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Interns are paid way too much.

StarchitectAlpha

Why is it the industry standard to make recent grads drafters? I feel as though it's the equivalent of a web design company hiring a graphic design graduate and saying, "Here, use that one coding course you took and learn how to code this website while you blow our budget, as soon as you learn coding efficiently then you can do the other career, no we don't higher coders to code, you're just an impatient millennial."

Yet that's what architecture firms do. Firms higher recent grads who took a few courses about CAD intended to have us be knowledgeable of how it works. I ruined so many budgets when I first graduated and still get amazed time to time when a CAD jockey shows me stuff I've been doing a@#-backwards. It's not a failure of schools, we went to school to study building construction and architecture not drafting. Yet firms will stick people who take 5x as long as someone who went and got a technical certificate in the program, on mindless tasks such placing floor plans with correct line weights, copying details, changing line weights on details or outdated drawings. What this means then is firms are paying people who expect a college level salary to do High School diploma level work that clients expect to pay as High School level work. Realizing this makes me realize something, I'M ACTUALLY PAID INCREDIBLY WELL. whoah never heard an intern say that right? Let's look, I probably spend 10 minutes to sketch up a stucco flashing detail but then 50 minutes to draw it, adjust lineweights, annotate and set up on sheet. (Yes I know some of you can do it faster but thats my point, higher a DRAFTER why some one who never studied or had any interest in technical drawings) So that means that on average 20% of my time is spent actually doing architecture things and 80% is spent on CAD.  Which means my 4 years experience is actually only about 9 months of experience at being an architect. 

So my salary is not a pathetic $55,000 for a professional degree and 4 years experience in my targeted industry, It's actually an awesome $55,000 starting position for less an a year experience. Because, no, you don't learn by doing sheet set up, you learn by being given a problem you don't know how to solve and being told you're accountable if its wrong.  

My main point is why not task recent grads with things we usually are told we are too dumb to do that take up senior level positions time. Like researching permit requirements, checking that the drafter is doing the work correctly, these are things that I'm finally allowed to do now. Apparently, because I've mindlessly changed enough line-weights to firm standards, I am magically more capable of doing these things I already went to school for. So instead of having a senior position drawing every single detail, the intern stabs at it, blocks it out and the senior architect can make changes. The firm would now be paying that intern 20$/hr to do things it was having a $50/hr guy do. Likewise the drafter is doing things for $15/hr what the firm was having an intern do for $20/hr. You are freeing up your senior guys to do more which means you can offer more services that firms used to not offer, instead of Architects increasingly getting pigeon holed as drafters, work that clients understandably look at as "all the same." They care about accuracy, budgets and time.  Maybe we could start taking back control of projects by now offering more advanced services beyond just a CD packet,  things such as construction management and Scheduling and Estimating. No need to pursue that pretty unattainable dream of architect as developer. 

Yet, I'm sure I'm going to be told that I don't know what I'm talking about. Well why then do most big box retailers who have in house construction, structure that department in this way?

Also I ran rendering company on the side my first year out of college, simultaneously while, my firm only let me organize the library, copy details from other projects or hand drafted ones, change lineweights from outdated projects ect. because "I just didn't have enough experience" Yet clearly was able to handle client interactions and oversight.. I had clients from medical extrusion companies, to solar contractors to developers. I would outsource the modeling on Odesk and check it myself, then spend an hour or 2 to photoshop. Fees were low maybe $300-$500 

Modeling would take anywhere from 15-25 hrs, So if I followed most firm's business model and did it myself it would look like this:

25 hrs (modeling) + 2 hrs (rendering) + 2 hrs (client coordination) = 29 hrs

$300/29 ~ 10$/hr

Where as - 

Outsourced modeler @ 8$/hr = 200$ 

4 hours for me = 25$/hr (I've now freed myself up for additional work or marketing myself and make more per hour)

I feel as though if recent grads are used to their correct abilities, firms can expand services and also become more profitable while paying everyone more. Now please tell me why I'm wrong so I don't feel like a complete scam when I set up a bunch of demo, demo rcp, new floor, electrical floor plans tomorrow for $25/hr and 5x as long as a CAD jockey. (I do use REVIT as well, CAD just seems to suck the soul out of me more and was a better target)

 
Feb 17, 15 11:55 pm
Carrera

Not sure I get all the detail, but there was a lot less frustration when there were drafting rooms. A typical small firm consisted of 2 licensed partners, 1 newly licensed young guy and 4-5 draftsmen from trade schools.... drawing was a craft. Then they closed the trade schools and everyone went off to college and CAD was invented - now anybody can draw. Question is who is going to do this stuff? Not sure what to do with new graduates. Not sure about your list of preferred responsibilities. While you may be an exception most I've met don't know what a wall tie is.... this thing we do is a learn-as-you go from-the-bottom-up kind of thing. The frustration is palatable with no solution in sight.

Feb 18, 15 12:41 am  · 
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StarchitectAlpha

But that's my point, I learned what a wall tie was from  working outside for habitat for humanity and class lectures. Most of the stuff I draw I don't really fathom what it is until I go to a job site and my boss points out a detail I drew and I say "of course" while in my head I'm thinking, "ohhhh thats what that squiggle was."

Feb 18, 15 1:10 am  · 
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SpatialSojourner

I feel it is hard to generalize what an "intern" does... it varies so much firm to firm.  My first firm was very small (only Principals and interns) and I was responsible for everything from CDs to coordinating with the structural engineer to being involved with meetings with the client to exclusively doing the three initial schematic design options and then the firm principal would edit them to present to clients to the business aspects of running a firm. BUTTTTT, I do know interns at other firms who are kept like veal (like you describe). 

 I don't understand where you are coming from with the CAD/BIM thing, I feel after my first 6-8 months, I could CAD/BIM/3D model with the best of them - going so far as getting my work done and having extra time to be the behind-the-scenes assistance to the other interns in the office.  I feel a lot of people don't look at their process critically enough and work to optimize it (I continuously ask myself, "how can I do this faster the next time?").  Even more important than that, I learned how buildings are put together by drawing up wall sections, plans, sections, ect.  I don't prefer the drafting role but beyond the monotony there are the opportunities to fine tune the details of a project, which innately happens when drafting up something.  

Feb 18, 15 7:31 am  · 
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SpatialSojourner

Now that I've changed firms (still a small firm) and now I haven't done any CA/client meetings/site visits/converse with consultants - I agree with you that I feel more drafter/renderer/presentation maker/completely kept behind the scenes person - it is frustrating.  I used to go to site visits and know the actual dimensions of spaces and what was a little funky with the actual built from our plans.  I don't think a drafter would be a good replacement still because arch grads offer more than strictly drafting.  I think principals are focused on, "it's more important for the bottom line to have the intern drafting while I do this site visit/client meeting since we don't need two people." and don't think about it as development for their interns.  

Feb 18, 15 7:48 am  · 
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DeTwan

I noticed that after 2008 many smaller firms that were able to ride out the storm became increasingly fearful of losing clients to even entry level staff members. No more site visits where you could run into the GC. No more meeting with the client without the big boss man in the room... the bigger more established firms are not as scared. It is really driven by fear.

To the OP, it sounds like you could be replaced quite easily. If it were me I'd keep my mouth shut. You probably get paid more than what you are worth, and there are a number(s) of high qualified individuals willing to knock you off the stool you decided the stand upon and rant (against yourself).

Feb 18, 15 8:49 am  · 
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CAD monkeys are the salve laborers of architecture.

You have to learn and maintain adeptness at a ridiculously arcane and completely artificial skill that has no parallel in the real world, without body memory, and be responsible for things you don't understand.

I'm trying to think of a good metaphor for this but am coming up empty. Maybe government service? Nope, no responsibility.

Is drawing dead?

Feb 18, 15 9:08 am  · 
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Non Sequitur

Funny, I can CAD 5x faster than the CAD jockey the OP describes and I knew very well what a wall tie was before I finished undergrad. Everyone's mileage does vary.

I'm with DeTwan above. Sounds like you have a good thing going on. Enjoy it while it lasts but from where I see things, I'd rather have someone who can change line weights as well as do code review.

Feb 18, 15 9:16 am  · 
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anonitect

People get hired, no highered.

Considering that architects communicate their ideas through drawing sets, it only makes sense for architects to know how to draft. You should consider yourself lucky that you are working for a firm that is willing to make the investment in training you to do your job competently. And, if you don't know what that squiggle is, ask. 

Feb 18, 15 9:45 am  · 
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StarchitectAlpha

If it's so important for us to know how to draft why do most senior architects not even know how to print from a drafting program? Regardless, the main point is that firms are using highly skilled highly payed individuals to do low payed work. It's no wonder architecture firms are notorious for being low payed and over budget when a PM is also a drafting work horse on a project.  

Feb 18, 15 10:16 am  · 
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JLC-1

^so, what do you think you can do that is suited for your skills and pay level?

Feb 18, 15 10:45 am  · 
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Non Sequitur

Ah, I get it. Just another graduate upset that the working world is not undergrad studio. StarchitectAlpha, your generalizations are not representative of the norm.

Feb 18, 15 10:56 am  · 
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chigurh

+anonitect 

to the OP, I kinda read through your long and drawn out dribble, what exactly is your point? You don't want to draft?  You think a principal architect is going to trust an intern doing zoning code research on a project?  Oh yea, let design a 6 story mixed use project cause some intern with no experience says they looked it up... ha!

My advice is that everything you are doing is helping you to become an architect, just keep your fucking head down and do the work that is assigned to you.  If you want to go the corporate route, it probably is not as important to learn everything in a practice since you can specialize in a firm like that, but if you ever plan to run your own practice or work in a smaller boutique setting, everybody in the firm does everything, including drafting, even the principal from time to time.  

Do your work son! 

Feb 18, 15 11:30 am  · 
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SneakyPete

I think it's great that you work in an office which separates people into the "Design" and "Drafting" sides of things. This way you have the benefit of "Designers" who don't know fuck all about the realities of construction and "Drafters" who don't get to use their college degrees.

Feb 18, 15 11:49 am  · 
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StarchitectAlpha

So how does setting up line weights make an intern more capable of doing zoning research. What is wrong with handing that intern that task of finding and printing out what he found for the head architect to review his findings? My first job I did permit research for our roll-out account. Took me a couple times to get it down but doing it at my intern billing rate gave us additional hours to send over to CD budget.

Feb 18, 15 12:14 pm  · 
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natematt

I feel after my first 6-8 months, I could CAD/BIM/3D model with the best of them
This. I don't think that there is as much separation in drafting skill between "drafters" and arch grads. After half a year you should be able to at least keep pace, and on tasks that aren't mindless drafting like setting up sheets, you should create a valuable feedback loop.

This way you have the benefit of "Designers" who don't know fuck all about the realities of construction and "Drafters" who don't get to use their college degrees.

I know people in two firms that have this structure, and I think this criticism captures the results pretty well.

If it's so important for us to know how to draft why do most senior architects not even know how to print from a drafting program?
I actually see more and more people with 10-15 years experience using Revit/Cad.

Feb 18, 15 12:16 pm  · 
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SneakyPete

Revit is great for one reason above all others: it requires a knowledge of how buildings are built to get anything done. Most criticisms I hear of it (beyond the typical whining about interface and such) come from not being able to cheat in order to show the high priest the results that are desired yet are not possible.

Feb 18, 15 12:25 pm  · 
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-A billing rate of $25 is absurd.  If you are extrapolating that from salary, multipy by 3, at least.

-++ what anonitect said

Feb 18, 15 12:44 pm  · 
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StarchitectAlpha

Okay everyone I apologize, I should shut up and keep my head down and draft, architecture firms are the most efficient business entities in the world and everything is the contractor/developers fault because they don't value design.

Feb 18, 15 1:00 pm  · 
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JLC-1

^ do you talk to real people about your issues?

Feb 18, 15 1:16 pm  · 
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Carrera

There is no training to be a mother or a father and no real training to learn how to manage an architectural practice. Never got along with mom or dad, never understood they’re thinking, same applies to most firm principals. Your thoughts are valid, no need to keep your head down, just realize that “mom & dad” are doing the best they can with what they have and as you grow up you’ll realize that “mom & dad” were not as bad as you thought.

Feb 18, 15 1:18 pm  · 
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chigurh

You should be a partner in the firm you are working for, obviously, you are a business savant, you know more about office organization, CAD/BIM, project management than anybody on the planet.  Demand partnership or leave.  Ultimatum is the only way to go.   

Feb 18, 15 1:26 pm  · 
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natematt

I don't think the OP is entirely off though. I see what he's saying when it comes to some things. I do think that most of the large projects I work on would benefit financially from having one or two people who are "just drafters." I think it is worth pointing out though that when it comes to people who are experts on Revit, almost none of them are "just drafters." They are all BIM managers, or specialists, and they tend to actually make more money than the Arch people... So there is that.

Feb 18, 15 1:41 pm  · 
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curtkram

why do we have to go to the extremes, such as " I should shut up and keep my head down and draft," or "You should be a partner in the firm you are working for"

why not find the happy middle ground where real-life tends to be?

Feb 18, 15 1:55 pm  · 
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SneakyPete

Good call, curt.

I think breaking down the assumptions that are foisted upon those interested in technology (both building and documentation/modeling) would be a good place to start. Simply because folks see a need for and have an interest in learning systems and software shouldn't relegate them to the "production" end of the process, but it usually does.

Feb 18, 15 2:04 pm  · 
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SneakyPete

Also OP, when you start out with a clickbait bullshit title, don't pretend to be surprised when people tell you to fuck off.

Feb 18, 15 2:06 pm  · 
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x intern

All the mindless work you are so worried about is to let you learn how the firm wants things and gives you time to look at multiple projects in an accelerated pace.  If your mindlessly cadding you're doing it wrong.  You should be looking at each plan, elevation, section and detail and understanding what you are seeing.  Letting an untried intern loose on a project can just as likely result in having a gremlin loose in your project as turn out well.  You have to understand someone has to check almost everything an intern does or pay the price down the road with change orders and screw ups.  (learned this one the hard way, just because they look like they know what they are doing doesn't mean they do) 

Feb 18, 15 3:10 pm  · 
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go do it

You don't learn a trade in school you learn it on the job.

Feb 18, 15 3:55 pm  · 
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Wilma Buttfit

This is why every aspiring architect needs to spend about 3 whole days in an architecture firm before committing to the profession - the job is mostly just CAD work. >: c (

Feb 18, 15 6:37 pm  · 
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,,,,

Unless you are the design principle you are a cad-monkey. Get over it and get your license and start your own firm.

Feb 18, 15 7:02 pm  · 
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DeTwan

^Basically what that guy just said...

Feb 18, 15 9:53 pm  · 
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bowling_ball

So much frustration in here!  Everyone breathe....

The OP isn't off-base. Yes, we all have to start near the bottom, but the bottom for an intern and a tech shouldn't be the same. Architects, for the most part, are terrible businesspeople.  I went into my M.Arch not wanting to be a tech or a drafter, but an architect. Not the same thing.

I'm an intern with about 4 years in a firm. I'm currently project architect (sorry, designer) leading 4 projects worth nearly $70M. I do code review, liaise with AHJ, meet clients and lead meetings, do site visits, redline drawings for the techs, etc., but I personally don't do any CAD drawing beyond schematic phase.

This isn't some crazy idea. It's actually how just about every other type of business is run. 

Feb 18, 15 11:00 pm  · 
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awaiting_deletion

OP - it all comes down to the type of work you are ultimately interested in.

you want to do schematic design all day like school, go for it if you can get the work, because lord knows a kid out school can make the same decisions someone with 50 years of experience can.

fortunately on very large projects there are soo many people involved that stupidity and inexperience can be minimized - most the time. 

--

I like to do every last bit in my details because every line means something in reality and I am certain no draftsmen and many experienced architects don't care enough or want to spend that much time making what amount to Shop Drawings in the Design Development phase. 

true story - at one firm one time, it was me, a senior guy, and the principal (billable at about $800/hr total) sketching in pencil on grid paper 1:1 scale to figure out what type of stone joints were best for the situation.  This went on for two hours one day and on and off daily for a few weeks.  The client paid for it NO problem, she understood quality and that if the architects didn't put the entire package together in the format of 'drafted drawings' NO ONE would.  When you do a certain level of high-end work - the shop drawings often look like jokes compared to the architects drawings.  have another job, where my drawings are telling the 'expert' fabricator how to build his own product - because they themselves don't really know - especially when it isn't standard crap.

unfortunately the world can give a fuck about quality and will rather pay some architect who barely knows how to draw to note out their drawings and hope the manufacturer/vendor who does only one aspect of the project to somehow figure it out...let's just hope all the parts come together - wait, can we get a consultant for that? oh that would be a Master Builder who is also a Master Draftsmen, they used to be called Architects.

Feb 18, 15 11:32 pm  · 
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bowling_ball

Olaf, the situation you describe isn't entirely unusual and at the end of the day, doesn't preclude ending with everybody going back to their desks to do their respective work to get that work built. In this case, the tech would be the one drafting it all, not your boss, while you'd do some other task. That's all the OP is saying, at least in my interpretation.

Feb 19, 15 1:27 am  · 
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StarchitectAlpha

For clarification I'm not talking about never drafting again and doing fun doodles all day. I'm talking about for example this afternoon at work, two project managers and I spent an hour trying to figure out what the heck we did to mess up our base drawing. We never figured it out because we are architects not computer techs. Or when I come across a random glitch I have to go hunt the web for an hour to find the solution. Why at most firms is it standard to have your arch. interns be your CAD/BIM techs. People who have no background in or interest in becoming computer techs. One  PM at my firm has been pretty down on himself lately because he comes from an in house construction department for a major retailer and he is struggling with now being 80% drafter 20% PM whereas at his old job his PM skills were used for being a PM. I don't think his value as a PM should be lower because he's not a CAD wizard yet most firms think this way. 

Feb 19, 15 1:29 am  · 
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Wilma Buttfit

related convo - paraprofessionals in arch

Feb 19, 15 5:35 am  · 
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Lscapeisaverb

Points and questions to ponder.

1-You are learning to become a licensed professional. Is it ok to pay someone who will deal with legal liability for the "rest of their lives" as if they are just service technicians? How could you afford the exam or idp?

2- This is a profession in which a predominant amount of the work (but not all) is expressed in drawings supported by written technical documents. Why would would you look at the fundamental means of expression in your chosen practice as a burden? 

Incedentally, there are people who would love to take this burden off your hands and tell you how to do things properly. Consultants love it when architects just want to do their drafting and contractors love to tell you the better way to build the project. 

3- cheesy as it may sound, an intern is an investment in the future of an office. Meaning the skills you learn in school are ones they either need, want, or are curious about. Most offices don't have time or to drop everything to train everyone in the latest thing. Just look at the transition into BIM nationally/internationally. 

Also bear in mind as you get older, you loose interest in the latest and favor what you are really good at (why learn the hot new photometric renderer because this one manages instancing better that the other when you are happy with the former). Put another way, consider the long curve of practice and drafting. Before BIM there was CAD. Before CAD the were technical pens (that's only 20/30 years). Before tech pens there were ruling pens. The point being, at each point in time there was a transition in tech, there was a decision made by someone about how they complete work. The interesting part is that the learning curve is getting steeper as time moves on. I shudder to think of what will make a person well versed in Revit it throw up their hands and say "screw this, I'm done keeping up."

What are the things you've already cast aside as irrelevant to the way you work already?

There was more, but it's early and I'm done fighting this snazzy browser thing. I need to take my geritol.

Feb 19, 15 7:50 am  · 
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awaiting_deletion

Another way to think of it based on the OP'S last post and bowling - balls post - In general most would say you should know the trade before you manage it. The trade isn't hand drafting anymore it's computer drafting /BIM which requires an ass load more 'knowledge' than hand drafting, enough to require high paid specialists sometimes which is much different than low paid technicians. If you don't know the time and effort it takes to do a task then how can you manage the fundamentals of the project, right? ........The other version though is management does not need to know every last detail of how the tradesmen do their jobs and sometimes it's better they don't. Some smarter architects I know and what I would done now based on the OP'S post above, who cares where it got messed up, think about who it affects and what calls can be made and how to smooth it out going forward. This decision is strictly management and is progressive since it doesn't get bogged down in the trades technical aspect.......getting bogged down in trade decisions is often the downfall of very talented architects or the key to their success..........

Feb 19, 15 8:03 am  · 
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^ The knowledge of building construction is the same whether you produce it with CAD or hand draw it. The difference is in the training necessary to operate CAD systems and the effect of that on the process. 

Feb 19, 15 9:32 am  · 
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Lscapeisaverb

What Miles said. 

Feb 19, 15 9:37 am  · 
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I'm starting to get the feeling the OP is upset the don't know enough about Revit to do their job correctly. Instead of learning the tools to get the job done, they want to change their job description so they don't have to bother with it anymore.

Learn to use your tools. No one is going to sharpen your pencil for you.

On the other hand, is there a better way to run an architecture firm. Probably, go talk to the principal and convince them to change. We can all agree with you but it won't change your situation. Only you can do that. Good luck. Post an update when you've figured it all out.
Feb 19, 15 10:16 am  · 
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Carrera

I've talked about this before, not against CAD, just against the layer upon layer of add-ons, updates and reiterations. Just learning CAD and I like it but I spend a lot of time on YouTube.... don't remember driving to the library to figure out how to roll my lead holder over a straightedge. Wonder how much time is expended on this sort of thing. Also have learned that when I go off and build something then come back to draw I forget how to do some things (not because I'm old:).... seems the most efficient thing is to keep someone on CAD a full 40. We haven't changed the way we build buildings in centuries but we change the way we draw them every few years. With Miles, it should be more about what we draw and less about how we draw.

Feb 19, 15 10:57 am  · 
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I don't know if you said the size of your office, but I think that plays into it a lot.  The complaints, while valid to a certain extent, tend to skew towards a large firm mentality, where there is buying power and enough work to keep a PM 100% engaged in PM work, etc....  The smaller the firm gets, the fewer people there are to do the job, and the job isn't demonstrably different, just with fewer people to do it.  To build a building, you need CDs.  Those have to be produced.  Sometimes the job is production, sometimes it's CA, PM, etc....  You have enough people, you can divide for efficiencies.  If you don't, you do the best you can.  

Plus, think how far ahead you will be on all the tech when you open your own office, and you're doing everything.

Feb 19, 15 11:46 am  · 
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curtkram

We haven't changed the way we build buildings in centuries

http://www.amazon.com/Steel-Construction-Manual-13th-Edition/dp/156424055X

first published in 1927.  we've really come a long ways in the last century. seriously.  a lot has changed.  like, a significant amount of how buildings go together is different. 

there were still outhouses 100 years ago.  that's just not how it works anymore. from the 1933 worlds fair:

"One of the lessons to be drawn from the amoebic dysentery outbreak ... is that plumbing demands the very best, painstaking effort that thoroughly qualified, certified plumbers can give in every building, and especially where the systems are complicated and extensive, and where large numbers of people may be affected by contamination of water."

just saying.  it's good to keep up on technological innovations.  it's bad to build buildings the way they were built 100 years ago.

Feb 19, 15 11:55 am  · 
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StarchitectAlpha

Okay so I definitely kicked the hornets nest on this one, so I apologize if I flared some tempers. Anyway, what I'm getting out of this is that I will continue to not look at YouTube videos of Revit post work hours but instead continue my night classes in construction management, real estate finance ect. Things that will allow me to get skills in running my own firm or branching off into another career, because what I'm getting here really does sum up the mentality of the profession. The three main arguments  that keep getting brought up are your lazy do your job, employees can't be trusted so micromanagement is the key to success and this is how it's been done and shall always be done. So if I do follow that advice I will most surely end up like the 38-45 year old PM's I've seen throughout my career who are so imcredibly militant against Revit not because it's a bad program but because deep down they realize 80% of their 20 years of experience is in CAD and when their firm switches their value drops off immensely.

Feb 19, 15 12:25 pm  · 
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SneakyPete

Well considered, educated folks abound. They are the ones who can be trusted to design something with realistic limits and expectations and then trust the rest of their (more technically minded) team to do their jobs and not micromanage.

 

Unfortunately this two-tier system is easily co-opted by ignorant primadonnas who never learned how a building works, couldn't give a fuck, and get their design sensibilities from the latest lunch and learns and trade publications (and awards). These are the ones who draw 300' cantilevers and then complain when the "technical folks" can't figure it out.

 

This is why I hate the tiered system. It breeds contempt, finger pointing, and bad blood.

Feb 19, 15 12:30 pm  · 
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snooker-doodle-dandy

Carrera,

As you know by now having spent many years in this crazy profession: " Shit in is Shit Out."

This follows the complete project,  programing, understanding of budget, design development, construction documents, coordination with consultants, shop drawing review, construction and  progression of the project in a timely manner.

No matter where your at in a project you have to be aware of where the project is headed. It is not something which is grasp all at one time, but something which comes with time.

Feb 19, 15 12:33 pm  · 
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SneakyPete
Carrera

Curt, well maybe 100 years... I see all the wonder but it's still just stacking shit until you get to the top, its still concrete, unit masonry, steel frame and glass.... stick by stick, block by block. They invented gravity plumbing 100 years ago (+/-) but how has that changed? See all the gizmo but its principally the same.

Feb 19, 15 1:06 pm  · 
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StarchitectAlpha

I think one thing everyone thinks I'm trying to say is that my boss should elevate me out of drafting into a better position. In my current firm I serve as a quasi-drafter /quasi PM assistant to 3 PM's and the head architect. I would recommend replacing me with a full time tech drafter (why I'm not running off to tell my boss my plans) and thus freeing up his and the PM's time to offer higher level services for the firm and better quality control on drawings if work load expands thrn bring a new grad to act as a PM assistant they don't need to be a cad tech before that. 

Feb 19, 15 2:36 pm  · 
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StarchitectAlpha - I think you're missing (or willfully ignoring) some basic historical facts. You are correct that even as late as the 1960s and early 1970s many firms employed "drafters" for production and only had licensed (or graduate) architects doing the bulk of design. Back then, good drafters were highly respected and typically well paid .

However, there was a profound shift in professional demographics, starting in the late-60s and early-70s. All of a sudden it became cool to be an architect. There was a tremendous expansion among architectural degree programs and the number of graduate architects exploded. Simultaneously, the number of people wanting to pursue careers as drafters began to diminish, with those people otherwise so inclined probably going to architecture school.

As this happened firms began to realize they could hire graduate architects -- who supposedly had some sense of design often lacking within the drafter population -- and use them for the bulk of production work. Sure, the internal dynamics (and training requirements) of the studio changed. But, the large supply of architectural graduates also drove down wages, seeming to make this new approach economically viable.

Many firms saw this trend (perhaps mistakenly) as a way to improve the overall process while simultaneously developing a corp of broadly experienced architects. As this trend continued, the supply of knowledgeable architectural drafters withered even further. And, the economic reality of "too many architects chasing too few jobs"  continued -- and that reality is both inescapable today and unlikely to change anytime soon.

While I appreciate the frustrations you express concerning labor utilization in the profession, I don't think it's either reasonable or practical to expect those utilization patterns to change in the foreseeable future. Architectural graduates want jobs (and often are willing to work for abysmally low - or no - wages)

IMO, this is simple Economics 101 at work. I don't place a moral judgement on that one way or another.

Feb 19, 15 2:44 pm  · 
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