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Final School Decisions and Why?

Ose Etomi

Hi guys,

 

Now that all the official decisions are in, it would be interesting to see what everyone's final school choices were. Why did you pick the school you did over the others you were accepted for. What did you like about the school or program you chose and what didn't you like about the ones you didn't go to. How much of a factor did tuition and money play in your decision etc Just anything really - have fun!!

 
Apr 17, 15 11:12 am
butdoesit

Based on the number of threads asking for life decisions, I doubt you will find anything interesting. Read the school flyers, they should cover most of the answers you were hoping for. Hope some of them will not be in your class come fall.

Apr 17, 15 5:12 pm  · 
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flatroof

 Attending the cheapest one I got into. I liked that they gave me a lot of money. I didn't like the others because they did not give me as much money. I like money.
 

Apr 18, 15 8:46 pm  · 
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l3wis

so then why are you going to grad school for architecture, flatroof?

Apr 19, 15 9:21 am  · 
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DeTwan

Budump-a-dump-ding-chaw!

Apr 19, 15 9:46 am  · 
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Ose Etomi

Not exactly the type of response I was hoping to get. It's never fun when negative people decide to ruin something for everyone else. @flatroof if money and nothing else was your driving factor then I doubt would get a positive experience from the school your going to @butdoesit school flyers are virtually useless, no flyer is going to tell you "come to our school where you will never feel valued"

The reason I started this thread is because I had a friend that was choosing between GSAPP and Parsons for Architecture and she chose Parsons. I thought she was crazy to pass up on GSAPP (they both offered her same amount of money). But she explained to me that she liked the unusual approach Parsons took for the programme and was more excited by what they were doing there than what they were doing at GSAPP.

These are the kind of insights you wouldn't get from a school's website

Apr 20, 15 6:51 am  · 
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chicagleggos

For me, it came down to GSD over GSAPP. People say it's the name but for me it is the facilities, breadth of work, large light-filled studio spaces, research opportunities, personable professors, amorphous curriculum with maneuverability between many disciplines, and of course, final award offered. As many will say, these reasons will all be extremely context-sensitive

Also, and perhaps not surprisingly, it was the little things that also affected my decision. GSAPP took three weeks to respond to a question I had, didn't appropriate many professors to talk in an informal one on one setting during the open house, were explicitly clear that they did not negotiate money (and I heard they retracted awards if you compared against other institutions), in the process of switching up the format of the curriculum this year (not such a little thing) and were generally less personable than I found GSD to be. Of course everyone is going to have their own opinion and while there were a myriad of other things they got right, it was these things that stuck out to me. And this is not to say that this was an easy choice - far from it. 

I doubt you could have gotten this bit from a school flyer which is basically just propaganda anyway and should always be taken with a grain of salt...

Apr 20, 15 9:59 am  · 
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archhopeful

My decision came down to GSD and Yale...and I chose Yale. It was hard to pass up GSD because of the name (I feel that most schools at Harvard have a way of making you feel like you're crazy if you turn them down), but with comparable aid offers, curriculum and opportunities, my decision came down to which school seemed like a more positive environment. I felt that students at Yale were overall happier given the more social environment at Yale. That's not to say that my friends at the GSD aren't happy to be there, but I think it might be a "I'm happy to have Harvard on my diploma" more than "I'm enjoying myself while at school." And while graduate school is strictly about learning and preparing for to enter the workforce, I truly think that you should always choose the options that will be more enjoyable, make you happier, and be an overall better place mentally. The difference in opportunities when graduating from either school is negligible, so it really was a matter of personal preference.

There were a few things that I specifically liked better about Yale:

1 - At the Open Houses Yale gave you the opportunity to sign up for appointments with any professor/dean you wanted...at the GSD they assigned you to a random professor in groups of 3-4 other prospective students, which were naturally less personable.

2 - At Yale there are so many wonderful opportunities to travel with your class as well as with your advanced studios completely included in your tuition. When I asked about that at the GSD, I got a really vague response like "yes the advanced studios travel...sometimes...it's hard because of the schedule so maybe over spring break...there's also a fee...but probably."

3 - I really like the idea of the weekly Thursday lecture and following reception at Yale, because it really does encourage students, professors and guests to come together and speak outside of the studio/classroom. I saw that this dynamic is creating collegial relationships among all the different parties. Because most students attend each weekly lecture, this set-up also forces students to expose themselves to lectures they may not otherwise have attended (more ideas = better dialogue in studios/classes = better design). At the GSD they were really trying to sell the fact that they DO NOT have one weekly lecture, but rather somewhere close to 100 lecture events throughout the semester. They argued that this was better than one lecture a week, because students can really hone their interests by attending specific events. I definitely see the value in that, but I think it furthers the sense of disjointed community that I felt at the GSD.

4 - Finally, the studio spaces at Yale just can't be beat. At the GSD, unless you're very lucky and get a desk at the end of a row, you are going to be squished in with another student directly behind you and at one small desk. Yale provides every student two large desks, back to back, to spread out all digital, drawing and modeling materials/tools. On top of this, they provide you with computers that are constantly being recycled and updated.

In the end, I would suggest being wary of choosing a school just because of the "name" (but of course in my decision this was objectively ridiculous...I don't know why people think GSD >>>>>> Yale). I'm glad that all of my professors, mentors, family and friends pushed me to choose the school that I felt was a better fit and that would make me happiest. So for future applicants, use the Open Houses (and time before/after) to really dig deep into the schools. Make a list of the qualities you find most important, and compare each school directly to the other from that list. Then stick to your decision, be happy, and get excited to begin school again!

Apr 20, 15 10:36 am  · 
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Alternative

Good call, archhopeful.

Apr 20, 15 3:25 pm  · 
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video_killed

I ended up deciding between GSAPP, Penn, and MIT. I'm going to GSAPP. Here's why: 

I went to the Penn and Columbia open houses and felt I was really able to get a good feel for the two schools that way. I didn't go to MIT's (I was accepted from the waitlist after the date had already passed), but had visited the department before and talked to students. I find it funny that people often throw around the advice of "look at the school's website, check out the student work they publish, read the school flyers". It's nothing but propaganda and is at best only a vague indication of what they are trying to promote and how they want others to view the school. And in terms of student work, I saw great examples and terrible examples at every school I visited. Of course, the terrible ones don't get featured in the shiny publications. I suppose if all the student work on the website is truly terrible, it should be a red flag that the school is not even worth considering in the first place. But there should also be other red flags to help you figure that out. Visiting the school and talking to people, lots of people, is the only way to really get to know a program. 

@chicagleggos Interestingly, when I was at the GSAPP open house, I felt I had many opportunities to chat one on one with multiple faculty members, lots of current students, and get all my questions answered in a very personal and candid way. But that's because I was aggressive. I'd been to a couple of open houses before that one, so I had a very clear idea of the types of questions and conversations that were important to me. The whole thing was very loosely scheduled, pretty much just Q&A and whatever tours you wanted to sign up for, then dropping in on studios. I feel that the open house very much reflected what I've heard is the culture of the school: they don't try to hold your hand. They're standoffish, pushed for time and resources, and can't cultivate your full potential as a special little snowflake. But as a result, the students I met were brilliantly resourceful. The opportunities exist to study and excel in anything you want there, but you have to have a really clear, self-guided vision of what that is and really fight to make it happen. This definitely isn't for everyone, but for me, it felt like a great intellectual fit. 

At the Penn open house, they started off by talking at us for 3 hours and showing us more propaganda. Then they fed us 3 elaborate meals and ferried us around scheduled events and panels for the rest of the day. I gather from current students that this also reflects somewhat the dogma of the school. The whole first year, their curriculum is designed to force feed that parametric ideology they're so known for down your throat. Current students will bristle and say that in the last two years, you can definitely opt for more traditional studios and avoid that stuff altogether. Might be true, but it's still obviously what the department as a whole and the new arch chair is really pushing. And there were people I saw there doing really great, thoughtful work. 

MIT was my dream school. I love that it's a much smaller program, all the students I met and talked to were absolutely brilliant. Intellectually seemed very rigorous. Media lab is really cool, and they're doing really cutting edge experimentation with materials there that I'm interested in and have been flat out told I won't be able to really pursue at Columbia because of the space limitations of being in New York. :( Everyone I've talked to has been really nice and helpful. I'm sure that as a student there you would get a lot more individualized attention since it's such an intimate program. 

So, I had a pretty clear ranking in my head. Now, money. 

Of these 3 schools, Penn gave me a lot of money (the most out of all my schools), MIT gave me nothing (and was an extra half a year), and Columbia gave me something in the middle. 

I did a spreadsheet for each of the 3 schools calculating exactly how much they would cost me to attend and used loan calculators to figure out how much debt I could afford to take on. I had my 3 programs ranked. MIT was just out of the question. But I decided that I preferred the program at Columbia enough that it was worth the difference in cost over Penn, and that it was a doable amount of debt, with TA stipends/part time jobs, summer internships, and a graduated repayment plan. 

Ultimately, I think it's a very personal decision, which is why I hate the advice that gets thrown out around here like "just go to the cheapest school" or "just go to your dream school, you can't put a price on your dreams!". I am going to neither my dream school, nor the school that gave me the most scholarship! I would urge people to look carefully at their finances and have a realistic idea of the numbers involved. And then make a personal decision based on what you feel is right for you. 

Oh, and don't listen to those fools on here telling you no one can afford the Ivies, so don't even bother applying. Some of the Ivies give great financial aid! And some of them give crap financial aid. And some state schools also give crap financial aid. In fact, all of the public schools I applied to ended up costing more than Penn. If you are concerned about scholarships, maybe do what I did, apply to a whole lot of schools (I did 9), and see where you get money. 

Apr 20, 15 3:31 pm  · 
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video_killed

Whoops, that ended up being a pretty involved explanation. 

tl;dr version: Absolutely critical to have a realistic idea of how much everything is going to cost since money is important. But it isn't everything. 

Also don't blindly follow the advice you get from archinect (including mine). Ultimately, it should be a personal decision since you're the one who has to live with it, so in that respect, I really agree with @archhopeful. 

Apr 20, 15 3:39 pm  · 
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chicagleggos

@video_killed, well said and great points

Apr 20, 15 4:08 pm  · 
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bmedi

@video_killed   Just curious, how does your financial aid at Penn and GSAPP compare to state schools when taking into consideration applying for in-state tuition after the first year?

Apr 20, 15 9:44 pm  · 
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video_killed

@bmedi The merit scholarship I got from Penn made it cheaper even when factoring in-state tuition after the first year at the state schools. The state schools I applied to gave me tiny merit scholarships. There's a certain amount of luck involved here, I think. Disclaimer: the state schools I was referring to were Berkeley, UCLA, and Michigan, all OoS. I have no idea how I would have done with a lower tier state school, or if I'd lived somewhere with a good in state program to apply to. So this will vary from person to person. 

Also, I was applying with very little arch or art background, and my portfolio was quite sparse, which I feel was a big factor. I've heard some schools just don't give out money to people without a strong arch background and portfolio to back it. 

GSAPP was a bit more expensive, as I mentioned. But not by much. Most of these programs ended up costing about the same - unless you get either a full ride, or no scholarship. 

Apr 21, 15 12:26 am  · 
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windupbird

I'm going to Michigan. 

I actually had the opposite experience as video_killed, just to show how unpredictable financial awards can be. I received a very generous offer from Michigan, such that my tuition costs each year are lower than in-state, and a laughable offer from Penn. I think a lot of it has to do with fit, which can be a hard thing to judge when applying, especially if you're not able to attend open houses in the fall. And other times I think it's just luck-- I received a full year tuition waiver from UIC and think their program would be a horrible fit. My background is in sculpture.

I think what everyone is getting at so far is that the feel of a school is an incredibly important factor, and something you can only judge in person. I would say that if you only have funds to visit schools in either the fall or spring, to save it for after you've been admitted. Also, hopefully this is obvious, but after you've been admitted don't visit schools you can't afford in the end. Math first.

When I visited Michigan I sort of had a "duh" moment where I realized that it was everything that I wrote about in my personal statement. They started off talking to us for a couple hours, but I thought it was an engaging presentation. Monica Ponce de Leon did her sales pitch, which emphasized the interdisciplinary nature of the program and that it was research oriented. Next four professors gave short presentations on their work and research, which were all very different. One thing that stuck with me was the statement that there were often architectural disagreements between the faculty and it feels important to be engaged in that kind of dialog. They also have a weekly lecture series, which is on Fridays and they called it "date night." In addition they do "expert in studio" workshops, which outside professionals come in for a short time to work with a specific studio group or give an open workshop to the school at large.

Of course their facilities are wonderful and the studios light-filled. The students seemed busy and focused, but not at all miserable, and their work looked great. My only complaint is that it's in Michigan... but geography is temporary.

In contrast, when I visited UIC I knew almost immediately that I did not want to be there. Where Michigan has a wide diversity of viewpoints, UIC seemed to push a single ideology very hard. And that particular aesthetic was not interesting to me at all. I probably could have gotten that from the school publications to be honest, but it's always good to make sure. 

So for me it was an easy choice in the end. 

Apr 21, 15 10:00 am  · 
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Ose Etomi

Sorry I was mia from this discussion for a while. but thank you all for responding! it's always interesting to see how people end up choosing where to go, and hopefully this will help out next year's applicants. @windupbird your insights on Michigan were quite interesting. I got accepted there but turned them down. Unfortunately I wasn't able to visit the school in person, but I watched all the presentations when they were uploaded online. I was blown away by there facilities and they have such an interesting take in the study of architecture. but ultimately one of the things that really made me worry about them was their huge class size. I felt like I would be lost on the shuffle, and even though they had amazing facilities it might be difficult to actually gain access to them due to the large volume of people all using the same things. and also I had a bit if a similar experience as chicagleggos with GSAPP. it seemed that every single person I spoke with over the phone had an attitude, didn't really want to help me out and was generally unpleasant to speak to. maybe they just don't like British people lol. and they took so long to get back to me on their decision, I was initially told I'd get a response by 6th of March. and when that didn't happen and I callled them, they told me they were running behind and it would be another week, a week later they said the same thing. they did that like 4 times and each time sounded irritated that I called to ask. So even though they were the only school to give me Advanced Placement I turned them down because I'd rather spend more time at a place where I'd feel a bit more valued

May 19, 15 8:07 am  · 
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windupbird

@purple hibiscus

I'm coming from a department in my undergrad with a tiny class size-- 13 graduating seniors-- and I've seen some of the downsides to that and thought it would be nice to get the opposite perspective at a big school. I'm also coming from a non-architecture background. This path at michigan has an extra year that just for us a non-arch people so I think it's a good way to establish a sense of community before being thrown into a pool of 100+ people. I think it would be much more intimidating otherwise.And the studio space it self actually felt pretty manageable to me, the desks all arranged into little studio class pods. To be honest I don't feel particularly pulled towards working with all their fabrication equipment in any in-depth way, so while it's great that it's there, it was never a deciding factor for me. Mostly it was the breadth of ideas and approaches present in their program that really drew me in.

where did you decide on in the end?

May 19, 15 6:54 pm  · 
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bmedi

@purple hibiscus

So you went to parsons, I'm guessing?

Jul 22, 15 10:56 pm  · 
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