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Do you own your IPs (Designs) and can you sell them?

Mouldi89

Hi Everyone,

My name is Mouldi I'm new to this forum, and i have an interesting idea that i thought this forum would be the best place to discuss it.

Few years back i worked as an architect, i had few jobs that i designed from scratch both with international firms and within my own practice (for a short period).  My clients never asked me for a 3D design and most of my contracts did not include the 3D models as deliverables, nevertheless i always created a beautiful 3D model of my buildings and i put a lot of effort in doing so.
My question is, do I own the IPs of those 3D models?, and can i sell them on the metaverse real-estate auction?

ps: i attached an image of one of the models.
Any thoughts regarding this subject is appreciated :)

Cheers
Mouldi

 
Jul 25, 22 11:57 am
Non Sequitur

Is this a serious question?


Jul 25, 22 12:19 pm  · 
 · 
Mouldi89

Yes it is.

Jul 25, 22 12:31 pm  · 
 · 
Non Sequitur

Who is willing to pay real money for digital versions of commercial 3D models? It's an absurd concept. Just another crypto NFT scam waste of time.

Jul 25, 22 1:09 pm  · 
 ·  2
Mouldi89

Oh its a marketplace i upload my 3D models preferably housing and commercial 3d Models and i choose the starting price, people who visit the site will start bidding on the project, if they get it they can use it in all 3d applications (not necessary the metaverse). anyway this is not the question! As an Architect do I own those 3D models, or they belong to the clients ?

Jul 25, 22 1:16 pm  · 
 · 

Depends. What does/did your contract say?

Jul 25, 22 1:14 pm  · 
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Mouldi89

​Very few of of my contracts state clearly that one of the required deliverables is the 3D model. In this case it's clear the client own the 3D model. But the rest of my contracts neve mention anything about the model or 3D renderings.

Jul 25, 22 2:09 pm  · 
 · 

Doesn't really matter if they mention models or 3D renderings. More interested in seeing what they say about the copyright for the design. I see Rick is on the case though so I'll leave it to him.

Jul 26, 22 11:12 am  · 
2  · 
Mouldi89

Still waiting for an answer
If someone had a similar situation i would appreciate their input!

Thanks

Jul 25, 22 8:30 pm  · 
 · 
Mouldi89

Update:

I'm currently consulting with an attorney, and she requested all the contracts of those different jobs.
From what she told me: "if it's not stated on the contract that they have the exclusive rights to the copyrights, i shouldn't worry about it."

Still she is making sure that the wording is safe on all of them.

Thanks everyone

Would still like to hear if someone has faced an issue if they ever used their 3D designs (Models) for business other than the original contracts they created them for.

Thanks

Jul 26, 22 12:23 pm  · 
2  · 
Mouldi89

Pretty much, Thank you Richard

Jul 26, 22 4:52 pm  · 
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x-jla

No need.  in the meta verse I’ll be a naked nomad.  

Jul 26, 22 3:22 pm  · 
1  · 
Mouldi89

:D but if you can make money at the same time, from your own 3D models, Why not!

Jul 26, 22 5:10 pm  · 
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Bench

You should probably disregard any advice Rick tries to post here.

Jul 26, 22 3:44 pm  · 
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Rick I think they would be covered by the historical defense of an incapability of further defamation on these forums. Since your reputation here is already sufficiently defamed by your own actions, you're literally incapable of being defamed. You'd also have to prove damages, but you have nothing to lose therefore could not incur damages by anything they write about you. That said, you're welcome to talk to an actual lawyer about it.

Jul 26, 22 4:54 pm  · 
1  · 

Might want to double check what they actually wrote there Rick. I don't see that either accused you of making any false statement. The closest might be b3ta's statement, but all that really amounts to is an accusation of talking foolishly or ignorantly which is simply opinion (if not also arguably true) and wouldn't constitute libel.

Again, you'd also need to prove damages if you wanted to claim they've defamed you and any number of examples exist on this website where you've done worse through your own actions such that your claim would likely go nowhere. Unless of course your argument is that what they state constitutes libel per se, but I don't see it meeting the definition of such unless you are trying to pass yourself off as a legal expert with special knowledge of copyright law as part of your business, trade, or profession.

Are you trying to pass yourself off as a legal expert in copyright law as part of your business, trade, or profession?

Jul 26, 22 6:15 pm  · 
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Lol … and now he got nuked from the thread

Jul 27, 22 9:26 am  · 
1  · 
Non Sequitur

Who spent more time?

a. RickyB when answering this silly question

or

b. The OP when making the silly french bank 3D model

Jul 26, 22 4:19 pm  · 
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If you count the time Rick has spent googling and reading wikipedia on all of this over the years ... it's clearly "a."

Jul 26, 22 4:46 pm  · 
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Mouldi89

I appreciate the humor Non Sequitur, and that building is not a bank, you got the French part right though :)

Jul 26, 22 4:55 pm  · 
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Non Sequitur

Sacre-blue!

Jul 26, 22 4:58 pm  · 
 · 
b3tadine[sutures]'s comment has been hidden
b3tadine[sutures]

Hey, Balkins, why don't we just do pistols at dawn, you fucking muppet.

Jul 27, 22 11:08 am  · 
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Mouldi89

Update:

The attorney cleared all my models for sales :)
let me know if you want to sell yours too

Thank you everyone

Jul 31, 22 9:10 pm  · 
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Non Sequitur

Please let us know when you find some poor shmuck to spend real money on them. I might have a bridge or two to sell them as well.

Jul 31, 22 11:31 pm  · 
1  · 
monosierra

If you get past the legal hurdles, it'd be great for designers to earn royalties from their work. Beats getting an (ever diminishing) one time fee for a revenue-generating project.

Aug 1, 22 9:07 am  · 
2  · 

My curiosity with this is on how the real world clients are going to feel about the design they paid for being sold in the virtual world? Yes, you can own the copyright, and you can be perfectly able to sell the copyright/design or at least license it to others, but that doesn't mean it's a good idea. Seems like a recipe for upset clients that find out their building is being used for a (fill in the blank here) in the virtual world. There's a reason we aren't reusing designs we own the copyright to in the real world (some exceptions to this of course).

Aug 1, 22 12:35 pm  · 
1  · 
Mouldi89

If a client of yours is not happy that you are earning revenue from your own designs, that's a red flag! Also you can always ask them if they want exclusive rights to the design (and sell it for a premium)

Aug 1, 22 1:16 pm  · 
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If I was a client and I found out my architect wants to take the design I'm paying them for and sell it for their side hustle, that's a red flag!

The thing is, most of the time the design will be a collaboration at some level with the client and they will likely feel a sense of ownership of the final product whether they have any claim to the copyright or not. I agree that if they are concerned they can negotiate to purchase exclusive rights to the design. Did you have that conversation with your clients for the work you're attempting sell online or do they even understand they may see their building rendered in 3D in some virtual world as the virtual headquarters for white supremacists or something else similarly repugnant?

Aug 1, 22 4:16 pm  · 
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Mouldi89

I reached out to couple of them -only clients who requested a 3D model- out of respect , and they had no issue with it. The remaining who did not even know that i used 3D Modeling to create the designs i didn't reach out to them.

Aug 1, 22 9:09 pm  · 
1  · 
Mouldi89

I would suggest for any architect to start adding this clause in their contracts "The client owns a license to the Design but not the design rights"
This should cover all cases based on the attorney claims

Aug 1, 22 9:15 pm  · 
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luvu

Sounds wrong...sorry the OP. I just flicked through the contract that we use regularly , often been modified adjusted to suit each client's requirement. In the IP section we say  ....

" The architect retains copyright in The Design. The Design means, design concept, drawings and documents provided under this agreement.

The architect grants the client an express but revocable license to use The Design for the site for which it was intended, subject to the condition that : " blah blah....

To answer your original question / I think you should be able to do with whatever you want to do with the model ( sell / donate ) ...whatever.



Aug 2, 22 1:04 am  · 
2  · 
Mouldi89

I agree Iuvu, Thanks

Aug 2, 22 10:11 am  · 
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SneakyPete

You might get an email from an angry clients lawyer.

Aug 2, 22 10:15 am  · 
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Mouldi89

So far so good

Aug 2, 22 10:36 am  · 
1  · 

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