I am an architect in MA. A client came to me recently with a vacation home project in a town in New Hampshire. This town doesn't have any building inspection service. Instead, the town will ask the owner and the builder to sign an affidavit to promise that the building has been constructed complying with all code. I emailed the town's staff and verified the information, but I noticed the staff's email address ends with .org not .gov. This is a fun project, I am very interesed, but concerned that the town's regulation might conflict with the state of NH's requirement. Even it doesn't, will it has liability risk for an architect with the affidavit from the owner and the builder?
Anyone has any experience like this or any advice? Many thanks.
reallynotmyname
Apr 15, 23 1:29 pm
Barring any conflicts with state regulations (which you totally need to research), the arrangement looks like it places responsibility squarely on the owner and builder and not you.
See if the town will give you model language for the affidavits or pre-approve the language if your client and builder have to write them your selves. A 15-30 minute review of these documents by an attorney wouldn't hurt either.
Are you concerned that the owner & builder will put you in a position where they signed the affidavits "because you told them to, based on your assurances that everything was built to code"? If that's a concern, maybe talk to the owner about hiring a third party independent building inspector.
JonathanLivingston
Apr 15, 23 2:02 pm
I would not think this arrangement places any more liability on you than it would previously or in a jurisdiction with greater oversight. If anything you may have less liability because of non-existent land use constraints that could create liability. Generally, AHJ inspection and review do not absolve you of any of your professional liability. It's nice to have a second set of eyes but they won't stand in front of a bullet for you.
ivanmillya
Apr 17, 23 7:23 am
Wrong. Building code compliance in design always rests on the architect, regardless of the building department's involvement (or lack thereof). Just because a building plan reviewer or inspector doesn't catch an error or omission does not relieve the architect of responsibility for designing properly, nor does it relieve the licensed contractor from their responsibility for building properly.
Chad Miller
Apr 17, 23 12:01 pm
As Jovan said - the compliance part ALWAYS rests with the architect. In our drawings we have a code review and a report of special inspections. That is enough to show that we ensured compliance for codes and inspections.
JonathanLivingston
Apr 17, 23 2:22 pm
Tell em you told them, but do tell them, and do so on your drawings and contract. Same as everywhere else.
Chad Miller
Apr 17, 23 2:46 pm
Yup!
JonathanLivingston
Apr 17, 23 6:59 pm
Doesnt matter what they do. You told them.
ivanmillya
Apr 17, 23 7:10 pm
Rick, I highly recommend you study up on your Practice Management and Project Management exams for the ARE, they'll help you a lot in learning how architecture firms actually work.
JonathanLivingston
Apr 17, 23 8:34 pm
Fortune favors the brave.
JonathanLivingston
Apr 17, 23 10:30 pm
Rick'd it.
luvu
Apr 19, 23 9:23 pm
.
luvu
Apr 16, 23 12:07 am
My 2c : I’d consult with my PI insurance rep./ ask them to review the contract/ agreement.
If they advise against this agreement/ better not take the job. It’s either this project is not covered or you pay more fee on PI.
x-jla
Apr 17, 23 4:10 pm
Liability has the potential to affect 3 parties. 1.designer of record. 2. Homeowner. 3. Contractor. Inspections or approvals don’t take the liability weight off, although they may help a little in a court if it came to that.
Chad Miller
Apr 17, 23 5:15 pm
Kind of - if you show that your drawings where correct and the contractor didn't follow them the architect typically won't be involved past mediation. Then again you can still be sued for anything, anytime.
luvu
Apr 17, 23 10:29 pm
A precedent case in our justification the court has ordered
luvu
Apr 17, 23 10:30 pm
Fire engineer 42 %
luvu
Apr 17, 23 10:31 pm
damn hard to write on phone… never mind
Le Courvoisier
Apr 17, 23 9:56 pm
NCARB should let Balkins take the ARE even though he doesn’t have a degree.
want to see that reality check face slap
deltar
Apr 18, 23 1:46 pm
But then we will get a 5,000 word essay on why NCARB is corrupt and the AREs not being a good measure of architectural prowess.
Chad Miller
Apr 18, 23 1:56 pm
We get those anyways from users like Non-ASD and others who have fallen short of being a competent architect. Then we have users like WoodGuy who isn't an architect but creates great single family projects and is very informative.
Bench
Apr 19, 23 9:33 am
Pretty sure he claims he is now eligible for it and was going to start taking them imminently. That was roughly 3-4 years ago. For context, I got licensed in 2 different countries over that same time period.
Bench
Apr 19, 23 9:33 am
Oh looks like his rambling got nuked. Again...
Chad Miller
Apr 19, 23 10:32 am
Two countries?! Nice! I'm only licensed in one country and that took me three years. I'm clearly lame.
deltar
Apr 19, 23 12:03 pm
If it makes you feel any better I'm licensed in 0 countries at this point in time but I'm in school so I have an excuse.
Bench
Apr 19, 23 12:19 pm
Chad if it makes you feel better, you've definitely used that * actual * license in one country many more times than i've used either of mine :(
Ironically, i think i am eligible for a third country license, and there's a non-zero chance that could be in the cards down the line.
Chad Miller
Apr 19, 23 12:49 pm
Bench - Pfffft! I'm not signing any drawings so I'm really not using my license. ;) I still think your accomplishments are impressive!
Wood Guy
Apr 19, 23 6:19 pm
Aw shucks, thanks Chad. I do wish there was a way to take a test, no matter how difficult, that would let me not have to work under a licensed architect for 13 years before being eligible for licensure. But I understand why the rules in place.
Chad Miller
Apr 20, 23 10:08 am
I agree Wood. There should be a way for people with the amount of experience you have to just take the exam. You'd pass with no issues.
Le Courvoisier
Apr 17, 23 10:16 pm
Balkins, do you get paid by the word? That’s the only explanation for your incessant, incorrect, rambling.
graphemic
May 24, 23 4:47 pm
^ What is up with these radon bots?
omaharadonpros
Feb 7, 24 4:09 am
If you're uncertain about the liability risks associated with the project, consider consulting with legal counsel specializing in construction law. They can provide guidance on navigating regulatory issues and drafting contracts that protect your interests.
I am an architect in MA. A client came to me recently with a vacation home project in a town in New Hampshire. This town doesn't have any building inspection service. Instead, the town will ask the owner and the builder to sign an affidavit to promise that the building has been constructed complying with all code. I emailed the town's staff and verified the information, but I noticed the staff's email address ends with .org not .gov. This is a fun project, I am very interesed, but concerned that the town's regulation might conflict with the state of NH's requirement. Even it doesn't, will it has liability risk for an architect with the affidavit from the owner and the builder?
Anyone has any experience like this or any advice? Many thanks.
Barring any conflicts with state regulations (which you totally need to research), the arrangement looks like it places responsibility squarely on the owner and builder and not you.
See if the town will give you model language for the affidavits or pre-approve the language if your client and builder have to write them your selves. A 15-30 minute review of these documents by an attorney wouldn't hurt either.
Are you concerned that the owner & builder will put you in a position where they signed the affidavits "because you told them to, based on your assurances that everything was built to code"? If that's a concern, maybe talk to the owner about hiring a third party independent building inspector.
I would not think this arrangement places any more liability on you than it would previously or in a jurisdiction with greater oversight. If anything you may have less liability because of non-existent land use constraints that could create liability. Generally, AHJ inspection and review do not absolve you of any of your professional liability. It's nice to have a second set of eyes but they won't stand in front of a bullet for you.
Wrong. Building code compliance in design always rests on the architect, regardless of the building department's involvement (or lack thereof). Just because a building plan reviewer or inspector doesn't catch an error or omission does not relieve the architect of responsibility for designing properly, nor does it relieve the licensed contractor from their responsibility for building properly.
As Jovan said - the compliance part ALWAYS rests with the architect. In our drawings we have a code review and a report of special inspections. That is enough to show that we ensured compliance for codes and inspections.
Tell em you told them, but do tell them, and do so on your drawings and contract. Same as everywhere else.
Yup!
Doesnt matter what they do. You told them.
Rick, I highly recommend you study up on your Practice Management and Project Management exams for the ARE, they'll help you a lot in learning how architecture firms actually work.
Fortune favors the brave.
Rick'd it.
.
My 2c : I’d consult with my PI insurance rep./ ask them to review the contract/ agreement.
If they advise against this agreement/ better not take the job. It’s either this project is not covered or you pay more fee on PI.
Liability has the potential to affect 3 parties. 1.designer of record. 2. Homeowner. 3. Contractor. Inspections or approvals don’t take the liability weight off, although they may help a little in a court if it came to that.
Kind of - if you show that your drawings where correct and the contractor didn't follow them the architect typically won't be involved past mediation. Then again you can still be sued for anything, anytime.
A precedent case in our justification the court has ordered
Fire engineer 42 %
damn hard to write on phone… never mind
NCARB should let Balkins take the ARE even though he doesn’t have a degree.
want to see that reality check face slap
But then we will get a 5,000 word essay on why NCARB is corrupt and the AREs not being a good measure of architectural prowess.
We get those anyways from users like Non-ASD and others who have fallen short of being a competent architect. Then we have users like WoodGuy who isn't an architect but creates great single family projects and is very informative.
Pretty sure he claims he is now eligible for it and was going to start taking them imminently. That was roughly 3-4 years ago. For context, I got licensed in 2 different countries over that same time period.
Oh looks like his rambling got nuked. Again...
Two countries?! Nice! I'm only licensed in one country and that took me three years. I'm clearly lame.
If it makes you feel any better I'm licensed in 0 countries at this point in time but I'm in school so I have an excuse.
Chad if it makes you feel better, you've definitely used that * actual * license in one country many more times than i've used either of mine :(
Ironically, i think i am eligible for a third country license, and there's a non-zero chance that could be in the cards down the line.
Bench - Pfffft! I'm not signing any drawings so I'm really not using my license. ;) I still think your accomplishments are impressive!
Aw shucks, thanks Chad. I do wish there was a way to take a test, no matter how difficult, that would let me not have to work under a licensed architect for 13 years before being eligible for licensure. But I understand why the rules in place.
I agree Wood. There should be a way for people with the amount of experience you have to just take the exam. You'd pass with no issues.
Balkins, do you get paid by the word? That’s the only explanation for your incessant, incorrect, rambling.
^ What is up with these radon bots?
If you're uncertain about the liability risks associated with the project, consider consulting with legal counsel specializing in construction law. They can provide guidance on navigating regulatory issues and drafting contracts that protect your interests.