I’ve been accepted to UBC’s 2-year advanced standing option and UofT’s 3-year master’s program with some scholarship support. While I’m disappointed I didn’t receive advanced standing at UofT, I had planned to attend because I live in Toronto and believe its worldwide reputation would benefit me, especially since I aim to practice in Europe in the future. Additionally, I’m considering pursuing a Ph.D. after becoming licensed.
But after speaking with some people in the architecture field, as well as doing some research online, UofT’s MArch program seems to fall short of expectations. Aside from the financial aspect, is UofT really that bad of a choice?
When I look at the work of the graduates and professors from both schools, I think I would enjoy my time at either school. So at this point, it’s really the reputation that I’m trying to understand.
Chad Miller
Apr 4, 24 6:57 pm
Go with the school that:
Costs you the least
Produces graduates that firms want to hire.
Teaches you the most.
Look at the accreditation reports for each school. Even if a school is accredited, there can still be significant differences in how well each school obtained their accreditation.
For example: About seven(?) years ago there was an accredited architectural program at CU Boulder (American). It turns out the program was on thin ice from the accreditation board due to non qualified staffing. The program was supposed to hire a qualified dean oversee things. They didn't and the program lost their accreditation. A few moths before graduation and entire class found out there degree wouldn't be accredited.
Non Sequitur
Apr 4, 24 8:19 pm
Chad, picking the cheapest does not apply to Canadian schools since all tuition is already heavily subsidized (super subsidized for quebec)... so even without grants, the average communist canadian is looking at 5k to 10k CAD per term. I think my whole grad degree at the top and most difficult to get into canadian school was 3k per term.
Chad Miller
Apr 8, 24 5:10 pm
My entire degree (B.Arch and M.Arch) cost me $35k back in 2002.
Non Sequitur
Apr 8, 24 6:15 pm
Mine was under 40k loonies and that includes rent and living expenses. (B.a.s and March)
Non Sequitur
Apr 4, 24 8:17 pm
UofT is at the bottom when it comes to M.arch degrees in Canada and its reputation is because it's a big institution in toronto (leafs suck), not because the architecture school is any good. UofT is an acceptable consolation prize for those who either don't want to move out of their parent's basement in the GTA or don't have the academics/folio for the better schools.
UBC has a solid program and is not bogged down by UofT's piss poor undergrad feeder program but neither will do much for reputation. If you want prestige, aim for McGill as that will be the only school with both an internationally recognizable name and quality program.
More importantly, how have you already decided you want to practice in europe and chase a phd after several years post license? Have you researched the professional world in europe, the licensing process, degree reciprocity, the utility of arch phd?
bowling_ball
Apr 4, 24 8:39 pm
You said McGill but you meant to type Waterloo. Also I'm just returning from the UK and connected with a whole bunch of professionals, grad students, professors, and even a former Dean there who went to my alma mater on the prairies. Otherwise yeah, I agree.
bowling_ball
Apr 4, 24 9:11 pm
To be clear, at the Bartlett and AA, not random crap schools over the pond. I think my point is that it's not impossible to have a successful career if you don't go to the best school. Your attitude and work ethic mean much more. Starting out with money helps, undoubtedly.
Non Sequitur
Apr 4, 24 9:23 pm
Loo's rep does not really extend beyond canada eventhough it's a great school. I've always said top schools are Loo, McGill, the rest, then UofT.
bowling_ball
Apr 4, 24 9:58 pm
No Canadian school's rep extends beyond Canada, let's be real
Non Sequitur
Apr 4, 24 10:59 pm
And rep means nothing in the real world.
kenchiku
Apr 13, 24 3:39 pm
This is why I always harp on about picking a Canadian school with co-ops. Aiming to have a work semester or two at a well respected firm will do so much more for one's own reputation than the name of any school up here in Canaduh
whistler
Apr 5, 24 4:50 pm
I guess like most grad schools of any sort some consideration as to where you want to end up may have some bearing. I do find that many like to hire their own, or at least hire from the local program if you will, so if you are planning on returning to TO to settle down and build your career maybe U of T makes some practical and logistical sense to you. You aren't going to learn everything about Architecture in your 2-3 years of school that will come with work experience and project experience.
West Coast has been busy for many years and likely a place that you'd find work but if you feel the familiarity of TO for work / family / lifestyle etc then maybe it's the right place for you. I was born and schooled out west and you won't get me to leave, ever. Was UBC the best school available then, probably not then or now but it was a good program for me and served me well.
bowling_ball
Apr 5, 24 9:28 pm
Well said. Once upon a time, I got a job at a high-end firm 3 provinces away, in large part because I shared an alma mater with the principal. It turns out he sucks and I moved back and I'm much happier and successful, but that's a story for another time.
CallMeCatbread
Apr 8, 24 2:53 pm
Just how important is that? (going to school where you want to practise). I'm finishing up my undergrad at Dalhousie, and have the choice between Dalhousie and UofC. I'm from Calgary and plan on moving back there and practising in the west. That being said I'm quite happy with Dalhousie and feel like I'm getting (and will continue to get in masters) a better education than what UofC could offer.
Non Sequitur
Apr 8, 24 3:06 pm
Dal is a far far better school than Calgary. Stick there if you can and you'll be much better off than your peers when you move back to Alberta.
whistler
Apr 8, 24 4:34 pm
CallMeCat ... I don't really think they are compatible at all ( although I did know one of the U of C profs from my time at UBC and always thought he was one of the stronger students) so your choice makes sense. My point being that every year It seemed I had plenty of local job offers from local offices which permitted me to get tons of real time work experience in the community I wanted to live. Other classmates weren't taking advantage of those opportunities ( many of those jobs didn't pay well so classmates chose to go treeplanting or something else to pay for school ) but the summer work experiences meant I never had to look very hard for work year after year or once I graduated. never to soon to build your network
... but I guess nowadays its part of your LinkedIn page etc.
CallMeCatbread
May 1, 24 2:17 pm
Looks like I might be going to UofC anyway. In a shocking and manipulative act Dalhousie, less than a week before classes were to start announced a 63% increase in tuition for the MArch program. I'm now having a hard time thinking of justification for why I should give my money to a school that does that, when I could go to UofC and live at home for free.
kenchiku
Apr 13, 24 3:41 pm
CallMeCat - stick with Dal and go get an amazing 8mo co-op gig
gual
Apr 14, 24 5:47 pm
If academia is a factor I'd look at the faculty's research interests, particularly the faculty who actively publish. I'd also look at where the faculty got their degrees as they will likely know people at those schools. This may help you narrow things down.
Hi All,
I’ve been accepted to UBC’s 2-year advanced standing option and UofT’s 3-year master’s program with some scholarship support. While I’m disappointed I didn’t receive advanced standing at UofT, I had planned to attend because I live in Toronto and believe its worldwide reputation would benefit me, especially since I aim to practice in Europe in the future. Additionally, I’m considering pursuing a Ph.D. after becoming licensed.
But after speaking with some people in the architecture field, as well as doing some research online, UofT’s MArch program seems to fall short of expectations. Aside from the financial aspect, is UofT really that bad of a choice?
When I look at the work of the graduates and professors from both schools, I think I would enjoy my time at either school. So at this point, it’s really the reputation that I’m trying to understand.
Go with the school that:
Look at the accreditation reports for each school. Even if a school is accredited, there can still be significant differences in how well each school obtained their accreditation.
For example: About seven(?) years ago there was an accredited architectural program at CU Boulder (American). It turns out the program was on thin ice from the accreditation board due to non qualified staffing. The program was supposed to hire a qualified dean oversee things. They didn't and the program lost their accreditation. A few moths before graduation and entire class found out there degree wouldn't be accredited.
Chad, picking the cheapest does not apply to Canadian schools since all tuition is already heavily subsidized (super subsidized for quebec)... so even without grants, the average communist canadian is looking at 5k to 10k CAD per term. I think my whole grad degree at the top and most difficult to get into canadian school was 3k per term.
My entire degree (B.Arch and M.Arch) cost me $35k back in 2002.
Mine was under 40k loonies and that includes rent and living expenses. (B.a.s and March)
UofT is at the bottom when it comes to M.arch degrees in Canada and its reputation is because it's a big institution in toronto (leafs suck), not because the architecture school is any good. UofT is an acceptable consolation prize for those who either don't want to move out of their parent's basement in the GTA or don't have the academics/folio for the better schools.
UBC has a solid program and is not bogged down by UofT's piss poor undergrad feeder program but neither will do much for reputation. If you want prestige, aim for McGill as that will be the only school with both an internationally recognizable name and quality program.
More importantly, how have you already decided you want to practice in europe and chase a phd after several years post license? Have you researched the professional world in europe, the licensing process, degree reciprocity, the utility of arch phd?
You said McGill but you meant to type Waterloo. Also I'm just returning from the UK and connected with a whole bunch of professionals, grad students, professors, and even a former Dean there who went to my alma mater on the prairies. Otherwise yeah, I agree.
To be clear, at the Bartlett and AA, not random crap schools over the pond. I think my point is that it's not impossible to have a successful career if you don't go to the best school. Your attitude and work ethic mean much more. Starting out with money helps, undoubtedly.
Loo's rep does not really extend beyond canada eventhough it's a great school. I've always said top schools are Loo, McGill, the rest, then UofT.
No Canadian school's rep extends beyond Canada, let's be real
And rep means nothing in the real world.
This is why I always harp on about picking a Canadian school with co-ops. Aiming to have a work semester or two at a well respected firm will do so much more for one's own reputation than the name of any school up here in Canaduh
I guess like most grad schools of any sort some consideration as to where you want to end up may have some bearing. I do find that many like to hire their own, or at least hire from the local program if you will, so if you are planning on returning to TO to settle down and build your career maybe U of T makes some practical and logistical sense to you. You aren't going to learn everything about Architecture in your 2-3 years of school that will come with work experience and project experience.
West Coast has been busy for many years and likely a place that you'd find work but if you feel the familiarity of TO for work / family / lifestyle etc then maybe it's the right place for you. I was born and schooled out west and you won't get me to leave, ever. Was UBC the best school available then, probably not then or now but it was a good program for me and served me well.
Well said. Once upon a time, I got a job at a high-end firm 3 provinces away, in large part because I shared an alma mater with the principal. It turns out he sucks and I moved back and I'm much happier and successful, but that's a story for another time.
Just how important is that? (going to school where you want to practise). I'm finishing up my undergrad at Dalhousie, and have the choice between Dalhousie and UofC. I'm from Calgary and plan on moving back there and practising in the west. That being said I'm quite happy with Dalhousie and feel like I'm getting (and will continue to get in masters) a better education than what UofC could offer.
Dal is a far far better school than Calgary. Stick there if you can and you'll be much better off than your peers when you move back to Alberta.
CallMeCat ... I don't really think they are compatible at all ( although I did know one of the U of C profs from my time at UBC and always thought he was one of the stronger students) so your choice makes sense. My point being that every year It seemed I had plenty of local job offers from local offices which permitted me to get tons of real time work experience in the community I wanted to live. Other classmates weren't taking advantage of those opportunities ( many of those jobs didn't pay well so classmates chose to go treeplanting or something else to pay for school ) but the summer work experiences meant I never had to look very hard for work year after year or once I graduated. never to soon to build your network ... but I guess nowadays its part of your LinkedIn page etc.
Looks like I might be going to UofC anyway. In a shocking and manipulative act Dalhousie, less than a week before classes were to start announced a 63% increase in tuition for the MArch program. I'm now having a hard time thinking of justification for why I should give my money to a school that does that, when I could go to UofC and live at home for free.
CallMeCat - stick with Dal and go get an amazing 8mo co-op gig
If academia is a factor I'd look at the faculty's research interests, particularly the faculty who actively publish. I'd also look at where the faculty got their degrees as they will likely know people at those schools. This may help you narrow things down.