DCA. When I decided to quit my job to head out on my own, my employers thought I was nuts. They explained that I was on my way to being in a leadership position. I liked my co-workers and the work I was doing. So why leave? I really don't know why I left, just that I felt antsy and I wanted to try something new. I think that moving into a leadership position within a larger firm is definitely an option. But in no way is this related to starting a firm. While both require a huge time commitment and a certain amount of talent, starting a firm has very different requirements and rewards. There is no support system for one (marketing staff, accounting dept, technical staff), and it feels like you have to learn how to do everything all over again. It is difficult to articulate why it is so different, because I think the differences are more emotional than practical.
On the practical side, my experience had been designing very large (200,00sf+) projects, so I sometimes feel a bit out of my element with smaller projects. Designing a portion of a large project is very different than designing the entirety of a small project. Maybe it would be useful to work for a firm that does single family residential project or small fit outs to have a better understanding on how to manage a complete project.
I completely agree with jbird that access to new technology is one of the things that allow smaller firms to compete. Not only is it possible to work on projects that use to require expensive equipment and many additional hands (films for example), but also it makes it much easier to collaborate with other practices. It has allowed us to work on a number of projects located in other countries for example.
While I believe that I could have continued on the path that I was on before, and would have been fulfilled with the work I was doing. There is absolutely no way that I would go back to work for a large firm today. I tried going back on a temporary basis about a year after I had left that world, and it felt like the walls were closing in on me. That job did not last long, and I have no plans to try that again.
I was particularly engaged by what R.A. Rudolph wrote, so much of what she described has either happened or is about to happen to us. It was useful to talk about many of these issues with my partner, especially possible problems with adding partners or merging with another firm. Made me laugh too. Best of luck to those of you heading out on your own, and may the economy stay relatively strong.
DCA, just briefly as I've gotta get busy with work, I was moving up at my old firm, and they offered me a plum new position when I announced I was leaving. But only in the last month or so have I realized that leaving the nest was, for me, a necessary part of my professional and personal development. I started there straight out of school, and in a way would never have escaped the image of a young green intern in that firm. Some days I picture myself going back to that firm and being a completely different employee/force than I was before I left. Just my own experience after being in one place for ten years.
Good comments, Sarah, re: the differences between working on parts of large and then an entire small project - I have experienced the same thing. It is in a way starting all over again on an entirely new learning path - but isn't that one of the things we all love about architecture, it's constantly new?
"isn't that one of the things we all love about architecture, it's constantly new?" Very true. This may also be why architects make less money on average than other professionals. There are significant costs associated with this perpetual learning curve.
I learned something outright shocking today, and apparently this is true for most states, not just Indiana: the professional that stamps a set of drawings, even as a member of a corporation with several licensed architects, is personally liable for defects in the building design. Personally liable! Which means no corporate structure, llc, s-corp, whatever, can protect you from losing your personal assets in a claim made against your project resulting from defective design!
You most likely won't lose any assets held jointly between you and a spouse, but anything with only your name on it is open game.
This is because as a professional you are licensed as an individual, so no corporate entity can protect you.
This freaks me out. And this is why ANYONE who is an employee SHOULD NOT BE STAMPING DRAWINGS! Never, ever, ever. If your boss tries to make it seem like it is cool or a sign of your level of responsibility to stamp drawings, just say no.
mine was accidental and unplanned. there was no infra structure to it and still not after nearly all those years. even though i worked for other people 3 times, i've always had my own projects on the side. one time i was published in new york times magazine to the amazement of my then boss, who would be very happy to be in the same issue. it was my first week at his office and i was treated like a design partner after that.
i would like to be a designer for a firm...but since i've been out of the firms since 2000, i'm looked down upon......but i have my freedom to do things...... even though i have to work hard today to eat tomorrow, i like what i have been doing over the years..... just need to find another market to tap into
LB - surprised you didn't know this, but maybe I learned the extent of the liability in researching the benefits of incorporation. In short, as a licensed professional you always remain personally liable, no matter what business structure you have. Hence the necessity for errors & omissions insurance (or malpractice insurance for doctors, and I'm sure there's something for attorneys & accountants as well). Not that I have it - I have also learned through experience that the chance of being sued for working on a single family residential project is very slim...
What you gain from incorporation is supposed protection from creditors - bank loans, credit cards etc. in the name of the company, should the business fail.
But I would never stamp drawings as an employee, or for money when I wasn't actually in control of the project (which we have been asked to do a few times). However, the law in California also says that the person submitting/responsible for the drawings MUST stamp them if they are a licensed architect. I find it a bit strange, but if you are submitting for a project which doesn't require an architect (most single family residences & up to 4 units here), you still have to stamp the drawings.
alright rim joist, here is your foreshadowing my friend. it comes on the heels of a nice long two week trip basking in the warmth of the sun and people of chile. more on that later though.
as i mentioned above, i have been on my own for five years. things have been good. i've built a good client base. i have done some interesting work that has left my clients pleased and left me profitable. as anyone how has their own gig knows, doing it by yourself can be tough no matter how much you love it. you are always on. always working. always thinking about it, and there is never enough time for anything. no job is perfect, and these are the imperfections of running your own business. turning off is tough.
with that said, i'm finally getting some help. not just any ol' help either. it's my best friend. it's my wife.
she is a creative director for a large design firm in town, and she gave notice the other day. she will bring skills and assets to the studio that will well complement, and in many cases, exceed mine. we have worked with each other in the past. she has been a part of every important design and business decision that has effected my studio in the last five years. hell, once we've even got fired together. how many of you can say that you got fired with your wife/husband/SI. we actually met working together. granted is was only doing a group project together in college, um, 18 years ago.
we will be finally moving the business out of the house. some separation between personal and professional lives are needed. we are lucky enough to have a friend who owns a small building two blocks from our house. the space is about 1000sqft with views of the shipyards, lake, and city.
with all this excitement, i'd be lying if i said i were not nervous. i'm nervous as hell. all of our eggs are in one basket now. everything is on the line. no more paycheck coming from someone else every two weeks. no more health insurance being mainly paid by someone else. no more getting paid for vacation, holidays, and being sick.
if turning off was tough before, it certainly will be now, but i am so looking forward to it.
that separation between personal and professional life is MUCH needed to make things balance out, i had a bad experience down the road of love/association
but your setup sounds fantastic, good luck and have a great 07
My biggest question is how did you bring in that first paying client?
I know of several small firms around town that were basically started by an architect leaving an established firm with a client or two in-tow. Great for keeping that cash flow but not so great for your personal reputation in the local community.
Personally I love project management, contracts, billing, etc. Would I be better off starting my own firm with a good partner as a designer? Or should I just work up to principal where I'm at and take my big paycheck, company car and 5 weeks vacation?
No, I just regularly scoured the adds where people where looking for a 'freelance architect'. I was miserable at the firm I was at so I desperately wanted a side gig, and figured this was the only route at the time.
Needless to say, the people who look for an architect on craigslist are not looking to spend a lot of money. Its fucking ridiculous what they're willing to spend. To make matters worse, you have hacks offering up drafting services for pennys on the dollar.
To finally land a job I had to undercut other people and work for a fraction of what I wanted. Its embarrassing what I worked at first... But it lead to real work.
Thank God I'm not bottom-feeding off of craigslist anymore!
RA, I just learned that Arizona is the same way - apparently if you are a registered architect and you prepare essentially anything for a project, you HAVE to stamp the drawings, whether one is required or not.
That's stringent. but I do see the point - if only it wasn't undercut by letting people build houses and small commercial without a stamp. That sort of legislation really could lead to people not wanting to get licensed!
Ridiculous. I'm starting to think anything that requires a building permit should require an architect's stamp.
Oh and aquapura, to your question: my first paying job was handed to me by my boss, who didn't want to deal with interior furnishings for the hosue of one of our consultant engineers because he was nervous about how it would affect his their relationahip (boss and engineer). And it was too small a job for the office to take on anyway. I guess my second paying job was a client who we had done public work for who called me privately and asked me to handle her kitchen renovation, which I did under the radar of the office.
Remember, everyone you meet is part of your network!
My first paying job came via the telephone whilst I was in the school's office someone called looking for an architect (or something like that) and I was the only on there at the time that fit the bill. Sat and had lunch with her, turned out to be the daughter of a famous musician (also a musician in her own right). The project was never built because i had to take up another job offer in another country and she wasn't willing to work with someone to finish it. Nice lady.
I return to this thread time and again because it is so brilliant.
Here's another question that I haven't seen in other threads: What is the ideal amount of seed money that you had or wish you had prior to starting your own firm? $100,000 seems like a nice, round number, but I'm not sure if it's way too much or not enough.
When you break it down, it seems almost feasible to save $10,000 a year for the next 10 years.
And is it more or less expensive to buy-into an existing firm or to start your own firm?
dca, i've heard that at least a year's salary should be banked? although, like buying a home - and needing 10% - 20% down - i think it's a myth perpetuated by those not wanting competition. i mean how many of us are going to continue with the day job, and still take on work - hand raised?
the thing i am wondering is there something in my day job that i can transition to so that i am not at production mode, and still not be spent when i get home?
hrm... It sounds reasonable to bank one year's salary as a fall-back for the first year, as you'll probably not be profitable.
But what about other business expenses? (office space lease, computers, employees, insurance - everything that's been mentioned above.) I guess this is where the business plan comes in. liberty bell: how is yours coming? :)
my plan is to have that one years salary saved up. ok, what year will that be based on? this year or one in five years???? since I should be doubling my income between now and then- I'll aspire to the larger amount. half that dough will go towards keeping me afloat, the rest will be operating capital for rent, computers, marketing and paying the accountant.
I'd rather not try double dipping once I get a client- rather would spend 100% of my time on my own project then working for the man at that point.
Still, it will take a year or two after hours to get the full business plan worked up, website ready to go, and to start hunting for the first commission...
Why have a bank role saved up ????? Just start out of a bedroom with a couple clients and go, unless of course you plan to go out and spend a ton of money on a fancy smancy office space high priced equipment, staff and then marketing and wait for the work to come...... it doesn't happen like that.
First rule of business keep the overhaed costs low and pay yourself. But it helps to have at least six months work lined up to keep things afloat
for awhile and any time you think you're too busy to market and get the next job is exactly when you need to.
Bump because this was a great thread and I want to hear about how things may have changed since 2008. I'm sitting in a cafe studying for the AREs pretending that reading this counts as studying. Work is slow at my firm right now so this seemed like a good time to start testing, but the main thing driving me is the idea of starting a firm in a couple of years.
On a side note, any of you all doing small development on the side as well? It seems Luke a scary thing to start, but the control of your work and chance to make money are pretty big incentives.
You need large capital for development, otherwise you will just be doing it for the bank if you are hoping to take out a large loan. Having said that, this is my goal as well, to one day do my own development.
wow - it's great to re-read these. i must have still had my old nom de-plume back then...
we've been up and running for 8 years now. and, finally (finally) it feels like we're starting to turn a corner. we've finally learned which projects to chase, which to leave alone, what kinds of people will work best in the studio, how to talk to potential clients, network, etc.
so, we're... poised. and, i'll say for myself, i'm as equally excited/intrigued/entrenched in the design of our practice, as i am about the projects we're doing and the clients we're working with. just focusing on providing that framework and team chemistry...
would love to hear how some of the others are doing as well...
we are doing larger work than when i first posted here which is nice. W are also working out the kind of office we want to be, which is probably more important than the work we do in some ways. still not settled by any means and that is frustrating at times. in this economy though, i am glad to still be around.
I'm raising a kid and starting a practice. When I was unlicensed I had work while I was finishing the exams. I got my stamp and my previous clients, every one of them, won't commission me as a licensed architect. Part of my day is hugs with magic unicorns and the other part of the day I'm sweating bullets about whether I can pull this off.
Interesting how no one commented... perhaps a sign?
I can say that I left architecture to start my own business... selling art. Laugh and question it all you want, but so far it has been the best decision I have made in the last 10 years of my life. I tried to start my own thing in 2010 with a friend that was a licensed contractor in Colorado Springs. It was much harder to find work doing design/architecture, than it is to sell art.
I am still poor, but I am starting to make $2500-4k a show! It is a ton of work, more so than just sitting behind a desk and CADing it up all day. But it is so much more rewarding being in charge of my life instead of some idiot employer that just has their 'bottom line' on their mind all the time. Not only am I in charge of designing and creating my own art, but I also do all the web design, marketing, budgeting, packaging, traveling, networking, and selling. Speaking of networking, it was nonexistent in all my previous architecture jobs. Sure I went to a couple meetings here or there, and was the liaison on many aspects of the projects, but it was never true networking. Now when I sell art I talk directly with potential clients, and clients alike. I present them with a smaller piece of architecture (the art), knowing that perhaps sometime down the road they might want a larger one (a structure). I don't hold my breath on that, but I am networking a much tighter net than I ever was working for someone else in architecture.
All in all, I am sooooo happy not working for someone else, especially in architecture. It surely felt like there were no latters up after 2008, and I truly regret sticking with architecture so long after the downturn, only to find myself miserable and feeling like my life was the definition of insanity. I know there are few architects doing okay/great with their new endeavors post recession, but none are probably wasting their time on architnect.
No. Etsy is not the best market place for really any item over $100-120~.
Ppl want to see what they are getting for that kind of money, especially fine art.
I have made several sales so far, including one to a IA firm in Dallas. But Etsy is not my main source of income.
I travel to art fair/festivals throughout the country. For example I was just up in Minneapolis doing an art festival called "Uptown Art Fair", and recently in Baltimore for "Artscape".
It is definitely not easy money and it reminds me of gambling in a lot of ways, but that is where desperation will drive you.
If you wanted more information on how to apply for art shows I could go into more details.
I have a friend that let me in on this life hack. It is like anything though, the more front end ground work that is paved into the business reaps it rewards with time.
When the recession hit in 2008 I panicked disproportionately to how hard we were hit. So I took on a teaching job for a small guaranteed monthly income. That led to me slowly extricating myself from my partner as I didn't want to be a burden on him. We remain best of friends to this day (we met in our first studio freshman year in undergrad - I can safely say he'll be my friend forever), but dissolved the partnership. I did my own small projects and taught for a couple years. One of the jobs was the Chop Stick at the Indianapolis Museum of Art by Visiondivision - they needed a local architect of record; through my networking with the local art scene I was able to take on that role. The COO of the Museum and I got along really well on that job, and when they needed an architect in their Facilities department I got the job. So now I'm not in traditional practice, I work in-house in a large institution.
I like the guaranteed direct deposit salary, the great benefits, and fun co-workers. But I miss self-employment every day.
I post this not just to tell my story but to point out how long and varied the career of an architect can be. I'm 47 now and feel like I could still do another major career change: back to self-employment, back to traditional practice, or outside of architecture altogether into some other field - construction, urban development, who knows? I'm very active locally in the urban/art/design scene, and even though I have a "real job" now the kind of volunteering and networking I did when I was self-employed is still critical. puddles posted on the first page about his financial career the famous phrase "ABC - always be closing". I'd say for architects we need to always be networking - absolutely everyone you ever meet can be related to the kind of work we do.
I actually have a solo art/ design show coming up, I am producing a range of pieces at different prices and a larger room-filling pavilion type piece, so it is definitely a path I have researched. I was just curious because i had never considered etsy. Have you checked out Cafe.com for slightly larger commissions? I could definitely see you transitioning to larger and larger work until it is architectural scale.
At this point, it is just trying to have a more complete professional life, and for networking and fun, but I did start an LLC to cover the art sales, some small furniture stuff, and the occasional consulting. I am going to have revenue of about $4k this year, but it might slowly grow into a business alongside my normal professional practice. I am certainly envious of you, and everyone who is doing it on their own!
archanonymous, very cool. It would be interesting to see your work too! I have yet to actually do submissions on Café.org yet. A lot of other artist that I run into during my travels say that it might be a good platform for jumping to much bigger commissions. I plan on really sitting down this fall and producing new work, updating my website for the third or fourth time, and looking how to market myself further, I will definitely check it out.
As for your show, best of luck! Sounds like you could transition rather easy to the art world if wanted. You might be surprised how much money you can make on art, or perhaps you know.
My best show was in Baltimore so far, seem like the east coast really love funky non-traditional art, whereas the mid-west is more into traditional. It has been really interesting to learn about art and how it plays into region-ality, the zeitgeist of the time, psychology, and sociology, etc...I look forward by responding thur my art from what I have analyzed in this past year.
at the recent AIA convention, the small firm/solo practice received more attention than in the past. also, a handful of dedicated architects are putting their energy into blogs, podcasts and youtube channels that discuss the opportunities for the small firm. take a listen to entrearchitect, the business of architeture, small time/big firm and archispeak. good stuff.
So here's my update. After getting by on my own for about 5 years, 2008 hit me very hard. I had just moved into a bigger space, was looking to hire, and then slowly lost ALL of my work. I managed to scrape by pretty painlessly for about a year. But then as another year was passing, I was going to into major debt without any sign of things improving. I had maxed out all of my credit lines, and had borrowed all I could out of my parents meager savings. It was not a good place to be. And going back to work for an office just wasn't an option for me after working my ass off on my own for so many years (assuming I could even find a job). So I was doing odd carpentry jobs just to stave off bankruptcy and eviction. It was grim, but I maintained hope things would turn around. I was willing to gamble on my financial well-being for years to come with a massive debt. It was pretty risky and foolish, and something I certainly couldn't do again now that I'm married with a child.
I did manage to keep the doors open of my meager sole-proprietorship, and work did finally start to trickle back in. It was ironic for me that when a large project came in, I answered the call on top of a ladder, filthy from doing roofing. Now I'm finally on solid ground (knock on wood), and thankfully out of debt. I have a nice range of projects going, and I'm grateful clients are willing to pay me a nice fee for something I love to do. I've learned some very valuable lessons along the way, and I don't think I'd appreciate working on my own as much as I do without the path here being as winding and tortuous as its been.
You got a firm? Are ya makin' it?
t h e
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DCA. When I decided to quit my job to head out on my own, my employers thought I was nuts. They explained that I was on my way to being in a leadership position. I liked my co-workers and the work I was doing. So why leave? I really don't know why I left, just that I felt antsy and I wanted to try something new. I think that moving into a leadership position within a larger firm is definitely an option. But in no way is this related to starting a firm. While both require a huge time commitment and a certain amount of talent, starting a firm has very different requirements and rewards. There is no support system for one (marketing staff, accounting dept, technical staff), and it feels like you have to learn how to do everything all over again. It is difficult to articulate why it is so different, because I think the differences are more emotional than practical.
On the practical side, my experience had been designing very large (200,00sf+) projects, so I sometimes feel a bit out of my element with smaller projects. Designing a portion of a large project is very different than designing the entirety of a small project. Maybe it would be useful to work for a firm that does single family residential project or small fit outs to have a better understanding on how to manage a complete project.
I completely agree with jbird that access to new technology is one of the things that allow smaller firms to compete. Not only is it possible to work on projects that use to require expensive equipment and many additional hands (films for example), but also it makes it much easier to collaborate with other practices. It has allowed us to work on a number of projects located in other countries for example.
While I believe that I could have continued on the path that I was on before, and would have been fulfilled with the work I was doing. There is absolutely no way that I would go back to work for a large firm today. I tried going back on a temporary basis about a year after I had left that world, and it felt like the walls were closing in on me. That job did not last long, and I have no plans to try that again.
I was particularly engaged by what R.A. Rudolph wrote, so much of what she described has either happened or is about to happen to us. It was useful to talk about many of these issues with my partner, especially possible problems with adding partners or merging with another firm. Made me laugh too. Best of luck to those of you heading out on your own, and may the economy stay relatively strong.
DCA, just briefly as I've gotta get busy with work, I was moving up at my old firm, and they offered me a plum new position when I announced I was leaving. But only in the last month or so have I realized that leaving the nest was, for me, a necessary part of my professional and personal development. I started there straight out of school, and in a way would never have escaped the image of a young green intern in that firm. Some days I picture myself going back to that firm and being a completely different employee/force than I was before I left. Just my own experience after being in one place for ten years.
Good comments, Sarah, re: the differences between working on parts of large and then an entire small project - I have experienced the same thing. It is in a way starting all over again on an entirely new learning path - but isn't that one of the things we all love about architecture, it's constantly new?
"isn't that one of the things we all love about architecture, it's constantly new?" Very true. This may also be why architects make less money on average than other professionals. There are significant costs associated with this perpetual learning curve.
So for all those rockin founding principals out there - when did you start dreaming about running your own practice?
When did you start networking to cultivate potential clients?
I learned something outright shocking today, and apparently this is true for most states, not just Indiana: the professional that stamps a set of drawings, even as a member of a corporation with several licensed architects, is personally liable for defects in the building design. Personally liable! Which means no corporate structure, llc, s-corp, whatever, can protect you from losing your personal assets in a claim made against your project resulting from defective design!
You most likely won't lose any assets held jointly between you and a spouse, but anything with only your name on it is open game.
This is because as a professional you are licensed as an individual, so no corporate entity can protect you.
This freaks me out. And this is why ANYONE who is an employee SHOULD NOT BE STAMPING DRAWINGS! Never, ever, ever. If your boss tries to make it seem like it is cool or a sign of your level of responsibility to stamp drawings, just say no.
I'm freaked out by this.
mine was accidental and unplanned. there was no infra structure to it and still not after nearly all those years. even though i worked for other people 3 times, i've always had my own projects on the side. one time i was published in new york times magazine to the amazement of my then boss, who would be very happy to be in the same issue. it was my first week at his office and i was treated like a design partner after that.
i would like to be a designer for a firm...but since i've been out of the firms since 2000, i'm looked down upon......but i have my freedom to do things...... even though i have to work hard today to eat tomorrow, i like what i have been doing over the years..... just need to find another market to tap into
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LB - surprised you didn't know this, but maybe I learned the extent of the liability in researching the benefits of incorporation. In short, as a licensed professional you always remain personally liable, no matter what business structure you have. Hence the necessity for errors & omissions insurance (or malpractice insurance for doctors, and I'm sure there's something for attorneys & accountants as well). Not that I have it - I have also learned through experience that the chance of being sued for working on a single family residential project is very slim...
What you gain from incorporation is supposed protection from creditors - bank loans, credit cards etc. in the name of the company, should the business fail.
But I would never stamp drawings as an employee, or for money when I wasn't actually in control of the project (which we have been asked to do a few times). However, the law in California also says that the person submitting/responsible for the drawings MUST stamp them if they are a licensed architect. I find it a bit strange, but if you are submitting for a project which doesn't require an architect (most single family residences & up to 4 units here), you still have to stamp the drawings.
alright rim joist, here is your foreshadowing my friend. it comes on the heels of a nice long two week trip basking in the warmth of the sun and people of chile. more on that later though.
as i mentioned above, i have been on my own for five years. things have been good. i've built a good client base. i have done some interesting work that has left my clients pleased and left me profitable. as anyone how has their own gig knows, doing it by yourself can be tough no matter how much you love it. you are always on. always working. always thinking about it, and there is never enough time for anything. no job is perfect, and these are the imperfections of running your own business. turning off is tough.
with that said, i'm finally getting some help. not just any ol' help either. it's my best friend. it's my wife.
she is a creative director for a large design firm in town, and she gave notice the other day. she will bring skills and assets to the studio that will well complement, and in many cases, exceed mine. we have worked with each other in the past. she has been a part of every important design and business decision that has effected my studio in the last five years. hell, once we've even got fired together. how many of you can say that you got fired with your wife/husband/SI. we actually met working together. granted is was only doing a group project together in college, um, 18 years ago.
we will be finally moving the business out of the house. some separation between personal and professional lives are needed. we are lucky enough to have a friend who owns a small building two blocks from our house. the space is about 1000sqft with views of the shipyards, lake, and city.
with all this excitement, i'd be lying if i said i were not nervous. i'm nervous as hell. all of our eggs are in one basket now. everything is on the line. no more paycheck coming from someone else every two weeks. no more health insurance being mainly paid by someone else. no more getting paid for vacation, holidays, and being sick.
if turning off was tough before, it certainly will be now, but i am so looking forward to it.
congrats, e. sounds like a great all-around situation, despite the anxiety it might bring for a while.
thx, mr. ward.
dear e,
that separation between personal and professional life is MUCH needed to make things balance out, i had a bad experience down the road of love/association
but your setup sounds fantastic, good luck and have a great 07
Wow, fascinating thread. Thanks for the insight.
My biggest question is how did you bring in that first paying client?
I know of several small firms around town that were basically started by an architect leaving an established firm with a client or two in-tow. Great for keeping that cash flow but not so great for your personal reputation in the local community.
Personally I love project management, contracts, billing, etc. Would I be better off starting my own firm with a good partner as a designer? Or should I just work up to principal where I'm at and take my big paycheck, company car and 5 weeks vacation?
my first paying client came from craigslist.
it worked, but not recommended...
if it makes you happy...go for it
silverlake? What? Do tell...did you put an ad out?
No, I just regularly scoured the adds where people where looking for a 'freelance architect'. I was miserable at the firm I was at so I desperately wanted a side gig, and figured this was the only route at the time.
Needless to say, the people who look for an architect on craigslist are not looking to spend a lot of money. Its fucking ridiculous what they're willing to spend. To make matters worse, you have hacks offering up drafting services for pennys on the dollar.
To finally land a job I had to undercut other people and work for a fraction of what I wanted. Its embarrassing what I worked at first... But it lead to real work.
Thank God I'm not bottom-feeding off of craigslist anymore!
RA, I just learned that Arizona is the same way - apparently if you are a registered architect and you prepare essentially anything for a project, you HAVE to stamp the drawings, whether one is required or not.
That's stringent. but I do see the point - if only it wasn't undercut by letting people build houses and small commercial without a stamp. That sort of legislation really could lead to people not wanting to get licensed!
Ridiculous. I'm starting to think anything that requires a building permit should require an architect's stamp.
Oh and aquapura, to your question: my first paying job was handed to me by my boss, who didn't want to deal with interior furnishings for the hosue of one of our consultant engineers because he was nervous about how it would affect his their relationahip (boss and engineer). And it was too small a job for the office to take on anyway. I guess my second paying job was a client who we had done public work for who called me privately and asked me to handle her kitchen renovation, which I did under the radar of the office.
Remember, everyone you meet is part of your network!
My first paying job came via the telephone whilst I was in the school's office someone called looking for an architect (or something like that) and I was the only on there at the time that fit the bill. Sat and had lunch with her, turned out to be the daughter of a famous musician (also a musician in her own right). The project was never built because i had to take up another job offer in another country and she wasn't willing to work with someone to finish it. Nice lady.
bump, because i am a dumbass.
I return to this thread time and again because it is so brilliant.
Here's another question that I haven't seen in other threads: What is the ideal amount of seed money that you had or wish you had prior to starting your own firm? $100,000 seems like a nice, round number, but I'm not sure if it's way too much or not enough.
When you break it down, it seems almost feasible to save $10,000 a year for the next 10 years.
And is it more or less expensive to buy-into an existing firm or to start your own firm?
Any thoughts?
dca, i've heard that at least a year's salary should be banked? although, like buying a home - and needing 10% - 20% down - i think it's a myth perpetuated by those not wanting competition. i mean how many of us are going to continue with the day job, and still take on work - hand raised?
the thing i am wondering is there something in my day job that i can transition to so that i am not at production mode, and still not be spent when i get home?
hrm... It sounds reasonable to bank one year's salary as a fall-back for the first year, as you'll probably not be profitable.
But what about other business expenses? (office space lease, computers, employees, insurance - everything that's been mentioned above.) I guess this is where the business plan comes in. liberty bell: how is yours coming? :)
my plan is to have that one years salary saved up. ok, what year will that be based on? this year or one in five years???? since I should be doubling my income between now and then- I'll aspire to the larger amount. half that dough will go towards keeping me afloat, the rest will be operating capital for rent, computers, marketing and paying the accountant.
I'd rather not try double dipping once I get a client- rather would spend 100% of my time on my own project then working for the man at that point.
Still, it will take a year or two after hours to get the full business plan worked up, website ready to go, and to start hunting for the first commission...
Why have a bank role saved up ????? Just start out of a bedroom with a couple clients and go, unless of course you plan to go out and spend a ton of money on a fancy smancy office space high priced equipment, staff and then marketing and wait for the work to come...... it doesn't happen like that.
First rule of business keep the overhaed costs low and pay yourself. But it helps to have at least six months work lined up to keep things afloat
for awhile and any time you think you're too busy to market and get the next job is exactly when you need to.
well,
i'm sort of out of work....wtf..... sorta got hit hard..... so, i'm looking for ANYTHING design/dwg related right now......
sucks
but it's part of the game i guess.....
but i have about 150 t-shirts in stock.....haha
b
Bump because this was a great thread and I want to hear about how things may have changed since 2008. I'm sitting in a cafe studying for the AREs pretending that reading this counts as studying. Work is slow at my firm right now so this seemed like a good time to start testing, but the main thing driving me is the idea of starting a firm in a couple of years. On a side note, any of you all doing small development on the side as well? It seems Luke a scary thing to start, but the control of your work and chance to make money are pretty big incentives.
You need large capital for development, otherwise you will just be doing it for the bank if you are hoping to take out a large loan. Having said that, this is my goal as well, to one day do my own development.
wow - it's great to re-read these. i must have still had my old nom de-plume back then...
we've been up and running for 8 years now. and, finally (finally) it feels like we're starting to turn a corner. we've finally learned which projects to chase, which to leave alone, what kinds of people will work best in the studio, how to talk to potential clients, network, etc.
so, we're... poised. and, i'll say for myself, i'm as equally excited/intrigued/entrenched in the design of our practice, as i am about the projects we're doing and the clients we're working with. just focusing on providing that framework and team chemistry...
would love to hear how some of the others are doing as well...
agree gregory.
we are doing larger work than when i first posted here which is nice. W are also working out the kind of office we want to be, which is probably more important than the work we do in some ways. still not settled by any means and that is frustrating at times. in this economy though, i am glad to still be around.
could those who replied state what type of work their firm takes on please? interiors, custom houses, renos, etc etc thanks
access,
I believe two of the four recent reply(ee)s; Will and Gregory have direct link to their firm's website if your interested...
I'm raising a kid and starting a practice. When I was unlicensed I had work while I was finishing the exams. I got my stamp and my previous clients, every one of them, won't commission me as a licensed architect. Part of my day is hugs with magic unicorns and the other part of the day I'm sweating bullets about whether I can pull this off.
Just re-reading this for some inspiration. Lots of good stuff in here.
" Any time you think you're too busy to market and get the next job is exactly when you need to."
I would love to hear how people are doing now.
Interesting how no one commented... perhaps a sign?
I can say that I left architecture to start my own business... selling art. Laugh and question it all you want, but so far it has been the best decision I have made in the last 10 years of my life. I tried to start my own thing in 2010 with a friend that was a licensed contractor in Colorado Springs. It was much harder to find work doing design/architecture, than it is to sell art.
I am still poor, but I am starting to make $2500-4k a show! It is a ton of work, more so than just sitting behind a desk and CADing it up all day. But it is so much more rewarding being in charge of my life instead of some idiot employer that just has their 'bottom line' on their mind all the time. Not only am I in charge of designing and creating my own art, but I also do all the web design, marketing, budgeting, packaging, traveling, networking, and selling. Speaking of networking, it was nonexistent in all my previous architecture jobs. Sure I went to a couple meetings here or there, and was the liaison on many aspects of the projects, but it was never true networking. Now when I sell art I talk directly with potential clients, and clients alike. I present them with a smaller piece of architecture (the art), knowing that perhaps sometime down the road they might want a larger one (a structure). I don't hold my breath on that, but I am networking a much tighter net than I ever was working for someone else in architecture.
All in all, I am sooooo happy not working for someone else, especially in architecture. It surely felt like there were no latters up after 2008, and I truly regret sticking with architecture so long after the downturn, only to find myself miserable and feeling like my life was the definition of insanity. I know there are few architects doing okay/great with their new endeavors post recession, but none are probably wasting their time on architnect.
^ Well it's hard to network when you have to call yourself Intern. Good for you DeTwan, now cheer up!
DeTwan, would you be comfortable sharing a link to your work on here? Would love to see it!
Sure.
https://www.etsy.com/shop/ArtFabrica?ref=hdr_shop_menu
Nice work. I like the strong geometric themes mixed with some street style.
Do you find Etsy to be a good marketplace? Is that generating most of your sales?
Congratulations.
No. Etsy is not the best market place for really any item over $100-120~.
Ppl want to see what they are getting for that kind of money, especially fine art.
I have made several sales so far, including one to a IA firm in Dallas. But Etsy is not my main source of income.
I travel to art fair/festivals throughout the country. For example I was just up in Minneapolis doing an art festival called "Uptown Art Fair", and recently in Baltimore for "Artscape".
It is definitely not easy money and it reminds me of gambling in a lot of ways, but that is where desperation will drive you.
If you wanted more information on how to apply for art shows I could go into more details.
I have a friend that let me in on this life hack. It is like anything though, the more front end ground work that is paved into the business reaps it rewards with time.
I was liberty bell back then.
When the recession hit in 2008 I panicked disproportionately to how hard we were hit. So I took on a teaching job for a small guaranteed monthly income. That led to me slowly extricating myself from my partner as I didn't want to be a burden on him. We remain best of friends to this day (we met in our first studio freshman year in undergrad - I can safely say he'll be my friend forever), but dissolved the partnership. I did my own small projects and taught for a couple years. One of the jobs was the Chop Stick at the Indianapolis Museum of Art by Visiondivision - they needed a local architect of record; through my networking with the local art scene I was able to take on that role. The COO of the Museum and I got along really well on that job, and when they needed an architect in their Facilities department I got the job. So now I'm not in traditional practice, I work in-house in a large institution.
I like the guaranteed direct deposit salary, the great benefits, and fun co-workers. But I miss self-employment every day.
I post this not just to tell my story but to point out how long and varied the career of an architect can be. I'm 47 now and feel like I could still do another major career change: back to self-employment, back to traditional practice, or outside of architecture altogether into some other field - construction, urban development, who knows? I'm very active locally in the urban/art/design scene, and even though I have a "real job" now the kind of volunteering and networking I did when I was self-employed is still critical. puddles posted on the first page about his financial career the famous phrase "ABC - always be closing". I'd say for architects we need to always be networking - absolutely everyone you ever meet can be related to the kind of work we do.
DeTwan,
I actually have a solo art/ design show coming up, I am producing a range of pieces at different prices and a larger room-filling pavilion type piece, so it is definitely a path I have researched. I was just curious because i had never considered etsy. Have you checked out Cafe.com for slightly larger commissions? I could definitely see you transitioning to larger and larger work until it is architectural scale.
At this point, it is just trying to have a more complete professional life, and for networking and fun, but I did start an LLC to cover the art sales, some small furniture stuff, and the occasional consulting. I am going to have revenue of about $4k this year, but it might slowly grow into a business alongside my normal professional practice. I am certainly envious of you, and everyone who is doing it on their own!
archanonymous, very cool. It would be interesting to see your work too! I have yet to actually do submissions on Café.org yet. A lot of other artist that I run into during my travels say that it might be a good platform for jumping to much bigger commissions. I plan on really sitting down this fall and producing new work, updating my website for the third or fourth time, and looking how to market myself further, I will definitely check it out.
As for your show, best of luck! Sounds like you could transition rather easy to the art world if wanted. You might be surprised how much money you can make on art, or perhaps you know.
My best show was in Baltimore so far, seem like the east coast really love funky non-traditional art, whereas the mid-west is more into traditional. It has been really interesting to learn about art and how it plays into region-ality, the zeitgeist of the time, psychology, and sociology, etc...I look forward by responding thur my art from what I have analyzed in this past year.
at the recent AIA convention, the small firm/solo practice received more attention than in the past. also, a handful of dedicated architects are putting their energy into blogs, podcasts and youtube channels that discuss the opportunities for the small firm. take a listen to entrearchitect, the business of architeture, small time/big firm and archispeak. good stuff.
So here's my update. After getting by on my own for about 5 years, 2008 hit me very hard. I had just moved into a bigger space, was looking to hire, and then slowly lost ALL of my work. I managed to scrape by pretty painlessly for about a year. But then as another year was passing, I was going to into major debt without any sign of things improving. I had maxed out all of my credit lines, and had borrowed all I could out of my parents meager savings. It was not a good place to be. And going back to work for an office just wasn't an option for me after working my ass off on my own for so many years (assuming I could even find a job). So I was doing odd carpentry jobs just to stave off bankruptcy and eviction. It was grim, but I maintained hope things would turn around. I was willing to gamble on my financial well-being for years to come with a massive debt. It was pretty risky and foolish, and something I certainly couldn't do again now that I'm married with a child.
I did manage to keep the doors open of my meager sole-proprietorship, and work did finally start to trickle back in. It was ironic for me that when a large project came in, I answered the call on top of a ladder, filthy from doing roofing. Now I'm finally on solid ground (knock on wood), and thankfully out of debt. I have a nice range of projects going, and I'm grateful clients are willing to pay me a nice fee for something I love to do. I've learned some very valuable lessons along the way, and I don't think I'd appreciate working on my own as much as I do without the path here being as winding and tortuous as its been.
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