good luck all and thanks for answering every question i had on this, whether i asked or not, i guess we're all just as paranoid when it comes to deadlines, portfolios, recs .. etc
:)

so how is everyone handling the great wait? anyone have any coping mechanisms that are worth sharing? my patience is nearly depleted.

that said, i'm fully aware it's basically useless to ask for people's thoughts on my portfolio at this point, but i'm still curious to see what others think outside of my own circle of friends and coworkers. take a look. make sure you view it in "presentation mode" because I exported the pdf as spreads, not individual pages.

http://issuu.com/cgkeech/docs/final_marchii_general

thanks, everyone.

I don't know if this will help others in a similar position as I, but here's something that just strengthened my application immensely.

I, like at least a few others on here, had a very bad first two years at school, culminating in academic dismissal. I came back, and nailed the whole thing, but barely got my GPA back above 3.0 before applying to Berkeley (their minimum level). Whatever, I think, I have a satisfying portfolio, good LORs, above average GRE, I should be fine.

And then my girlfriend found this "Academic Bankruptcy" policy at our college, saying that I could have converted my pre-dismissal units to transfer credit (no effect on GPA) if I had applied at readmission. I talked to the registrar earlier this week, and since I wasn't ever told by the school about academic bankruptcy, I was able to file for it late. I now have a 3.9, which sets me up to graduate summa cum laude and possibly Phi Beta Kappa.

Anyone else that screwed up and got dismissed should see if their school has a similar policy. The one downside is that any classes less than a C- get dropped as credit, so if you're squeaking by the credit requirement for graduation, make sure everything will still be gravy if you file for academic bankruptcy.

cgkeech very cool work. i like that the process is just as interesting as the end result for each project. usually it's either or. what schools are you applying to?

Sweet deal NLW, but I would beware, apparently grad schools don't have to take your university's word on what your GPA is. At my school, UW-Milwaukee, they don't use your undergrad GPA, they recalculate it themselves based on the transcripts you send them. They include transfer credits, and repeated courses, every course you've ever taken. Since I did transfer schools, and had a bad 3rd year in arch school that I had to repeat some classes for, the grad school subtracted 0.6 from my undergrad GPA, which sucks. Makes me wonder why I even bothered to try to get better grades, when it ends up not even mattering.

If you were applying to UWM, your GPA would be 3.0, or below that, if you ever repeated a course. Might want to ask Berkeley how their system works.

Berkeley focuses on the last two years, so for them it was a 3.9 all along. I guess my excitement was based more on the fact that my current college looks at me differently now that those bad grades don't count.

And I'm very lucky not to be applying to UWM, they'd do quite a number on me.

@zoon _

GSAPP, UPenn, UCLA, YSOA, GSD. Lots of reaching going on here.

I appreciate the positive feedback. i tried to narrow the focus of each project down to something very simple and distinct, even if that meant excluding the final results. the portfolio initially included more architectural drawings, but i edited much of that out, assuming that the evaluators have seen plenty of floor plans and sections, not to mention this wasn't a job application.

Part of me regrets not applying to more programs, but that ship has clearly sailed. I'm hoping letters and quality of my personal statement keep the folks interested.

bad news guys - for anyone applying to yale:

http://www.yaledailynews.com/news/university-news/2010/01/20/aid-scarce-arch-students/

'Though the school has received more than 1,000 applications for the 65 seats it will offer next fall, beating last year’s record of 989, the school will not be able to increase its financial assistance program because of the budget shortfall, Associate Dean John Jacobson ARC ’70 said. This will leave many students with hefty debts upon graduation.'

its so unproductive doing this kind of speculation.. but still. march/april is such a long way away

cgkeech i totally know what you mean about needing distraction
i've just been watching a lot of tv shows

^ I don't think that should be a valid concern. One is justified in going into architecture if s/he has either sufficient money or significant passion. Either one or the other would be enough to render such news to become non-"bad news". Contrarily, if one has neither and they are rational, then they should choose another path.

I agree that one should not pursue architecture "sans passion" however all the passion in the world does not pay for school. They are separate concerns. And I would hope someone wouldn't be going into architecture just because they have a lot of money.

I agree with voneckht. I've never in my life met someone who has enough money to actually pay their way through arch. school without borrowing (life in middle america!).

Passion and creativity are seriously compromised when you are trapped in debt. You don't have the freedom to take a risk and start your own operation, therefore you will likely end up working in a large firm under a bad boss - at this point, passion is REALLY compromised.

Lower middle class and working poor families seem to produce a lot of strivers who are usually in touch with things like spatial inequality, social context, etc. I'm not saying students who summered in the French Riviera, had vacation homes, or went on ski trips don't have good ideas... but variety is always nice.

There's also this 'thing' that I like to call the black river of rage that flows in the soul: it comes from living in poverty/semi-poverty, spending your childhood in the rust belt, and facing discrimination most days. The black river of rage can either land you in prison, make you into a bitter, disillusioned low-wage worker, or inspire explosive artistic passion!

So F you, YSOA that doesn't offer funding yet requires young people to pay as much as a tiny little house for the privilege of spending one year in your hallowed halls.

Note that I said "passion" by itself is not enough to warrant such news to be bad news, but rather "significant passion". There's a difference there. I define "significant passion" to be a degree of passion that will most likely (>90% chance) result in sufficiently high returns, due to the behavior of the entity that exhibits such passion ("behavior" with regards to architecture).

middleAmerica: "I've never in my life met someone who has enough money to actually pay their way through arch. school without borrowing (life in middle america!)."

Wow, that's very sad. I'm sorry to hear that. For those who lack significant passion and also sufficient money (where "sufficient money" is defined to be an amount from the entity's own hands that would be able to pay for architecture graduate school and still have enough left afterwards for a decent living without having yet gone into a career in architecture), then a good thing to do might be to first gain the sufficient funds through more efficient means (e.g. another, relatively high-paying career, such as law), and preferably a means that you would be sufficiently content to pursue (i.e. a field where you exhibit sufficient passion in, although perhaps not significant passion).

saw student services pushing around apps yesterday at the gsd...

hankd

settle down there with the < >......let's not begin putting percentages on "passion", "significant passion" or any other unquantifiable feeling.


So i'm sure this has been done....but anyone want to share their thoughts on the schools (visited) and why/why not they were compelling?

Is anyone else's UCLA online application status showing that they haven't received anything?

if I don't get funding (and I mean grants not loans) for an March program there's no way I'm going...

my reasons for going to get an March (listed in order from most important to least):
-ability to register for/take the ARE in all states
-means to an end for my BSarch degree
-networking
-education

As passionate as I am about design I know my numbers and have worked for years in medium-high paying arch design position. I know that, unless you're running your own show or work in a boutique, you do not earn more per degree or licensing. 100,000k in debt is absurd for what kind of pay you're going to be getting when you graduate.

...and I was excited about yale

@ jamk

if you get into Yale, you go to Yale. the money will be there. it's an investment.

"if you get into Yale, you go to Yale. the money will be there. it's an investment."

i'm kind of shocked by this ivy league, golden ticket hubris...

young graduates from the GSD and yale, up to their eyes in debt, still can't get jobs.

also, to hankd...

you're suggesting that someone go into a career in LAW, which is a significant, long-term, VERY expensive endeavor, so that he/she can eventually move into architecture?

your logic is faulty.